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Apple are also assholes to users in places (no own software, no simple customization, absurd seeming prices, extremely limited and proprietary connectivity) ...

Apple are also assholes to users in places (no own software, no simple customization, absurd seeming prices, extremely limited and proprietary connectivity) ... but they also protect them like nobody else and are unusually reasonable in places, like with their software update policy. It's a reason I keep thinking about replacing my current phone with a used iPhone X, though the 12 mini would be nicer for the screen size.

dkdbejwi383 6y ago
> no simple customization What do you mean by this, exactly? Not being funny, just don't understand this as a con. What would you like to customise, and why? How is being unable to do so harmful to users? Genuine questions, because I can't think of much I'd like to customise. Personally, I like not having options because it keeps things simple.
Zelphyr 6y ago
Apple isn't perfect, I'll admit that all day long. But, frankly, the "absurd prices" argument just doesn't hold water to me. I paid almost $3000 for the MacBook Pro I'm typing this on--eight years ago. Meanwhile, everyone I know that has had PC's have gone through at least two replacements during that time. A little over $300/year for a computer is a bargain. I pay three times more for Internet access!
- philliphaydon 6y ago
  I think you will find most people with PCs replace them because they think they need to. My friend just replaced his 12yo asus laptop which he had to keep plugged in to work as the battery no longer held a charge. People with apple products tend to keep better care of the products than the latter too.
  - prepend 6y ago
    > most people with PCs replace them because they think they need to Why is this important. Are you saying that PC users are stupider than Mac users or something? The end result is that PC users go through more hardware than Macs. I consider myself pretty decent with computers and use both. My five year old MacBook Air runs fine, I’ve gone through two PC laptops (that were always bigger) and they don’t tend to survive windows updates. I’ve even churned through yearly chrome books that seem to be made out of paper mache or something. Perhaps people are trainable to do the right thing. But it’s been decades, maybe we think about why this training fails on aggregate. In the meantime, my personal experience of cost/year being cheaper with Mac vs PC stands for me.
    - philliphaydon 6y ago
      > In the meantime, my personal experience of cost/year being cheaper with Mac vs PC stands for me. My personal experience is my all my laptops last. People have problems with macs. People have problems with PCs. Doesn’t mean any are better than the other. But people with pc laptops will more often update their laptop for next to no gain over what they already had.

dkdbejwi383 6y ago

> no simple customization What do you mean by this, exactly? Not being funny, just don't understand this as a con. What would you like to customise, and why? How is being unable to do so harmful to users? Genuine questions, because I can't think of much I'd like to customise. Personally, I like not having options because it keeps things simple.

Zelphyr 6y ago

Apple isn't perfect, I'll admit that all day long. But, frankly, the "absurd prices" argument just doesn't hold water to me. I paid almost $3000 for the MacBook Pro I'm typing this on--eight years ago. Meanwhile, everyone I know that has had PC's have gone through at least two replacements during that time. A little over $300/year for a computer is a bargain. I pay three times more for Internet access!

philliphaydon 6y ago
I think you will find most people with PCs replace them because they think they need to. My friend just replaced his 12yo asus laptop which he had to keep plugged in to work as the battery no longer held a charge. People with apple products tend to keep better care of the products than the latter too.
- prepend 6y ago
  > most people with PCs replace them because they think they need to Why is this important. Are you saying that PC users are stupider than Mac users or something? The end result is that PC users go through more hardware than Macs. I consider myself pretty decent with computers and use both. My five year old MacBook Air runs fine, I’ve gone through two PC laptops (that were always bigger) and they don’t tend to survive windows updates. I’ve even churned through yearly chrome books that seem to be made out of paper mache or something. Perhaps people are trainable to do the right thing. But it’s been decades, maybe we think about why this training fails on aggregate. In the meantime, my personal experience of cost/year being cheaper with Mac vs PC stands for me.
  - philliphaydon 6y ago
    > In the meantime, my personal experience of cost/year being cheaper with Mac vs PC stands for me. My personal experience is my all my laptops last. People have problems with macs. People have problems with PCs. Doesn’t mean any are better than the other. But people with pc laptops will more often update their laptop for next to no gain over what they already had.