4 ms·

From the news, this sounds like the general economic model in the richer parts of the middle east.

sammorrowdrums 6y ago
It's presumably not isolated. I lived for a while in Oman, and for example construction workers and bar staff are significantly shipped in from India and a few other places, and are not paid well, and are put up in cheap cramped accommodation, work very long hours and the places hold on to all their passports. They also held all my band's passports as a musician, but we knew that if we were to rock up to the British embassy / consulate and requested assistance we'd have been helped to leave the country without our passports on emergency travel document, and I suspect that the Indian workers who were, in my opinion, poorly treated - they had a lot less options.
- chii 6y ago
  > I suspect that the Indian workers who were, in my opinion, poorly treated - they had a lot less options. so why isn't there an indian embassy to look after their citizens overseas there? Even you admit that you cannot be poorly treated because there's a british embassy offering some level of protection. So the root cause is that the country does not care about its citizen.
  - sammorrowdrums 6y ago
    I think the level of assistance offered to the number of people who need it, the cost of it and the extent to which the country needs the jobs for its citizens, and working conditions in the country itsef are all factors. I think "does not care" might be a less-than-charitable interpretation. Significantly being repatriated without a job and no money back to the UK and India are not like for like. Even if the assistance is technically there it doesn't mean that it is equivalent.
  - smcl 6y ago
    You're mistaken about the root cause. So say the Indian government decide that enough is enough, they offer a repatriation scheme for Indian nationals based in Oman, so that whoever needs consular assistance to return home has all that they need. We have solved the root cause! But wait, there are still buildings needing constructed in Muscat and there are not enough local people willing to be worked long hours for poor pay. So these Omani companies begin to step up recruiting in Bangladesh and now those workers start getting treated exactly as poorly as they were before. So did we identify and solve the root cause? No, we just shuffled around the nationality who was being abused. In an ideal world everyone who needs consular assistance can get it wherever they are based, but the root cause here is abusive employment practices, do not try to pretend otherwise.
    - sammorrowdrums 6y ago
      Yeah, the global marketplace of many countries willing to offer cheap labour for securing jobs means that competition keeps and drives the prices down. The only solution is minimum working conditions which vary from place to place, and can make a huge difference. The UK for example has loads of jobs like fruit picking done by the cheapest labour allowable, in the worst conditions allowable. Those conditions are just legally mandated to be a bit better, they're still not great but the UK can afford and is willing to offer that basic level.
      - conjectures 6y ago
        On UK fruit picking: yes and this is why I find the national post Brexit news here hilarious. "Farmers say locals can't be hired to pick fruit"- yes! at the wages being offered. For > £20p/h I'm sure the workers would materialise.
spacemanmatt 6y ago
We have that model in the West, too. Economic slavery is not hard to see if you're looking.

It's presumably not isolated. I lived for a while in Oman, and for example construction workers and bar staff are significantly shipped in from India and a few other places, and are not paid well, and are put up in cheap cramped accommodation, work very long hours and the places hold on to all their passports. They also held all my band's passports as a musician, but we knew that if we were to rock up to the British embassy / consulate and requested assistance we'd have been helped to leave the country without our passports on emergency travel document, and I suspect that the Indian workers who were, in my opinion, poorly treated - they had a lot less options.

chii 6y ago
> I suspect that the Indian workers who were, in my opinion, poorly treated - they had a lot less options. so why isn't there an indian embassy to look after their citizens overseas there? Even you admit that you cannot be poorly treated because there's a british embassy offering some level of protection. So the root cause is that the country does not care about its citizen.
- sammorrowdrums 6y ago
  I think the level of assistance offered to the number of people who need it, the cost of it and the extent to which the country needs the jobs for its citizens, and working conditions in the country itsef are all factors. I think "does not care" might be a less-than-charitable interpretation. Significantly being repatriated without a job and no money back to the UK and India are not like for like. Even if the assistance is technically there it doesn't mean that it is equivalent.
- smcl 6y ago
  You're mistaken about the root cause. So say the Indian government decide that enough is enough, they offer a repatriation scheme for Indian nationals based in Oman, so that whoever needs consular assistance to return home has all that they need. We have solved the root cause! But wait, there are still buildings needing constructed in Muscat and there are not enough local people willing to be worked long hours for poor pay. So these Omani companies begin to step up recruiting in Bangladesh and now those workers start getting treated exactly as poorly as they were before. So did we identify and solve the root cause? No, we just shuffled around the nationality who was being abused. In an ideal world everyone who needs consular assistance can get it wherever they are based, but the root cause here is abusive employment practices, do not try to pretend otherwise.
  - sammorrowdrums 6y ago
    Yeah, the global marketplace of many countries willing to offer cheap labour for securing jobs means that competition keeps and drives the prices down. The only solution is minimum working conditions which vary from place to place, and can make a huge difference. The UK for example has loads of jobs like fruit picking done by the cheapest labour allowable, in the worst conditions allowable. Those conditions are just legally mandated to be a bit better, they're still not great but the UK can afford and is willing to offer that basic level.
    - conjectures 6y ago
      On UK fruit picking: yes and this is why I find the national post Brexit news here hilarious. "Farmers say locals can't be hired to pick fruit"- yes! at the wages being offered. For > £20p/h I'm sure the workers would materialise.

spacemanmatt 6y ago

We have that model in the West, too. Economic slavery is not hard to see if you're looking.