7 ms·

I agree, my advice to any new parent would be to listen carefully to advice about how not to drown your child while bathing them, and how to make sure they're n

I agree, my advice to any new parent would be to listen carefully to advice about how not to drown your child while bathing them, and how to make sure they're not suffocated by their bedding. Both real issues where some simple practices avoid the small risk of an absolutely catastrophic outcome. Then take all other advice with a pinch of salt. Just follow your best instincts and do what seems right. Your child will be fine, plus you'll be more relaxed, you'll appreciate the time with them more. You'll have more time and emotional energy to understand and respond to how they are doing as well as how you and your partner are feeling, and your instincts will get better and better.

JKCalhoun 6y ago
For myself, the risk SIDS didn't even enter my calculus. (I confess I am a little skeptical that it exists at all.) Regardless, I perceived the emotional bonding with the mother & father to far outweigh anything else and so we shared our bed with our children until they were perhaps 1 year old or so. And even after, they moved into their own small bed just a foot from ours in the same bedroom for another year or so. I guess that was my "instinct". Although we received a crib as a gift, it just sat in another room, empty.
- eurusdac 6y ago
  I think SIDS is a real thing and there is clear evidence that not using pillows or excessive blankets in cribs has reduced deaths. I think sleeping with or not with your kid, is a much more complicated question and probably one where your instinct is right. After all, with a baby in the bed you can't help but be aware of its comfort, needs and amount of movement.
  - CodeGlitch 6y ago
    In the UK the NHS have posters and leaflets about how parents should NOT sleep with their baby as deaths have occurred from parents "lying on and suffocating their new born". Of course this from drugged-up and/or drunk parents. If you don't fall into the "bad parent" category you'll be fine.
    - cma 6y ago
      Or if you take ambien or something like that it might not be a good idea.
      - krageon 6y ago
        The post you are responding to mentioned drugged-up right there in the conclusion.
    - Talanes 6y ago
      I've woken up to nearly suffocating myself in blankets, completely sober. I wouldn't take that chance with myself in the bed.
  - christkv 6y ago
    We used sleep suits the first year to avoid the whole loose cloth issue
- a2tech 6y ago
  I very much believe SIDS is a real thing. I also think that many cases of SIDS are babies being smothered by soft cloth that bunches up and constricts their breathing and by accidentally smothered by their parents while they're deeply asleep. When kids are small I think co-sleeping is a great thing (where you have a small basinet or something similar next to your bed where you can reach out and touch your baby but they're safe from accidental crushing/smothering.
  - secabeen 6y ago
    > accidentally smothered by their parents while they're deeply asleep This seems unlikely. 10% of babies share a sleep surface with parents, up from 6.5% in 1993, yet SIDS deaths are down over the same period: https://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20180212/baby-suffocation-deaths-from-cosleeping-rise https://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20180212/baby-suffocation-de... https://www.cdc.gov/sids/data.htm https://www.cdc.gov/sids/data.htm
    - TylerE 6y ago
      Suffocation from co-sleeping is NOT SIDS. https://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20180212/baby-suffocation-deaths-from-cosleeping-rise#:~:text=All%20babies%20under%201%20year,it%20can't%20be%20spread https://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20180212/baby-suffocation-de....
      - Hallucinaut 6y ago
        Perhaps the parent comment is referring to a theory that parents reporting the situation around baby deaths as unexplained in order to deny blame or guilt for having placed the baby in the situation. There can't be much worse so it wouldn't surprise me if in the traumatic following days the recall isn't factual and unbiased.
    - faitswulff 6y ago
      Smothering is a much bigger problem if the parents in question drink alcohol before cosleeping.
- exporectomy 6y ago
  I completely agree. SIDS is just another safety thing like not letting it get strangled or stick a fork in the power point. But keeping them close and feeling secure is super important for them to develop independence and self-confidence later. Unfortunately, there's this perverse idea that rejecting your child will make them independent when it typically has the opposite effect.
jqgatsby 6y ago
Hey, wait, what is the advice to avoid drowning, other than not leaving them alone? Is there some subtle hazard I’m unaware of?
- eurusdac 6y ago
  Not really, it's just the simple advice not to let go of them or leave them is correct, common sense and important in that case.
- thebruce87m 6y ago
  Never leave them for even a second in the bath (drowning) and never leave them alone with food (choking).
  - mywittyname 6y ago
    It sounds so obvious, until your dog gets his head stuck in the ficus tree planter and you can hear him running around, destroying your entire living room. You have to resist that initial urge to go help him until you've cleaned up the 16 blueberry puffs you've been coaxing your child to eat.
  - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
    This is like saying "don't speed if you don't want a speeding ticket". Yes, you can use absolute qualifiers like "never" and "always" to stupid proof general advice to a greater extent than you can with phrases like "common sense" and "where reasonable" but that doesn't automatically make the advice any more useful.. I'm perfectly fine with the size of the drowning risk that comes with spending ~1min removing something from the oven when the timer goes off and other reasonable allowances like that. Of course I'm not gonna stop and watch TV with an infant in the sink. And if traffic's going 85 I'm going 85 but I won't be the first person going 85.
    - zamfi 6y ago
      It's not like that. Everyone knows the risk of a speeding ticket comes with speeding. Not everyone knows that it takes 20 seconds for a baby to drown in a bathtub. > I'm perfectly fine with the size of the drowning risk that comes with spending ~1min removing something from the oven when the timer goes off Completely making up numbers here, say you do this for every 20-minute bath, your child bathes 1x/day, and they fall over in such a way that they might drown were you not there once every 10000 baths. Doing the math... 5% chance of being absent at the critical moment * 1/10000 baths * 365 baths/year = 0.18% chance of death in first year of life. You may be willing to take that risk, but given the 4 million infants born each year in the US, that would be 7,300 infant deaths from drowning in the bathtub annually -- so as a societal rule, saving 7,300 infants a year seems worth the use of the word "never". The actual number of deaths attributed to bathtub drowning each year is much lower; I'm glad the vast majority of parents appear to take "never" to heart.
kinghtown 6y ago
Father here. I agree. So much of the parenting advice I see dips into micromanaging and min/maxing to an almost paranoid degree. Just learn about what could kill them in the first year and avoid that. Really, six months and under is the true window for SIDS with freak occurrences. Definitely be on the lookout for any poisonous cleaning products While you’re at it and put them high off the ground. The pro parents who did it all before you are super annoying. I’ve had to politely listen to questionable advice many times. I much prefer people like you who get it. You got to trust your instincts about your own kids. There is broad advice which applies to everyone but everyone’s kid is a little different from the norm as well and as a parent we know our kids better than anyone else.
- exporectomy 6y ago
  Trusting your instincts is how intergenerational cycles of abuse and neglect happen. If you were raised well, then yes, otherwise you have to work consciously to reject your harmful instincts.
  - kinghtown 6y ago
    Well, sure but I’m advocating to trust your instincts in terms of their general health and well-being. Abuse or gross neglect are entirely different matters. Abusive parents are probably not going to be online doing heavy research on what is the optimum thing to do as a parent. They probably just feel tired and bitter about their children, or worse. A lot of modern, new wave parenting to me feels an awful lot like meddling in natural child development. Like too much of a good thing, helicopter parenting.
    - exporectomy 6y ago
      I'm talking about hardly visible emotional abuse and neglect, not some extreme criminal activity that only really bad people do. For example, not loving your child and going through the motions of looking after it without really caring. Or inconsistently responding to it with dismissal sometimes and kindness other times so it can't really trust you and feel secure. That can lead to harmful attachment styles as an adult.
jl6 6y ago
Generally agree, except I’m not sure there is a bright line between the obviously-worthwhile precautions you mention and the paranoid overprecautions that might themselves carry harm. Seatbelts... yes. Choking first aid... yes. Healthy eating, talking to them frequently... probably? Lots of sunlight and fresh air... maybe?
- toxik 6y ago
  To be honest, the baby’s most important resource is the parents themselves. Sunlight and fresh air is good for that at least. Similarly, let somebody else take care of your baby every now and then so you can connect with your partner!
- exporectomy 6y ago
  About to be a parent and the main conclusion I've come to is that being consistently reliable, caring and responsive to any distress the baby has in the first 6-9 months is number one more important thing to keep in mind. Those physical health things are either obvious or hardly matter but making a kid who grows up to experience a lifetime of emotional suffering due to poor attachment styles or mental health problems is extremely common and bad. The world is filled with these walking wounded who can't function well, can't form stable relationships, commit suicide, become drug abusers, etc. Far more common than SIDS or choking to death.
  - ericd 6y ago
    I'm curious, does your conclusion preclude sleep training, which frequently involves some amount of "crying it out"?
    - exporectomy 6y ago
      Yes, it precludes it in that early age range. I was taught this in parenting class and read it in a library book. I've never heard anyone advocating for leaving your baby alone to cry when it's that young except as a "least bad" choice if the parent is losing control of themselves and might shake the baby in frustration/anger. It's probably different when they're older but I'm not up to that yet.
damontal 6y ago
There’s also a right and a wrong way to install a car seat. Some local fire departments will check your installation for you.

JKCalhoun 6y ago

For myself, the risk SIDS didn't even enter my calculus. (I confess I am a little skeptical that it exists at all.) Regardless, I perceived the emotional bonding with the mother & father to far outweigh anything else and so we shared our bed with our children until they were perhaps 1 year old or so. And even after, they moved into their own small bed just a foot from ours in the same bedroom for another year or so. I guess that was my "instinct". Although we received a crib as a gift, it just sat in another room, empty.

eurusdac 6y ago
I think SIDS is a real thing and there is clear evidence that not using pillows or excessive blankets in cribs has reduced deaths. I think sleeping with or not with your kid, is a much more complicated question and probably one where your instinct is right. After all, with a baby in the bed you can't help but be aware of its comfort, needs and amount of movement.
- CodeGlitch 6y ago
  In the UK the NHS have posters and leaflets about how parents should NOT sleep with their baby as deaths have occurred from parents "lying on and suffocating their new born". Of course this from drugged-up and/or drunk parents. If you don't fall into the "bad parent" category you'll be fine.
  - cma 6y ago
    Or if you take ambien or something like that it might not be a good idea.
    - krageon 6y ago
      The post you are responding to mentioned drugged-up right there in the conclusion.
  - Talanes 6y ago
    I've woken up to nearly suffocating myself in blankets, completely sober. I wouldn't take that chance with myself in the bed.
- christkv 6y ago
  We used sleep suits the first year to avoid the whole loose cloth issue
a2tech 6y ago
I very much believe SIDS is a real thing. I also think that many cases of SIDS are babies being smothered by soft cloth that bunches up and constricts their breathing and by accidentally smothered by their parents while they're deeply asleep. When kids are small I think co-sleeping is a great thing (where you have a small basinet or something similar next to your bed where you can reach out and touch your baby but they're safe from accidental crushing/smothering.
- secabeen 6y ago
  > accidentally smothered by their parents while they're deeply asleep This seems unlikely. 10% of babies share a sleep surface with parents, up from 6.5% in 1993, yet SIDS deaths are down over the same period: https://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20180212/baby-suffocation-deaths-from-cosleeping-rise https://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20180212/baby-suffocation-de... https://www.cdc.gov/sids/data.htm https://www.cdc.gov/sids/data.htm
  - TylerE 6y ago
    Suffocation from co-sleeping is NOT SIDS. https://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20180212/baby-suffocation-deaths-from-cosleeping-rise#:~:text=All%20babies%20under%201%20year,it%20can't%20be%20spread https://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20180212/baby-suffocation-de....
    - Hallucinaut 6y ago
      Perhaps the parent comment is referring to a theory that parents reporting the situation around baby deaths as unexplained in order to deny blame or guilt for having placed the baby in the situation. There can't be much worse so it wouldn't surprise me if in the traumatic following days the recall isn't factual and unbiased.
  - faitswulff 6y ago
    Smothering is a much bigger problem if the parents in question drink alcohol before cosleeping.
exporectomy 6y ago
I completely agree. SIDS is just another safety thing like not letting it get strangled or stick a fork in the power point. But keeping them close and feeling secure is super important for them to develop independence and self-confidence later. Unfortunately, there's this perverse idea that rejecting your child will make them independent when it typically has the opposite effect.

jqgatsby 6y ago

Hey, wait, what is the advice to avoid drowning, other than not leaving them alone? Is there some subtle hazard I’m unaware of?

eurusdac 6y ago
Not really, it's just the simple advice not to let go of them or leave them is correct, common sense and important in that case.
thebruce87m 6y ago
Never leave them for even a second in the bath (drowning) and never leave them alone with food (choking).
- mywittyname 6y ago
  It sounds so obvious, until your dog gets his head stuck in the ficus tree planter and you can hear him running around, destroying your entire living room. You have to resist that initial urge to go help him until you've cleaned up the 16 blueberry puffs you've been coaxing your child to eat.
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  This is like saying "don't speed if you don't want a speeding ticket". Yes, you can use absolute qualifiers like "never" and "always" to stupid proof general advice to a greater extent than you can with phrases like "common sense" and "where reasonable" but that doesn't automatically make the advice any more useful.. I'm perfectly fine with the size of the drowning risk that comes with spending ~1min removing something from the oven when the timer goes off and other reasonable allowances like that. Of course I'm not gonna stop and watch TV with an infant in the sink. And if traffic's going 85 I'm going 85 but I won't be the first person going 85.
  - zamfi 6y ago
    It's not like that. Everyone knows the risk of a speeding ticket comes with speeding. Not everyone knows that it takes 20 seconds for a baby to drown in a bathtub. > I'm perfectly fine with the size of the drowning risk that comes with spending ~1min removing something from the oven when the timer goes off Completely making up numbers here, say you do this for every 20-minute bath, your child bathes 1x/day, and they fall over in such a way that they might drown were you not there once every 10000 baths. Doing the math... 5% chance of being absent at the critical moment * 1/10000 baths * 365 baths/year = 0.18% chance of death in first year of life. You may be willing to take that risk, but given the 4 million infants born each year in the US, that would be 7,300 infant deaths from drowning in the bathtub annually -- so as a societal rule, saving 7,300 infants a year seems worth the use of the word "never". The actual number of deaths attributed to bathtub drowning each year is much lower; I'm glad the vast majority of parents appear to take "never" to heart.

kinghtown 6y ago

Father here. I agree. So much of the parenting advice I see dips into micromanaging and min/maxing to an almost paranoid degree. Just learn about what could kill them in the first year and avoid that. Really, six months and under is the true window for SIDS with freak occurrences. Definitely be on the lookout for any poisonous cleaning products While you’re at it and put them high off the ground. The pro parents who did it all before you are super annoying. I’ve had to politely listen to questionable advice many times. I much prefer people like you who get it. You got to trust your instincts about your own kids. There is broad advice which applies to everyone but everyone’s kid is a little different from the norm as well and as a parent we know our kids better than anyone else.

exporectomy 6y ago
Trusting your instincts is how intergenerational cycles of abuse and neglect happen. If you were raised well, then yes, otherwise you have to work consciously to reject your harmful instincts.
- kinghtown 6y ago
  Well, sure but I’m advocating to trust your instincts in terms of their general health and well-being. Abuse or gross neglect are entirely different matters. Abusive parents are probably not going to be online doing heavy research on what is the optimum thing to do as a parent. They probably just feel tired and bitter about their children, or worse. A lot of modern, new wave parenting to me feels an awful lot like meddling in natural child development. Like too much of a good thing, helicopter parenting.
  - exporectomy 6y ago
    I'm talking about hardly visible emotional abuse and neglect, not some extreme criminal activity that only really bad people do. For example, not loving your child and going through the motions of looking after it without really caring. Or inconsistently responding to it with dismissal sometimes and kindness other times so it can't really trust you and feel secure. That can lead to harmful attachment styles as an adult.

jl6 6y ago

Generally agree, except I’m not sure there is a bright line between the obviously-worthwhile precautions you mention and the paranoid overprecautions that might themselves carry harm. Seatbelts... yes. Choking first aid... yes. Healthy eating, talking to them frequently... probably? Lots of sunlight and fresh air... maybe?

toxik 6y ago
To be honest, the baby’s most important resource is the parents themselves. Sunlight and fresh air is good for that at least. Similarly, let somebody else take care of your baby every now and then so you can connect with your partner!
exporectomy 6y ago
About to be a parent and the main conclusion I've come to is that being consistently reliable, caring and responsive to any distress the baby has in the first 6-9 months is number one more important thing to keep in mind. Those physical health things are either obvious or hardly matter but making a kid who grows up to experience a lifetime of emotional suffering due to poor attachment styles or mental health problems is extremely common and bad. The world is filled with these walking wounded who can't function well, can't form stable relationships, commit suicide, become drug abusers, etc. Far more common than SIDS or choking to death.
- ericd 6y ago
  I'm curious, does your conclusion preclude sleep training, which frequently involves some amount of "crying it out"?
  - exporectomy 6y ago
    Yes, it precludes it in that early age range. I was taught this in parenting class and read it in a library book. I've never heard anyone advocating for leaving your baby alone to cry when it's that young except as a "least bad" choice if the parent is losing control of themselves and might shake the baby in frustration/anger. It's probably different when they're older but I'm not up to that yet.

damontal 6y ago

There’s also a right and a wrong way to install a car seat. Some local fire departments will check your installation for you.