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As far as I know, all versions of the vaccine reduce symptoms for the vaccinated, but they can still catch covid and transmit it to others. That’s a risk to a

As far as I know, all versions of the vaccine reduce symptoms for the vaccinated, but they can still catch covid and transmit it to others. That’s a risk to a large unvaccinated local population.

timr 6y ago
This is outdated speculation. The preponderance of current evidence points toward what we expect from previous vaccines -- once you've been immunized, you are incredibly unlikely to transmit the virus to others: https://reason.com/2021/03/08/contrary-to-what-the-cdcs-new-covid-19-advice-implies-there-is-strong-evidence-that-vaccination-curtails-virus-transmission/ https://reason.com/2021/03/08/contrary-to-what-the-cdcs-new-... In fact, the CDC just updated it's own guidelines to reflect these same facts: https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2021/03/08/974783644/cdc-says-its-safe-for-vaccinated-people-to-do-these-activities https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2021/0... If anything, these guidelines are conservative.
- Mountain_Skies 6y ago
  So no need to wear a mask then.
  - samatman 6y ago
    Yes this is actually correct. Continuing to wear a mask in public is about compliance, not safety per se: if exceptions were made for the vaccinated, people who just don't want to wear a mask would be hard to separate from those who are no longer at risk of catching or spreading the disease. As someone who has had natural immunity (it sucked, made a full recovery) for most of the pandemic, this has been on my mind, since masking is purely cosmetic for me.
    - starfallg 6y ago
      This isn't stressed enough though. When dealing with such issues we also need to consider group behaviour as a whole. Every additional exception introduces costs and risks so it makes sense for a part of the population to signal compliance unnecessarily.
      - Pyramus 6y ago
        Exactly. Plus there will likely be (small) additional benefits from reduced transmission for other diseases that are spread through respiratory droplets and aerosols.
- eric-hu 6y ago
  From your cited Reason article: > During a follow-up period beginning seven days after the second dose, vaccinated subjects were 92 percent less likely to test positive for the coronavirus, 94 percent less likely to develop COVID-19 symptoms, and 92 percent less likely to suffer serious disease. In other words, the risk of infection at this stage was much smaller than it was in the unvaccinated group. Although that risk was not completely eliminated, the CDC notes that "preliminary data from Israel suggest that persons vaccinated with Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine who develop COVID-19 have a four-fold lower viral load than unvaccinated persons," which implies that they are less likely to transmit the virus even when they are infected. This seems consistent with what I wrote earlier. Further, from the NPR article: > Vaccinated people can also visit, unmasked, with people from another household who are not yet vaccinated, as long as those people are at low risk of serious illness from the virus. However, the agency said, vaccinated people should continue to wear masks when they're in public, avoid crowds and take other precautions when gathering with unvaccinated people who are at high risk of serious illness from COVID-19.
  - timr 6y ago
    Measurements of effectiveness will never get to 100%. Statistical noise alone guarantees that any such measurement will be an uncertainty interval with a tail that drops below 100. Nothing is guaranteed in life. There is always risk.

As far as I know, all versions of the vaccine reduce symptoms for the vaccinated, but they can still catch covid and transmit it to others. That’s a risk to a large unvaccinated local population.

timr 6y ago

This is outdated speculation. The preponderance of current evidence points toward what we expect from previous vaccines -- once you've been immunized, you are incredibly unlikely to transmit the virus to others: https://reason.com/2021/03/08/contrary-to-what-the-cdcs-new-covid-19-advice-implies-there-is-strong-evidence-that-vaccination-curtails-virus-transmission/ https://reason.com/2021/03/08/contrary-to-what-the-cdcs-new-... In fact, the CDC just updated it's own guidelines to reflect these same facts: https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2021/03/08/974783644/cdc-says-its-safe-for-vaccinated-people-to-do-these-activities https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2021/0... If anything, these guidelines are conservative.

Mountain_Skies 6y ago
So no need to wear a mask then.
- samatman 6y ago
  Yes this is actually correct. Continuing to wear a mask in public is about compliance, not safety per se: if exceptions were made for the vaccinated, people who just don't want to wear a mask would be hard to separate from those who are no longer at risk of catching or spreading the disease. As someone who has had natural immunity (it sucked, made a full recovery) for most of the pandemic, this has been on my mind, since masking is purely cosmetic for me.
  - starfallg 6y ago
    This isn't stressed enough though. When dealing with such issues we also need to consider group behaviour as a whole. Every additional exception introduces costs and risks so it makes sense for a part of the population to signal compliance unnecessarily.
    - Pyramus 6y ago
      Exactly. Plus there will likely be (small) additional benefits from reduced transmission for other diseases that are spread through respiratory droplets and aerosols.
eric-hu 6y ago
From your cited Reason article: > During a follow-up period beginning seven days after the second dose, vaccinated subjects were 92 percent less likely to test positive for the coronavirus, 94 percent less likely to develop COVID-19 symptoms, and 92 percent less likely to suffer serious disease. In other words, the risk of infection at this stage was much smaller than it was in the unvaccinated group. Although that risk was not completely eliminated, the CDC notes that "preliminary data from Israel suggest that persons vaccinated with Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine who develop COVID-19 have a four-fold lower viral load than unvaccinated persons," which implies that they are less likely to transmit the virus even when they are infected. This seems consistent with what I wrote earlier. Further, from the NPR article: > Vaccinated people can also visit, unmasked, with people from another household who are not yet vaccinated, as long as those people are at low risk of serious illness from the virus. However, the agency said, vaccinated people should continue to wear masks when they're in public, avoid crowds and take other precautions when gathering with unvaccinated people who are at high risk of serious illness from COVID-19.
- timr 6y ago
  Measurements of effectiveness will never get to 100%. Statistical noise alone guarantees that any such measurement will be an uncertainty interval with a tail that drops below 100. Nothing is guaranteed in life. There is always risk.