14 ms·

I agree, but a minor nitpick: Aimee was forced out not just for being connected to pedophiles, but also for lying about and/or endorsing them (among other issue

by esja 6y ago

I agree, but a minor nitpick: Aimee was forced out not just for being connected to pedophiles, but also for lying about and/or endorsing them (among other issues). A massive failure of safeguarding from the Greens and Lib Dems, and now from Reddit. It's astonishing to me that a person like this can become an admin on a website used by millions of teenagers. We already know that admins can access private messages and other personal information.

mam2 6y ago
I am 100% convinced that the rate of pedophile is higher in: - positions of power (we have had a few in france who were judges / party representatives etC...) - any job close to children, which includes in particular schools, but also.. - church Why ? Because if you woke up tommorow as a pedophile, without any morals, and wanted to maximise the "chances" to satisfy your sexual attraction, where would you go ? Exactly.
- tarsinge 6y ago
  Church is far from being the biggest offender in France for jobs close to children, there is a whole generation of public educators that were openly for it (for some overlapping with your first point like Cohn-Bendit).
  - mam2 6y ago
    Ecxept that the church has constantly been trying to cover up the stories and constant sex scandals. All the fucking time. At sone point "if you are not a groups of pedohpiles covering each other, dont act like a group of pedophiles covering each others". If i was pedophile i would absolutely go to the church, also because so many people have their faith blind the truth. The "cant even imagine" its possible this "respectable priest" can do that. And yes you are right, i also forgot sport trainers.
    - Blikkentrekker 6y ago
      The Catholic Church has covered up many other things. It has nothing to do with child sexual abuse per sē, but simply that it's modus operandī, and that of many other organizations seems to be silence money to protect it's brand.
  - Zababa 6y ago
    > Church is far from being the biggest offender in France for jobs close to children Surprisingly that's all I hear about in the media. I've been looking for hard data and haven't been able to find any, especially for things like priests vs teachers vs other people. Do you have any data on that?
- Blikkentrekker 6y ago
  I am not convinced at all. What I am convinced of is that the ratio of those that break the law in crimes that typically involve abuse of power, are more commonly found in positions of power. The average pædophile will live his life without ever breaking any such laws, by either lack of willingness, or lack of opportunities awarded by such power.
- musingsole 6y ago
  > - any job close to children, which includes in particular... Schools! Oh...you went a different route. Right, we don't acknowledge the widespread sexual misconduct and cover-ups in the schools for another 5 years in this timeline because the church story was just so juicy.
  - mam2 6y ago
    I absolutely meant school on this bullet point :) (i edited)
    - tjs8rj 6y ago
      I don’t remember where I heard it but I recall some stat that child sexual abuse reports are just as common in public schools as they are in religious organizations
      - mam2 6y ago
        why not. that said reports in general are between like 1% and 10% of the total abuse so i'm not sure how significant it is
- iso1210 6y ago
  You don't join the greens or lib dems to gain political power
  - mam2 6y ago
    And what about judge ? also they were classic left wing before being in minority parties.
  - goatinaboat 6y ago
    You don't join the greens or lib dems to gain political power The Greens control Brighton unequivocally. There are Greens and LibDems in the House of Lords. The LibDems forced through a referendum on PR. They may seem like a harmless joke but they do wield power in their own way.
- ryanmarsh 6y ago
  It’s a shame your comment was downvoted.
  - mam2 6y ago
    Yeah, even more sad when you realize people downvoting this are inconsciously enabling the pedophiles.
- koonsolo 6y ago
  I had a colleague with a theory that a lot of pedophiles are really in love with the power aspect. There is no bigger power than that what an adult can have over a child. Both physically and mentally. And therefore, they will try to get those positions where they are in power. I don't know if this was ever investivated, but it makes sense to me. Edit: when you look at the dad in this story, raping and torturing a child seems more like the power aspect than the sexual one.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - mam2 6y ago
    interesting idea. that said there's a lot of power aspect in basic "adult" sex with bdsm etc... and in that case the father was dressing as a child when he was torturing the girl according to an article so i'm not sure he was looking specifically for power more than being downright crazy.. but why not
- buisi 6y ago
  Well, there are a lot of people who want positions of power, like working as a judge, or having a high position in the government. Undoubtedly, some will turn out to be pedophiles, and / or abusers. We likely hear a lot of places like Churches, hospitals, and schools, because historically people were pretty quiet about what went on there, and now all these horrible historic revelations are coming out one after another. I can imagine access to children being a factor too, although actual pedophiles have an instinctual emotional closeness with children which might influence them towards those positions. If any are in those positions and see this, I really hope you don't do anything to anyone there. The highest frequency of abuse actually happens in none of those places but at home. It is usually a family member who does it. Sometimes, it may even involve drugs, rather than a sexual interest. I'm not very fond of the War on Drugs, as it destroys lives, but I really hope people use drugs responsibly, when / if they do. And we may need better mental health services to reduce the perceived need to rely on alcohol / drugs. From what I know, pedophilia is a spectrum, which goes from very weak (insignificant and easy to ignore for most intents and purposes) to the exclusive type. There are some sub-types, like ones who are only interested in infants, rather than older children. Pedophiles aren't synonymous with abusers. Many don't abuse.
LeifCarrotson 6y ago
Normal rules of balance can be twisted or broken in this case, depending on your desired outcome. On the one hand, you've got the (reasonable) rule "always condemn and distance yourself from pedophilia". On the other hand, you've got the also reasonable rule "never discriminate against someone because of their gender". If the Greens, Lib Dems, Reddit, or anyone else involved had chosen not to hire her, she could stir up outrage against them for gender discrimination. If they did hire her, the public could stir up outrage against them for their connection to pedophiles. It's easy to agree that both pedophilia and gender discrimination are bad. It's harder to take action, especially when people have prior agendas.
- filoleg 6y ago
  >If the Greens, Lib Dems, Reddit, or anyone else involved had chosen not to hire her, she could stir up outrage against them for gender discrimination We don't even need to hypothesize this specific "if", because that's exactly what she did[0] after being ousted from Green Party due to all the pedophilia-related concerns. 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aimee_Challenor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aimee_Challenor
  - slowmovintarget 6y ago
    In a rational world, that wouldn't have happened, but we seem to have lost our ability to say behavior A (which has supporting facts) is significantly worse than behavior B (which is alleged). Preying on children, or advocating for those who want to, is a significantly bigger problem than the _accusation_ of bias based on preference.
    - SamBam 6y ago
      Except as I understand it her accusations didn't stick at all. Did anyone buy that it was gender/trans-discrimination? Certainly the party did not hire her back. So it seems as if, by this minor measure, the world can still be rational.
    - Blikkentrekker 6y ago
newsclues 6y ago
Couple this with the pornography subreddits. After pornhhub had issues with user generated content, Reddit needs much stricter regulation.
- darkhorse13 6y ago
  It's seriously a shame you are being downvoted for this comment.
  - newsclues 6y ago
    Odd, was it critical of Reddit or the appearance of being anti pornography (I’m just extremely anti child porn and other things like sex slavery/trafficking).
    - notsureaboutpg 6y ago
      So what if you were anti pornography? One of the many many many problems with pornography is that it often crosses the line into violence, promoting illegal sexual fantasies, actual human trafficking and crimes, etc. Etc.
    - astrange 6y ago
      Sex trafficing is not a real thing. It's more common to be trafficed as a low-wage worker, sometimes partially with your own participation, eg as a servant or working at an extended family restaurant. Sex trafficing is just something police like to bring up at press conferences when they arrest women for prostitution. Often they don't actually charge anyone with it though, it just sounds cool to say so they do it.
      - JxLS-cpgbe0 6y ago
        > Sex trafficing [sic] is not a real thing Human trafficking (for non-sexual exploitation), sex trafficking, and non-coerced criminalized sex work have differences; but they all are very real. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palermo_protocols https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palermo_protocols https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victims_of_Trafficking_and_Violence_Protection_Act_of_2000 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victims_of_Trafficking_and_Vio...
ryanmarsh 6y ago
It's astonishing to me that a person like this can become an admin on a website used by millions of teenagers Unfortunately not so astonishing, people like that are drawn to and commonly inhabit exactly the kinds of places you wouldn’t want them. There are some fairly recent public examples you could easily find.
- syshum 6y ago
  Anyone that would seek power should not have power, and the best way to guard against that is to ensure accountability, objective based rules enforcement where an individuals subjective beliefs are not a factor unfortunately all of these platforms focus almost exclusively on subjective "We know bad things when we see them" type of rules
- esja 6y ago
  Absolutely. These people actively seek out access to children, and many of them are extremely clever in the way they do this, and the way they manipulate good-natured people around them. The only part that astonishes me is that Reddit hired the person. It suggests they are either not performing proper background checking (terrible), or they are and decided to overlook what they found (even worse).
wcarron 6y ago
I have seen allegations on reddit that Aimee also moderated a number of subreddits, specifically ones pertaining to minors, before, during, and after her fathers' rape and torture of a 10 year old in the house she lived in. Allowing a person who willfully ignored pedophilia and torture be in a position of power near/directly engaging with minors, and then hiring that person, is despicable.
- meowface 6y ago
  Obviously horrible if true, but what's the evidence?
  - wcarron 6y ago
    > Challenor moderated the major Reddit forum r/lgbt among others for several years. Key quote from this article: https://freebeacon.com/culture/reddit-faces-massive-user-protest-for-banning-criticism-of-controversial-employee/ https://freebeacon.com/culture/reddit-faces-massive-user-pro... I deactivated my reddit account and blocked reddit domains on my devices this morning as a result of the censorship. So now I'm cut off from any more reddit interaction and can't provide anything further. Also, Challenor and other admins deleting evidence and permabanning people is like, the whole issue.
    - meowface 6y ago
      >also moderated a number of subreddits, specifically ones pertaining to minors I meant the one about moderating a number of subreddits pertaining to minors. I'm aware of the other claims.

by esja 6y ago

mam2 6y ago

I am 100% convinced that the rate of pedophile is higher in: - positions of power (we have had a few in france who were judges / party representatives etC...) - any job close to children, which includes in particular schools, but also.. - church Why ? Because if you woke up tommorow as a pedophile, without any morals, and wanted to maximise the "chances" to satisfy your sexual attraction, where would you go ? Exactly.

tarsinge 6y ago
Church is far from being the biggest offender in France for jobs close to children, there is a whole generation of public educators that were openly for it (for some overlapping with your first point like Cohn-Bendit).
- mam2 6y ago
  Ecxept that the church has constantly been trying to cover up the stories and constant sex scandals. All the fucking time. At sone point "if you are not a groups of pedohpiles covering each other, dont act like a group of pedophiles covering each others". If i was pedophile i would absolutely go to the church, also because so many people have their faith blind the truth. The "cant even imagine" its possible this "respectable priest" can do that. And yes you are right, i also forgot sport trainers.
  - Blikkentrekker 6y ago
    The Catholic Church has covered up many other things. It has nothing to do with child sexual abuse per sē, but simply that it's modus operandī, and that of many other organizations seems to be silence money to protect it's brand.
- Zababa 6y ago
  > Church is far from being the biggest offender in France for jobs close to children Surprisingly that's all I hear about in the media. I've been looking for hard data and haven't been able to find any, especially for things like priests vs teachers vs other people. Do you have any data on that?
Blikkentrekker 6y ago
I am not convinced at all. What I am convinced of is that the ratio of those that break the law in crimes that typically involve abuse of power, are more commonly found in positions of power. The average pædophile will live his life without ever breaking any such laws, by either lack of willingness, or lack of opportunities awarded by such power.
musingsole 6y ago
> - any job close to children, which includes in particular... Schools! Oh...you went a different route. Right, we don't acknowledge the widespread sexual misconduct and cover-ups in the schools for another 5 years in this timeline because the church story was just so juicy.
- mam2 6y ago
  I absolutely meant school on this bullet point :) (i edited)
  - tjs8rj 6y ago
    I don’t remember where I heard it but I recall some stat that child sexual abuse reports are just as common in public schools as they are in religious organizations
    - mam2 6y ago
      why not. that said reports in general are between like 1% and 10% of the total abuse so i'm not sure how significant it is
iso1210 6y ago
You don't join the greens or lib dems to gain political power
- mam2 6y ago
  And what about judge ? also they were classic left wing before being in minority parties.
- goatinaboat 6y ago
  You don't join the greens or lib dems to gain political power The Greens control Brighton unequivocally. There are Greens and LibDems in the House of Lords. The LibDems forced through a referendum on PR. They may seem like a harmless joke but they do wield power in their own way.
ryanmarsh 6y ago
It’s a shame your comment was downvoted.
- mam2 6y ago
  Yeah, even more sad when you realize people downvoting this are inconsciously enabling the pedophiles.
koonsolo 6y ago
I had a colleague with a theory that a lot of pedophiles are really in love with the power aspect. There is no bigger power than that what an adult can have over a child. Both physically and mentally. And therefore, they will try to get those positions where they are in power. I don't know if this was ever investivated, but it makes sense to me. Edit: when you look at the dad in this story, raping and torturing a child seems more like the power aspect than the sexual one.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- mam2 6y ago
  interesting idea. that said there's a lot of power aspect in basic "adult" sex with bdsm etc... and in that case the father was dressing as a child when he was torturing the girl according to an article so i'm not sure he was looking specifically for power more than being downright crazy.. but why not
buisi 6y ago
Well, there are a lot of people who want positions of power, like working as a judge, or having a high position in the government. Undoubtedly, some will turn out to be pedophiles, and / or abusers. We likely hear a lot of places like Churches, hospitals, and schools, because historically people were pretty quiet about what went on there, and now all these horrible historic revelations are coming out one after another. I can imagine access to children being a factor too, although actual pedophiles have an instinctual emotional closeness with children which might influence them towards those positions. If any are in those positions and see this, I really hope you don't do anything to anyone there. The highest frequency of abuse actually happens in none of those places but at home. It is usually a family member who does it. Sometimes, it may even involve drugs, rather than a sexual interest. I'm not very fond of the War on Drugs, as it destroys lives, but I really hope people use drugs responsibly, when / if they do. And we may need better mental health services to reduce the perceived need to rely on alcohol / drugs. From what I know, pedophilia is a spectrum, which goes from very weak (insignificant and easy to ignore for most intents and purposes) to the exclusive type. There are some sub-types, like ones who are only interested in infants, rather than older children. Pedophiles aren't synonymous with abusers. Many don't abuse.

LeifCarrotson 6y ago

Normal rules of balance can be twisted or broken in this case, depending on your desired outcome. On the one hand, you've got the (reasonable) rule "always condemn and distance yourself from pedophilia". On the other hand, you've got the also reasonable rule "never discriminate against someone because of their gender". If the Greens, Lib Dems, Reddit, or anyone else involved had chosen not to hire her, she could stir up outrage against them for gender discrimination. If they did hire her, the public could stir up outrage against them for their connection to pedophiles. It's easy to agree that both pedophilia and gender discrimination are bad. It's harder to take action, especially when people have prior agendas.

filoleg 6y ago
>If the Greens, Lib Dems, Reddit, or anyone else involved had chosen not to hire her, she could stir up outrage against them for gender discrimination We don't even need to hypothesize this specific "if", because that's exactly what she did[0] after being ousted from Green Party due to all the pedophilia-related concerns. 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aimee_Challenor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aimee_Challenor
- slowmovintarget 6y ago
  In a rational world, that wouldn't have happened, but we seem to have lost our ability to say behavior A (which has supporting facts) is significantly worse than behavior B (which is alleged). Preying on children, or advocating for those who want to, is a significantly bigger problem than the _accusation_ of bias based on preference.
  - SamBam 6y ago
    Except as I understand it her accusations didn't stick at all. Did anyone buy that it was gender/trans-discrimination? Certainly the party did not hire her back. So it seems as if, by this minor measure, the world can still be rational.
  - Blikkentrekker 6y ago

newsclues 6y ago

Couple this with the pornography subreddits. After pornhhub had issues with user generated content, Reddit needs much stricter regulation.

darkhorse13 6y ago
It's seriously a shame you are being downvoted for this comment.
- newsclues 6y ago
  Odd, was it critical of Reddit or the appearance of being anti pornography (I’m just extremely anti child porn and other things like sex slavery/trafficking).
  - notsureaboutpg 6y ago
    So what if you were anti pornography? One of the many many many problems with pornography is that it often crosses the line into violence, promoting illegal sexual fantasies, actual human trafficking and crimes, etc. Etc.
  - astrange 6y ago
    Sex trafficing is not a real thing. It's more common to be trafficed as a low-wage worker, sometimes partially with your own participation, eg as a servant or working at an extended family restaurant. Sex trafficing is just something police like to bring up at press conferences when they arrest women for prostitution. Often they don't actually charge anyone with it though, it just sounds cool to say so they do it.
    - JxLS-cpgbe0 6y ago
      > Sex trafficing [sic] is not a real thing Human trafficking (for non-sexual exploitation), sex trafficking, and non-coerced criminalized sex work have differences; but they all are very real. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palermo_protocols https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palermo_protocols https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victims_of_Trafficking_and_Violence_Protection_Act_of_2000 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victims_of_Trafficking_and_Vio...

ryanmarsh 6y ago

It's astonishing to me that a person like this can become an admin on a website used by millions of teenagers Unfortunately not so astonishing, people like that are drawn to and commonly inhabit exactly the kinds of places you wouldn’t want them. There are some fairly recent public examples you could easily find.

syshum 6y ago
Anyone that would seek power should not have power, and the best way to guard against that is to ensure accountability, objective based rules enforcement where an individuals subjective beliefs are not a factor unfortunately all of these platforms focus almost exclusively on subjective "We know bad things when we see them" type of rules
esja 6y ago
Absolutely. These people actively seek out access to children, and many of them are extremely clever in the way they do this, and the way they manipulate good-natured people around them. The only part that astonishes me is that Reddit hired the person. It suggests they are either not performing proper background checking (terrible), or they are and decided to overlook what they found (even worse).

wcarron 6y ago

I have seen allegations on reddit that Aimee also moderated a number of subreddits, specifically ones pertaining to minors, before, during, and after her fathers' rape and torture of a 10 year old in the house she lived in. Allowing a person who willfully ignored pedophilia and torture be in a position of power near/directly engaging with minors, and then hiring that person, is despicable.

meowface 6y ago
Obviously horrible if true, but what's the evidence?
- wcarron 6y ago
  > Challenor moderated the major Reddit forum r/lgbt among others for several years. Key quote from this article: https://freebeacon.com/culture/reddit-faces-massive-user-protest-for-banning-criticism-of-controversial-employee/ https://freebeacon.com/culture/reddit-faces-massive-user-pro... I deactivated my reddit account and blocked reddit domains on my devices this morning as a result of the censorship. So now I'm cut off from any more reddit interaction and can't provide anything further. Also, Challenor and other admins deleting evidence and permabanning people is like, the whole issue.
  - meowface 6y ago
    >also moderated a number of subreddits, specifically ones pertaining to minors I meant the one about moderating a number of subreddits pertaining to minors. I'm aware of the other claims.