4 ms·

I see this problem currently coming to a head in my area (Coeur d'Alene, ID) We have long been a destination area for people looking to escape the cities but i

by Ccecil 6y ago

I see this problem currently coming to a head in my area (Coeur d'Alene, ID) We have long been a destination area for people looking to escape the cities but in the last year we have had 33-50% increase in housing prices (limited inventory seems to be the driving factor coupled with the urban flight). Rental prices are to the point where even apartments are out of range for the average person who lives here. If you rent they want your income to be 3x your rent price. So currently if you are a single individual looking to rent that means you need to earn ~$36k/year to be eligible (also, a clean criminal and financial record as well). Issue is the minimum wage is $7.25/hr still...and if you work foodservice they can pay you ~$3.50/hr because your tips offset it. We have a steady influx of people buying houses at over the already inflated asking cost because it "seems cheap" to them compared to where they live. What they do not realize is that if they lose their remote job (or if their pay is scaled to the region) they will have little/no chance of finding employment locally which will pay the amount they need to simply "live". About 4 years ago University of Idaho released a study saying that 22% of the people living in this town cannot afford to do so...I wonder what that rate is now. I am starting so see more and more people sleeping in cars parked near the recreational areas and parking lots. Tons of multi family houses. Things are going to get bad really soon. I can't speak for every area of the country...but in our case I suspect a large part of this is the waves of real estate investors who came through in the last couple years to buy up homes and are leaving them vacant (or vacation rentals). It seems like inventory is being artificially limited. To the people investing it is a win-win...either the house is vacant and you make a ton of money...or it gets rented as an airbnb for $3k/mo and they make even more. I suspect if they were to impose a 2x property tax on any property vacant for more than 6mos or vacation rentals it would very quickly effect the issues we are facing...but being as this town was structured by the tourism/real estate industry I do not see much hope. https://cdapress.com/news/2021/feb/22/housing-market-heats-north-idaho/ https://cdapress.com/news/2021/feb/22/housing-market-heats-n...

AmVess 6y ago
It is bad in a lot of places. A starter home less than 10 years ago was $75k. Now it is $300k without an increase in wages for people starting out or working less technical jobs. The housing pinch has already hit Twin Falls if you can believe that. One would have to move all the way to Idaho falls to know what it was like in the Boise area 10 years ago.
- Ccecil 6y ago
  Idaho in general is getting hit hard. Montana will be next once things like Starlink take off. The primary limitation to living out in the middle of nowhere has been commute to high paying jobs. I wonder how many people would move to Coeur d'Alene if they would have made the lake a superfund site...like they did the Silver Valley which drains into it. The whole bottom of the lake is heavy metal contaminated...but they don't show you that in the real estate ads. :)
- nbardy 6y ago
  Without an increase in wages. And economic instability causing lost jobs, as well as increasing rip stripping away earning power. I make a lot of money as a software engineer and I don't think I'll get a home until I'm 45.
closeparen 6y ago
What is going on with your local economy such that you can equate "average person" and "minimum wage" like this?
- RIMR 6y ago
  Out of the 155.75 Million working Americans, 80.4 million make minimum wage. That's 51.6% (a majority) of workers making minimum wage. So yeah.
  - SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
    That isn't true. In 2017, 80.4 million Americans were paid hourly, and out of those only 1.8 million made minimum wage or below. (https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm# https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm#) More generally, I'd encourage you to question the mental model that made this sound like a potentially true claim in the first case. An economy where most people are paid minimum wage would be incredibly different than the one we actually have.
  - closeparen 6y ago
    Per BLS, 80.4 million workers make an hourly wage, with 1.8 million at or below at the federal minimum. [0] It is kind of fascinating that people have such wildly different ideas about what the objective facts are, and how that must flow downstream into their worldviews and politics. Between 51.6% and 2.3% is not a small difference! Those are very different worlds we could be living in! [0] https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm#:~:text=The%20percentage%20of%20hourly%20paid,collected%20on%20a%20regular%20basis https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm#....
    - A4ET8a8uTh0 6y ago
      It is fascinating and horrifying at the same time. On the one hand, I am hoping the person was simply quoting something they heard in a rant online. On the other hand, I am hoping it is just a case of misreading available BLS data. Neither is exactly ideal and both paint rather sad picture of how we interpret reality.

by Ccecil 6y ago

AmVess 6y ago

It is bad in a lot of places. A starter home less than 10 years ago was $75k. Now it is $300k without an increase in wages for people starting out or working less technical jobs. The housing pinch has already hit Twin Falls if you can believe that. One would have to move all the way to Idaho falls to know what it was like in the Boise area 10 years ago.

Ccecil 6y ago
Idaho in general is getting hit hard. Montana will be next once things like Starlink take off. The primary limitation to living out in the middle of nowhere has been commute to high paying jobs. I wonder how many people would move to Coeur d'Alene if they would have made the lake a superfund site...like they did the Silver Valley which drains into it. The whole bottom of the lake is heavy metal contaminated...but they don't show you that in the real estate ads. :)
nbardy 6y ago
Without an increase in wages. And economic instability causing lost jobs, as well as increasing rip stripping away earning power. I make a lot of money as a software engineer and I don't think I'll get a home until I'm 45.

closeparen 6y ago

What is going on with your local economy such that you can equate "average person" and "minimum wage" like this?

RIMR 6y ago
Out of the 155.75 Million working Americans, 80.4 million make minimum wage. That's 51.6% (a majority) of workers making minimum wage. So yeah.
- SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
  That isn't true. In 2017, 80.4 million Americans were paid hourly, and out of those only 1.8 million made minimum wage or below. (https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm# https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm#) More generally, I'd encourage you to question the mental model that made this sound like a potentially true claim in the first case. An economy where most people are paid minimum wage would be incredibly different than the one we actually have.
- closeparen 6y ago
  Per BLS, 80.4 million workers make an hourly wage, with 1.8 million at or below at the federal minimum. [0] It is kind of fascinating that people have such wildly different ideas about what the objective facts are, and how that must flow downstream into their worldviews and politics. Between 51.6% and 2.3% is not a small difference! Those are very different worlds we could be living in! [0] https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm#:~:text=The%20percentage%20of%20hourly%20paid,collected%20on%20a%20regular%20basis https://www.bls.gov/opub/reports/minimum-wage/2017/home.htm#....
  - A4ET8a8uTh0 6y ago
    It is fascinating and horrifying at the same time. On the one hand, I am hoping the person was simply quoting something they heard in a rant online. On the other hand, I am hoping it is just a case of misreading available BLS data. Neither is exactly ideal and both paint rather sad picture of how we interpret reality.