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The pattern in the US has been that Union's provide an uncheckable form of power for the individuals who run the union. These individuals then make changes tha

by lumost 6y ago

The pattern in the US has been that Union's provide an uncheckable form of power for the individuals who run the union. These individuals then make changes that favor the union in the long term. Union run pensions mean someone at the union get's paid for managing it. Union run negotiations mean that someone at the union gets paid for the negotiation. Union run pay debates means the union flattens compensation to keep workers unified. I'd be curious for union models which effectively empower a check on union power by the workers.

Mauricebranagh 6y ago
The annual conference does? I have certainly changed policy (though Kieth Flets branch stole my thunder) and turned over the executive :-) More professional unions do tend to have more lay activists who are more open to exercising control over the full-timers I feel. By pensions I meant you have a separation as in the UK where the trustees from both sides at at arms length and Hermes (a huge pension fund) trustees sacked the managers and is now self managed at a reduced TER. And remember not all developers live in the US.
teachrdan 6y ago
I wonder if you've ever actually worked in a unionized workplace. I used to be a teacher in Oakland, CA, and I was part of the contract negotiation (bargaining) team. I was elected to that position and it was unpaid. For bigger locals than mine there are certainly paid negotiators. That makes sense, because you're bargaining with management, who is paid to negotiate with you. You generally don't want amateurs (like me!) with no experience going up against professionals who are trained and coached in contract negotiation. > an uncheckable form of power for the individuals who run the union > I'd be curious for union models which effectively empower a check on union power by the workers. I'm not sure you understand what a union is. Most positions of power (the "individuals" I understand you to be referring to above) are elected. Sure there are bureaucrats who are appointed rather than elected. But what's the alternative? The workplace has its own power structure and, to be effective, a union generally needs its own. Don't like it? Run for a position in the union and change it!

by lumost 6y ago

Mauricebranagh 6y ago

The annual conference does? I have certainly changed policy (though Kieth Flets branch stole my thunder) and turned over the executive :-) More professional unions do tend to have more lay activists who are more open to exercising control over the full-timers I feel. By pensions I meant you have a separation as in the UK where the trustees from both sides at at arms length and Hermes (a huge pension fund) trustees sacked the managers and is now self managed at a reduced TER. And remember not all developers live in the US.

teachrdan 6y ago

I wonder if you've ever actually worked in a unionized workplace. I used to be a teacher in Oakland, CA, and I was part of the contract negotiation (bargaining) team. I was elected to that position and it was unpaid. For bigger locals than mine there are certainly paid negotiators. That makes sense, because you're bargaining with management, who is paid to negotiate with you. You generally don't want amateurs (like me!) with no experience going up against professionals who are trained and coached in contract negotiation. > an uncheckable form of power for the individuals who run the union > I'd be curious for union models which effectively empower a check on union power by the workers. I'm not sure you understand what a union is. Most positions of power (the "individuals" I understand you to be referring to above) are elected. Sure there are bureaucrats who are appointed rather than elected. But what's the alternative? The workplace has its own power structure and, to be effective, a union generally needs its own. Don't like it? Run for a position in the union and change it!