6 ms·

Not that much compared to other direct or indirect causes.

groby_b 6y ago
Uh... Selling a single token? 8.7MWh[1] That's slightly less than the average US household consumes in a year. [1] https://www.wired.com/story/nfts-hot-effect-earth-climate/ https://www.wired.com/story/nfts-hot-effect-earth-climate/
- IgorPartola 6y ago
  Has there been any movement in the crypto world (that isn’t just creating new coins) towards switching algorithms such that BTC et al don’t use proof of work anymore?
  - beaconstudios 6y ago
    Ethereum is switching to proof of stake. AFAIK (not a crypto guy) it's the second largest blockchain.
    - derefr 6y ago
      More relevant to the question at hand, Ethereum is also where all the NFTs are.
  - doomslice 6y ago
    Stellar (https://stellar.org/ https://stellar.org/) uses a novel Byzantine agreement protocol (https://www.stellar.org/papers/stellar-consensus-protocol?locale=en https://www.stellar.org/papers/stellar-consensus-protocol?lo...) which practically eliminates it in comparison. It is also insanely cheap (like $1... and even that is just "held" in the account and can be released later) to "mint" a new coin and thus is practically perfect for NFTs. It's seen as sort of a joke in the crypto world by those who are only trying to make a buck (price of XLM, used for paying transaction fees, is relatively stable compared to others) but I think it's one of the few cryptos out there that has a chance of making a real difference in the world long term.
    - dieortin 6y ago
      Stellar is centralized though, so it completely misses the point.
      - doomslice 6y ago
        Anyone can participate in consensus, but you do have to be trusted by someone else who already participates in the trusted consensus, so you're right that it's not completely decentralized (but is also not strictly centralized either). Here's a current visualization of how many participants there are: https://stellarbeat.io/ https://stellarbeat.io/
  - yreg 6y ago
    Cardano – the 3rd largest currency by marketcap[1], after Bitcoin and Ethereum – uses proof of stake. [1] - https://coinmarketcap.com/ https://coinmarketcap.com/
  - X6S1x6Okd1st 6y ago
    Bitcoin is extremely resistant to change. Ethereum is what all the articles about costly NFTs are written about. The proof of stake (low energy consumption) chain is already live and the proof of work chain will is scheduled to be shut down in 2 years. Faster if the miners try to revolt
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - Paradigma11 6y ago
    Tezos using PoS has been up and running for more than a year i think. You can mint NFTs here: http://nftz.fun/ http://nftz.fun/ https://www.hicetnunc.xyz/ https://www.hicetnunc.xyz/
- IanCal 6y ago
  I think that was for 6 and for running the auction.
- thebean11 6y ago
  Creating a token does not consume any additional energy. Transaction volume does _not_ scale with mining so it's a really bad comparison. The energy is spent to secure the network regardless of how many transactions are processed (in practice, transaction volume is pretty much fixed in terms of "bytes of transactions")
  - codebolt 6y ago
    Bitcoin alone currently pollutes about the same as half the global airline industry. If cryptos really are the future, I weep for the planet.
    - thebean11 6y ago
      Luckily mining with renewables is much less difficult technically than flying with renewables.
      - Supermancho 6y ago
        How is that lucky?
        thebean11 6y ago
        Lucky for Bitcoin, there's a clear path to reducing environmental impact.
        lostlogin 6y ago
        Or we could use that power for something a little more practical which we can’t do without.
        emteycz 6y ago
        What we? These are individuals, each with their own goals. Give them some other business opportunity and I'm sure they'll jump on it - it just needs to be as good as Bitcoin.
- s1artibartfast 6y ago
  This assumes that climate change/ CO2 is a significant impact on the gorilla populations. In reality, bushmeat consumption, logging, farming, and mining are the main drivers or gorilla population losses.
- ric2b 6y ago
  That's like saying that if my lamp uses 3W when I'm at my desk, surely it'll use 6W when I call someone over. Blockchain energy usage is not really proportional to transaction volume, they're only connected in very indirect ways (more usage -> more adoption -> higher price? -> reward for mining a block increases in value -> miners can pay for more energy while still turning a profit)

Uh... Selling a single token? 8.7MWh[1] That's slightly less than the average US household consumes in a year. [1] https://www.wired.com/story/nfts-hot-effect-earth-climate/ https://www.wired.com/story/nfts-hot-effect-earth-climate/

IgorPartola 6y ago
Has there been any movement in the crypto world (that isn’t just creating new coins) towards switching algorithms such that BTC et al don’t use proof of work anymore?
- beaconstudios 6y ago
  Ethereum is switching to proof of stake. AFAIK (not a crypto guy) it's the second largest blockchain.
  - derefr 6y ago
    More relevant to the question at hand, Ethereum is also where all the NFTs are.
- doomslice 6y ago
  Stellar (https://stellar.org/ https://stellar.org/) uses a novel Byzantine agreement protocol (https://www.stellar.org/papers/stellar-consensus-protocol?locale=en https://www.stellar.org/papers/stellar-consensus-protocol?lo...) which practically eliminates it in comparison. It is also insanely cheap (like $1... and even that is just "held" in the account and can be released later) to "mint" a new coin and thus is practically perfect for NFTs. It's seen as sort of a joke in the crypto world by those who are only trying to make a buck (price of XLM, used for paying transaction fees, is relatively stable compared to others) but I think it's one of the few cryptos out there that has a chance of making a real difference in the world long term.
  - dieortin 6y ago
    Stellar is centralized though, so it completely misses the point.
    - doomslice 6y ago
      Anyone can participate in consensus, but you do have to be trusted by someone else who already participates in the trusted consensus, so you're right that it's not completely decentralized (but is also not strictly centralized either). Here's a current visualization of how many participants there are: https://stellarbeat.io/ https://stellarbeat.io/
- yreg 6y ago
  Cardano – the 3rd largest currency by marketcap[1], after Bitcoin and Ethereum – uses proof of stake. [1] - https://coinmarketcap.com/ https://coinmarketcap.com/
- X6S1x6Okd1st 6y ago
  Bitcoin is extremely resistant to change. Ethereum is what all the articles about costly NFTs are written about. The proof of stake (low energy consumption) chain is already live and the proof of work chain will is scheduled to be shut down in 2 years. Faster if the miners try to revolt
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- Paradigma11 6y ago
  Tezos using PoS has been up and running for more than a year i think. You can mint NFTs here: http://nftz.fun/ http://nftz.fun/ https://www.hicetnunc.xyz/ https://www.hicetnunc.xyz/
IanCal 6y ago
I think that was for 6 and for running the auction.
thebean11 6y ago
Creating a token does not consume any additional energy. Transaction volume does _not_ scale with mining so it's a really bad comparison. The energy is spent to secure the network regardless of how many transactions are processed (in practice, transaction volume is pretty much fixed in terms of "bytes of transactions")
- codebolt 6y ago
  Bitcoin alone currently pollutes about the same as half the global airline industry. If cryptos really are the future, I weep for the planet.
  - thebean11 6y ago
    Luckily mining with renewables is much less difficult technically than flying with renewables.
    - Supermancho 6y ago
      How is that lucky?
      - thebean11 6y ago
        Lucky for Bitcoin, there's a clear path to reducing environmental impact.
        lostlogin 6y ago
        Or we could use that power for something a little more practical which we can’t do without.
        emteycz 6y ago
        What we? These are individuals, each with their own goals. Give them some other business opportunity and I'm sure they'll jump on it - it just needs to be as good as Bitcoin.
s1artibartfast 6y ago
This assumes that climate change/ CO2 is a significant impact on the gorilla populations. In reality, bushmeat consumption, logging, farming, and mining are the main drivers or gorilla population losses.
ric2b 6y ago
That's like saying that if my lamp uses 3W when I'm at my desk, surely it'll use 6W when I call someone over. Blockchain energy usage is not really proportional to transaction volume, they're only connected in very indirect ways (more usage -> more adoption -> higher price? -> reward for mining a block increases in value -> miners can pay for more energy while still turning a profit)