8 ms·

> you've apparently run into an extreme edge case alongside some poor luck. 'extreme edge case'? Like Running Garage Band and going to sound settings? Or reins

> you've apparently run into an extreme edge case alongside some poor luck. 'extreme edge case'? Like Running Garage Band and going to sound settings? Or reinstalling OS? Which of those is extreme? May be it's not a 'poor luck' may be it's a poor design.

leesalminen 6y ago
I think the parent is saying you’re having bad hardware luck manifesting as glitches in software. I just tried what you described with Settings+GarageBand and was not able to reproduce on my M1 MBA.
- lovelyviking 6y ago
  Try it with bluetooth speaker connected when Garage Band is playing recorded track ..
- mistersquid 6y ago
  > you’re having bad hardware luck manifesting as glitches in software This was precisely my experience back in December. I purchased a stock M1 MacBook Pro as well as a customized M1 MacBook Pro, so I could set up the OS as I wanted and migrate Data and settings once the customized Device arrived. The first device behaved as expected: fast performance, responsive UI, cool operating temperature. The second device, however, had issues with UI latency, beachballing Finder operations, and inexplicable slow downs. I tried installing and reinstalling and remigrating the OS, eventually discovering that one or both of my users would be unable to even login to the system. Further analysis revealed that the communication between the T2 chip and the hard drive (or some aspect of the trust a computer system) was not operating properly. I'm not technical enough to detail the exact problem, but it was most certainly a hardware issue or a hardware issue related to the incomplete erasing and reformatting of the M1 MacBook Pro's hard drive. I returned both devices, waited a couple of weeks, and purchased a single customized MacBook Air. This MacBook Air in my experience actually outperforms both previous M1 MacBook Pros. I don't have benchmarks nor do I have the other devices to compare directly, but it seems that this MacBook Air is much more ready for prime time then my mid-December MacBook Pros.
  - coldtea 6y ago
    >Further analysis revealed that the communication between the T2 chip and the hard drive (or some aspect of the trust a computer system) was not operating properly. Well, there's no T2 chip on M1 macs...
    - mistersquid 6y ago
      > Well, there's no T2 chip on M1 macs... Hm. I thought Touch ID was based on T2. [0] Definitely expert-level knowledgeable about M1 security domain. [0] Def not T2. Apple calls the Touch ID chip (?) “Secure Enclave” https://support.apple.com/guide/security/secure-enclave-sec59b0b31ff/web https://support.apple.com/guide/security/secure-enclave-sec5...
      - coldtea 6y ago
        >Hm. I thought Touch ID was based on T2. [0] It is, on Intel. Not on AS.
  - kergonath 6y ago
    From my experience there is no point dealing with issue on brand new Macs. The best is to send it back if you’re within the 14 days return window, or take it to a store to get it fixed. It’s not as smooth as it used to be because there is so much in M1 devices that’s different from previous generations, and support people are not necessarily used to it yet. But customer support is consistently great, all things considered.
LeoNatan25 6y ago
People seem to think that if they don’t experience a bug, it’s an “extreme edge case”, or that if they don’t experience it, it’s not an important bug.
- matwood 6y ago
  The reverse is also true. People think if they experience a bug, then everyone experiences the bug and it's the most important bug ever. Everyones setup and use case is unique. All the many interactions can lead to fairly unique bugs. Even if two people think they see the same bug, it could be two different bugs causing the same symptom. Let's take the bugs around re-installing that have been popping up on HN lately. How many people buy a brand new machine and the first thing they do is wipe it and re-install? I don't personally know anyone who does that, it's certainly not something I've ever done with any of my Macs over the last 20 or so odd years. So while I think bugs around re-installing are important and need to get fixed, they are not something that a majority of users will run into this early in the m1's life.
  - bordercases 6y ago
    In this case I doubt "two HN users doing daily development and production on a new Mac" are so unique as to be incomparable. And arguing that certain users are in a minority such that they can be ignored - without hard proof mind you, and keeping in mind that knowledge work is squarely the demographic for people requiring high performance processors in the Apple space (or else they wouldn't push that angle so hard in their advertising) - when the functionality was stable on previous platforms much older than the so-called cutting edge, is justifying a regression in functionality by blaming user expectations. This is consumer hostile.
    - matwood 6y ago
      > In this case I doubt "two HN users doing daily development and production on a new Mac" are so unique as to be incomparable. I would have argued the opposite. Every developer I know, myself included, tweaks every last aspect of their machine to their exact liking - even on a Mac. And I didn't say they should be ignored, and said the opposite. > So while I think bugs around re-installing are important and need to get fixed The point is it's a bug impacting a subset of users and needs to get fixed. IMO, it's not one worthy of multiple HN front page posts, but here we are :)

leesalminen 6y ago

I think the parent is saying you’re having bad hardware luck manifesting as glitches in software. I just tried what you described with Settings+GarageBand and was not able to reproduce on my M1 MBA.

lovelyviking 6y ago
Try it with bluetooth speaker connected when Garage Band is playing recorded track ..
mistersquid 6y ago
> you’re having bad hardware luck manifesting as glitches in software This was precisely my experience back in December. I purchased a stock M1 MacBook Pro as well as a customized M1 MacBook Pro, so I could set up the OS as I wanted and migrate Data and settings once the customized Device arrived. The first device behaved as expected: fast performance, responsive UI, cool operating temperature. The second device, however, had issues with UI latency, beachballing Finder operations, and inexplicable slow downs. I tried installing and reinstalling and remigrating the OS, eventually discovering that one or both of my users would be unable to even login to the system. Further analysis revealed that the communication between the T2 chip and the hard drive (or some aspect of the trust a computer system) was not operating properly. I'm not technical enough to detail the exact problem, but it was most certainly a hardware issue or a hardware issue related to the incomplete erasing and reformatting of the M1 MacBook Pro's hard drive. I returned both devices, waited a couple of weeks, and purchased a single customized MacBook Air. This MacBook Air in my experience actually outperforms both previous M1 MacBook Pros. I don't have benchmarks nor do I have the other devices to compare directly, but it seems that this MacBook Air is much more ready for prime time then my mid-December MacBook Pros.
- coldtea 6y ago
  >Further analysis revealed that the communication between the T2 chip and the hard drive (or some aspect of the trust a computer system) was not operating properly. Well, there's no T2 chip on M1 macs...
  - mistersquid 6y ago
    > Well, there's no T2 chip on M1 macs... Hm. I thought Touch ID was based on T2. [0] Definitely expert-level knowledgeable about M1 security domain. [0] Def not T2. Apple calls the Touch ID chip (?) “Secure Enclave” https://support.apple.com/guide/security/secure-enclave-sec59b0b31ff/web https://support.apple.com/guide/security/secure-enclave-sec5...
    - coldtea 6y ago
      >Hm. I thought Touch ID was based on T2. [0] It is, on Intel. Not on AS.
- kergonath 6y ago
  From my experience there is no point dealing with issue on brand new Macs. The best is to send it back if you’re within the 14 days return window, or take it to a store to get it fixed. It’s not as smooth as it used to be because there is so much in M1 devices that’s different from previous generations, and support people are not necessarily used to it yet. But customer support is consistently great, all things considered.

LeoNatan25 6y ago

People seem to think that if they don’t experience a bug, it’s an “extreme edge case”, or that if they don’t experience it, it’s not an important bug.

matwood 6y ago
The reverse is also true. People think if they experience a bug, then everyone experiences the bug and it's the most important bug ever. Everyones setup and use case is unique. All the many interactions can lead to fairly unique bugs. Even if two people think they see the same bug, it could be two different bugs causing the same symptom. Let's take the bugs around re-installing that have been popping up on HN lately. How many people buy a brand new machine and the first thing they do is wipe it and re-install? I don't personally know anyone who does that, it's certainly not something I've ever done with any of my Macs over the last 20 or so odd years. So while I think bugs around re-installing are important and need to get fixed, they are not something that a majority of users will run into this early in the m1's life.
- bordercases 6y ago
  In this case I doubt "two HN users doing daily development and production on a new Mac" are so unique as to be incomparable. And arguing that certain users are in a minority such that they can be ignored - without hard proof mind you, and keeping in mind that knowledge work is squarely the demographic for people requiring high performance processors in the Apple space (or else they wouldn't push that angle so hard in their advertising) - when the functionality was stable on previous platforms much older than the so-called cutting edge, is justifying a regression in functionality by blaming user expectations. This is consumer hostile.
  - matwood 6y ago
    > In this case I doubt "two HN users doing daily development and production on a new Mac" are so unique as to be incomparable. I would have argued the opposite. Every developer I know, myself included, tweaks every last aspect of their machine to their exact liking - even on a Mac. And I didn't say they should be ignored, and said the opposite. > So while I think bugs around re-installing are important and need to get fixed The point is it's a bug impacting a subset of users and needs to get fixed. IMO, it's not one worthy of multiple HN front page posts, but here we are :)