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I think there's another issue here though. If I turn on Incognito mode and then go to Amazon, Amazon can obviously see what I'm doing. If I log into Amazon, th

I think there's another issue here though. If I turn on Incognito mode and then go to Amazon, Amazon can obviously see what I'm doing. If I log into Amazon, then Amazon knows it's me and can track that. I think that's reasonable, but people didn't understand that that's the case and that's why Google has that disclaimer there. That's different from browser fingerprinting[1] though. Fingerprinting techniques exist which can tell that you're you even if you're in incognito mode. For example, if you're visiting Pornhub every day in incognito mode, the company can still build a pretty reliable profile of you. If you then visit them not in incognito mode once, they may be able to take that incognito profile and associate it with you a lot more closely. Likewise, if you visit Amazon from your browser all the time and then visit them in incognito mode, these fingerprinting techniques allow Amazon to know it's you already; they can "play dumb" by keeping you logged out, not showing you recommendations, etc., but they can still figure out it's you and use that to continue to build a profile on you. The caveat here is that this is much more useful for some people than others. If I visit HN, then HN can fingerprint me in Incognito or not, but that's not extremely useful. If I visit literally anywhere else, Google/Doubleclick/etc. can fingerprint my browser, and since extensions like ad/tracker/etc. blockers don't work by default in incognito mode, they could potentially get an even better profile of you from Incognito mode than not. Pretty gross, honestly. [1] https://blog.mozilla.org/internetcitizen/2018/07/26/this-is-your-digital-fingerprint/ https://blog.mozilla.org/internetcitizen/2018/07/26/this-is-...

jb775 6y ago
Yeah and google can do all of the above considering just about every website uses google analytics and all that analytics data is sent back to google's servers. Then they can sweep up whatever they missed using Chrome or Android or google-owned service metadata (i.e. google search, google maps, etc). Google Analytics is the service that connects it all and google has convinced companies to give them this data access for free. (well, in exchange for visibility to parts of that data displayed on fancy trinkets)
- amelius 6y ago
  This is the web-equivalent of omnipresent facial recognition tied to a central database. Like fingerprinting, facial recognition is not perfect (e.g. you can have a lookalike, twin, etc.) but is still damn frightening. Perhaps this viewpoint can convince some more people of Google's (potential) evilness.
judge2020 6y ago
Google doesn't fingerprint browsers like other adtech networks do - that's why they're really pushing for on-device ad auctions[0] and removing the usefulness of third-party-cookie-based tracking all together[1]. It would strengthen their monopoly (other providers would have to invest in supporting this ad model) while also directly benefiting the consumer's privacy and not hurting their business model: ad clicks. 0: https://github.com/WICG/turtledove#turtledove https://github.com/WICG/turtledove#turtledove 1: https://www.chromium.org/Home/chromium-privacy/privacy-sandbox https://www.chromium.org/Home/chromium-privacy/privacy-sandb...
- vagrantJin 6y ago
  The issue isnt that they did or didn't. The issue is that they can
  - UncleMeat 6y ago
    Ok. By what mechanism could Google prevent themselves from ever being able to do this? The browser can be updated to do anything. It could start deleting hard drives tomorrow with a malicious update!
    - eznzt 6y ago
      >By what mechanism could Google prevent themselves from ever being able to do this? The law.
      - gcbirzan 6y ago
        The law cannot prevent you from doing something, it can only punish you if you do it.
        FigmentEngine 6y ago
        that is a nonsense statement. "doing something" = "do it" if you mean, cant stop you considering it, then thats fair, but then the point has no value?
withinboredom 6y ago
Speaking of pornhub... There used to be a way to see your pornhub search history even if you were always incognito, right on the site. It worked really well but I never figured out how it worked.
didibus 6y ago
How does this relate to Google though? Do you mean they should get rid of incognito mode? Cause it doesn't succeed at preventing all websites from tracking you? Or that they should be liable for making people believe it could when it couldn't?
- unloco 6y ago
  incognito mode is not made to hide you from the internet. it's made to hide your activities from being logged into your browser.
unloco 6y ago
I think a lot of the problem is, the average person doesnt know the difference between your browser not tracking your activity, and the internet tracking your activity. incognito mode is to hide from your browser history and tracking, it has nothing to do with the servers you visit.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
tppiotrowski 6y ago
How can Amazon see what you’re doing in incognito if you haven’t logged in? An incognito session is cleared of all cookies so you need to log in to establish your identity. It doesn’t stop Google Analytics from loading but will log you as a new user/session because previous session cookie is gone. Now, there is also fingerprinting techniques but at the time incognito mode was released these were not widely known and incognito meant: make me look like an anonymous user on the internet NOT make me invisible.

jb775 6y ago

Yeah and google can do all of the above considering just about every website uses google analytics and all that analytics data is sent back to google's servers. Then they can sweep up whatever they missed using Chrome or Android or google-owned service metadata (i.e. google search, google maps, etc). Google Analytics is the service that connects it all and google has convinced companies to give them this data access for free. (well, in exchange for visibility to parts of that data displayed on fancy trinkets)

amelius 6y ago
This is the web-equivalent of omnipresent facial recognition tied to a central database. Like fingerprinting, facial recognition is not perfect (e.g. you can have a lookalike, twin, etc.) but is still damn frightening. Perhaps this viewpoint can convince some more people of Google's (potential) evilness.

judge2020 6y ago

Google doesn't fingerprint browsers like other adtech networks do - that's why they're really pushing for on-device ad auctions[0] and removing the usefulness of third-party-cookie-based tracking all together[1]. It would strengthen their monopoly (other providers would have to invest in supporting this ad model) while also directly benefiting the consumer's privacy and not hurting their business model: ad clicks. 0: https://github.com/WICG/turtledove#turtledove https://github.com/WICG/turtledove#turtledove 1: https://www.chromium.org/Home/chromium-privacy/privacy-sandbox https://www.chromium.org/Home/chromium-privacy/privacy-sandb...

vagrantJin 6y ago
The issue isnt that they did or didn't. The issue is that they can
- UncleMeat 6y ago
  Ok. By what mechanism could Google prevent themselves from ever being able to do this? The browser can be updated to do anything. It could start deleting hard drives tomorrow with a malicious update!
  - eznzt 6y ago
    >By what mechanism could Google prevent themselves from ever being able to do this? The law.
    - gcbirzan 6y ago
      The law cannot prevent you from doing something, it can only punish you if you do it.
      - FigmentEngine 6y ago
        that is a nonsense statement. "doing something" = "do it" if you mean, cant stop you considering it, then thats fair, but then the point has no value?

withinboredom 6y ago

Speaking of pornhub... There used to be a way to see your pornhub search history even if you were always incognito, right on the site. It worked really well but I never figured out how it worked.

didibus 6y ago

How does this relate to Google though? Do you mean they should get rid of incognito mode? Cause it doesn't succeed at preventing all websites from tracking you? Or that they should be liable for making people believe it could when it couldn't?

unloco 6y ago
incognito mode is not made to hide you from the internet. it's made to hide your activities from being logged into your browser.

unloco 6y ago

I think a lot of the problem is, the average person doesnt know the difference between your browser not tracking your activity, and the internet tracking your activity. incognito mode is to hide from your browser history and tracking, it has nothing to do with the servers you visit.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

tppiotrowski 6y ago

How can Amazon see what you’re doing in incognito if you haven’t logged in? An incognito session is cleared of all cookies so you need to log in to establish your identity. It doesn’t stop Google Analytics from loading but will log you as a new user/session because previous session cookie is gone. Now, there is also fingerprinting techniques but at the time incognito mode was released these were not widely known and incognito meant: make me look like an anonymous user on the internet NOT make me invisible.