5 ms·

> This is the buggiest thing I EVER had. Even the screenshot doesn't work properly. It reacts to(CmdShift-4) after ~2!!! second delay while on previous Mac it w

by messe 6y ago

> This is the buggiest thing I EVER had. Even the screenshot doesn't work properly. It reacts to(CmdShift-4) after ~2!!! second delay while on previous Mac it was instant. That's not an issue I've experienced. Screenshot works instantly for me (both CmdShift-3 and CmdShift-4). > "Very fast" some say? I still wish to see it, because so far it feels just like the one I had before or slower! I am not talking about benchmarks, I am talking about day to day experience. What are you running? I'm comparing my M1 air to two a year and old MBP (which admittedly has half the RAM), and it flies in comparison; both in perceived and actual performance. The MBP has consistently latency in the UI animations, which makes using it a pain; and the fan constantly blares at the slightest hint of CPU activity. > Goodness, can Apple make something that 'works' these days? For most people, it seems to be working for them. So it looks like they can make something that 'works', but you've apparently run into an extreme edge case alongside some poor luck.

lovelyviking 6y ago
> you've apparently run into an extreme edge case alongside some poor luck. 'extreme edge case'? Like Running Garage Band and going to sound settings? Or reinstalling OS? Which of those is extreme? May be it's not a 'poor luck' may be it's a poor design.
- leesalminen 6y ago
  I think the parent is saying you’re having bad hardware luck manifesting as glitches in software. I just tried what you described with Settings+GarageBand and was not able to reproduce on my M1 MBA.
  - lovelyviking 6y ago
    Try it with bluetooth speaker connected when Garage Band is playing recorded track ..
  - mistersquid 6y ago
    > you’re having bad hardware luck manifesting as glitches in software This was precisely my experience back in December. I purchased a stock M1 MacBook Pro as well as a customized M1 MacBook Pro, so I could set up the OS as I wanted and migrate Data and settings once the customized Device arrived. The first device behaved as expected: fast performance, responsive UI, cool operating temperature. The second device, however, had issues with UI latency, beachballing Finder operations, and inexplicable slow downs. I tried installing and reinstalling and remigrating the OS, eventually discovering that one or both of my users would be unable to even login to the system. Further analysis revealed that the communication between the T2 chip and the hard drive (or some aspect of the trust a computer system) was not operating properly. I'm not technical enough to detail the exact problem, but it was most certainly a hardware issue or a hardware issue related to the incomplete erasing and reformatting of the M1 MacBook Pro's hard drive. I returned both devices, waited a couple of weeks, and purchased a single customized MacBook Air. This MacBook Air in my experience actually outperforms both previous M1 MacBook Pros. I don't have benchmarks nor do I have the other devices to compare directly, but it seems that this MacBook Air is much more ready for prime time then my mid-December MacBook Pros.
    - coldtea 6y ago
      >Further analysis revealed that the communication between the T2 chip and the hard drive (or some aspect of the trust a computer system) was not operating properly. Well, there's no T2 chip on M1 macs...
      - mistersquid 6y ago
        > Well, there's no T2 chip on M1 macs... Hm. I thought Touch ID was based on T2. [0] Definitely expert-level knowledgeable about M1 security domain. [0] Def not T2. Apple calls the Touch ID chip (?) “Secure Enclave” https://support.apple.com/guide/security/secure-enclave-sec59b0b31ff/web https://support.apple.com/guide/security/secure-enclave-sec5...
        coldtea 6y ago
        >Hm. I thought Touch ID was based on T2. [0] It is, on Intel. Not on AS.
- LeoNatan25 6y ago
  People seem to think that if they don’t experience a bug, it’s an “extreme edge case”, or that if they don’t experience it, it’s not an important bug.
  - matwood 6y ago
    The reverse is also true. People think if they experience a bug, then everyone experiences the bug and it's the most important bug ever. Everyones setup and use case is unique. All the many interactions can lead to fairly unique bugs. Even if two people think they see the same bug, it could be two different bugs causing the same symptom. Let's take the bugs around re-installing that have been popping up on HN lately. How many people buy a brand new machine and the first thing they do is wipe it and re-install? I don't personally know anyone who does that, it's certainly not something I've ever done with any of my Macs over the last 20 or so odd years. So while I think bugs around re-installing are important and need to get fixed, they are not something that a majority of users will run into this early in the m1's life.
    - bordercases 6y ago
      In this case I doubt "two HN users doing daily development and production on a new Mac" are so unique as to be incomparable. And arguing that certain users are in a minority such that they can be ignored - without hard proof mind you, and keeping in mind that knowledge work is squarely the demographic for people requiring high performance processors in the Apple space (or else they wouldn't push that angle so hard in their advertising) - when the functionality was stable on previous platforms much older than the so-called cutting edge, is justifying a regression in functionality by blaming user expectations. This is consumer hostile.
      - matwood 6y ago
        > In this case I doubt "two HN users doing daily development and production on a new Mac" are so unique as to be incomparable. I would have argued the opposite. Every developer I know, myself included, tweaks every last aspect of their machine to their exact liking - even on a Mac. And I didn't say they should be ignored, and said the opposite. > So while I think bugs around re-installing are important and need to get fixed The point is it's a bug impacting a subset of users and needs to get fixed. IMO, it's not one worthy of multiple HN front page posts, but here we are :)
JKCalhoun 6y ago
> That's not an issue I've experienced. Screenshot works instantly for me (both CmdShift-3 and CmdShift-4). I have seen it take a few seconds to appear on the Desktop, but I thought that was the new Mac OS thing: the little thumbnail of your screenshot appearing during that delay in the lower right of the screen, not a hardware-specific thing.
- messe 6y ago
  Oh is that what they meant? Yeah, it takes a few seconds to appear on the desktop. You can click the thumbnail to edit it first.
  - jiveturkey 6y ago
    you can swipe the thumbnail to save without waiting
  - lovelyviking 6y ago
    No, In my case I meant, pressing Cmd-Shift-4 takes ±1-2 secs for cross-cursor to appear before you actually take the screenshot. Now I've checked taking with screenshot of Cmd-Shift-3 and it 'Takes' it after some delay. Not instantly like before. It saves it with additional delay like you describe, but it's something else. Still dumb and annoying in my opinion but I believe you can turn it off somewhere in GUI or with the command in terminal. The next screenshot you take can be faster. But not always. There is some loading happening I believe before the first one. Than it works fast but Then it unloads something sometimes and sometimes not. I do not think it's a hardware problem like some say.
    - filchermcurr 6y ago
      For anybody wondering about the terminal command, you can disable the thumbnail and make it instantaneously save with: defaults write com.apple.screencapture show-thumbnail -bool false I can't speak to the rest of the slowness. But that thumbnail sure is annoying.

by messe 6y ago

lovelyviking 6y ago

> you've apparently run into an extreme edge case alongside some poor luck. 'extreme edge case'? Like Running Garage Band and going to sound settings? Or reinstalling OS? Which of those is extreme? May be it's not a 'poor luck' may be it's a poor design.

leesalminen 6y ago
I think the parent is saying you’re having bad hardware luck manifesting as glitches in software. I just tried what you described with Settings+GarageBand and was not able to reproduce on my M1 MBA.
- lovelyviking 6y ago
  Try it with bluetooth speaker connected when Garage Band is playing recorded track ..
- mistersquid 6y ago
  > you’re having bad hardware luck manifesting as glitches in software This was precisely my experience back in December. I purchased a stock M1 MacBook Pro as well as a customized M1 MacBook Pro, so I could set up the OS as I wanted and migrate Data and settings once the customized Device arrived. The first device behaved as expected: fast performance, responsive UI, cool operating temperature. The second device, however, had issues with UI latency, beachballing Finder operations, and inexplicable slow downs. I tried installing and reinstalling and remigrating the OS, eventually discovering that one or both of my users would be unable to even login to the system. Further analysis revealed that the communication between the T2 chip and the hard drive (or some aspect of the trust a computer system) was not operating properly. I'm not technical enough to detail the exact problem, but it was most certainly a hardware issue or a hardware issue related to the incomplete erasing and reformatting of the M1 MacBook Pro's hard drive. I returned both devices, waited a couple of weeks, and purchased a single customized MacBook Air. This MacBook Air in my experience actually outperforms both previous M1 MacBook Pros. I don't have benchmarks nor do I have the other devices to compare directly, but it seems that this MacBook Air is much more ready for prime time then my mid-December MacBook Pros.
  - coldtea 6y ago
    >Further analysis revealed that the communication between the T2 chip and the hard drive (or some aspect of the trust a computer system) was not operating properly. Well, there's no T2 chip on M1 macs...
    - mistersquid 6y ago
      > Well, there's no T2 chip on M1 macs... Hm. I thought Touch ID was based on T2. [0] Definitely expert-level knowledgeable about M1 security domain. [0] Def not T2. Apple calls the Touch ID chip (?) “Secure Enclave” https://support.apple.com/guide/security/secure-enclave-sec59b0b31ff/web https://support.apple.com/guide/security/secure-enclave-sec5...
      - coldtea 6y ago
        >Hm. I thought Touch ID was based on T2. [0] It is, on Intel. Not on AS.
LeoNatan25 6y ago
People seem to think that if they don’t experience a bug, it’s an “extreme edge case”, or that if they don’t experience it, it’s not an important bug.
- matwood 6y ago
  The reverse is also true. People think if they experience a bug, then everyone experiences the bug and it's the most important bug ever. Everyones setup and use case is unique. All the many interactions can lead to fairly unique bugs. Even if two people think they see the same bug, it could be two different bugs causing the same symptom. Let's take the bugs around re-installing that have been popping up on HN lately. How many people buy a brand new machine and the first thing they do is wipe it and re-install? I don't personally know anyone who does that, it's certainly not something I've ever done with any of my Macs over the last 20 or so odd years. So while I think bugs around re-installing are important and need to get fixed, they are not something that a majority of users will run into this early in the m1's life.
  - bordercases 6y ago
    In this case I doubt "two HN users doing daily development and production on a new Mac" are so unique as to be incomparable. And arguing that certain users are in a minority such that they can be ignored - without hard proof mind you, and keeping in mind that knowledge work is squarely the demographic for people requiring high performance processors in the Apple space (or else they wouldn't push that angle so hard in their advertising) - when the functionality was stable on previous platforms much older than the so-called cutting edge, is justifying a regression in functionality by blaming user expectations. This is consumer hostile.
    - matwood 6y ago
      > In this case I doubt "two HN users doing daily development and production on a new Mac" are so unique as to be incomparable. I would have argued the opposite. Every developer I know, myself included, tweaks every last aspect of their machine to their exact liking - even on a Mac. And I didn't say they should be ignored, and said the opposite. > So while I think bugs around re-installing are important and need to get fixed The point is it's a bug impacting a subset of users and needs to get fixed. IMO, it's not one worthy of multiple HN front page posts, but here we are :)

JKCalhoun 6y ago

> That's not an issue I've experienced. Screenshot works instantly for me (both CmdShift-3 and CmdShift-4). I have seen it take a few seconds to appear on the Desktop, but I thought that was the new Mac OS thing: the little thumbnail of your screenshot appearing during that delay in the lower right of the screen, not a hardware-specific thing.

messe 6y ago
Oh is that what they meant? Yeah, it takes a few seconds to appear on the desktop. You can click the thumbnail to edit it first.
- jiveturkey 6y ago
  you can swipe the thumbnail to save without waiting
- lovelyviking 6y ago
  No, In my case I meant, pressing Cmd-Shift-4 takes ±1-2 secs for cross-cursor to appear before you actually take the screenshot. Now I've checked taking with screenshot of Cmd-Shift-3 and it 'Takes' it after some delay. Not instantly like before. It saves it with additional delay like you describe, but it's something else. Still dumb and annoying in my opinion but I believe you can turn it off somewhere in GUI or with the command in terminal. The next screenshot you take can be faster. But not always. There is some loading happening I believe before the first one. Than it works fast but Then it unloads something sometimes and sometimes not. I do not think it's a hardware problem like some say.
  - filchermcurr 6y ago
    For anybody wondering about the terminal command, you can disable the thumbnail and make it instantaneously save with: defaults write com.apple.screencapture show-thumbnail -bool false I can't speak to the rest of the slowness. But that thumbnail sure is annoying.