10 ms·

I think a lot of the hype around mechanical keyboards in general is overblown. I had a period of transitioning to mechanical keyboards. I couldn't get used to t

I think a lot of the hype around mechanical keyboards in general is overblown. I had a period of transitioning to mechanical keyboards. I couldn't get used to the high-rise keys and long travel times which made my wrists hurt and made typing a chore. I kept convincing myself that I just had the wrong type of switch, so I changed keyboards every few months seeking that perfect feeling. The closest I got was low-profile blue switches, those were actually fun and something I could use for a daily driver. In the end however, I went back to a chiclet keyboard. It's quiet, travel time is short and I can type on it comfortable for long periods of time.

westoncb 6y ago
I've gone through a similar experience. I like the other concepts in keyboards like Ergodox/Moonlander etc., but as far as actual key-press-feel, none of these enthusiast keyboards come close to e.g. macbook keys. I think my ideal keyboard would be something like the Moonlander + the keys on the new macbook: a little bit of a click but basically zero travel.
- KptMarchewa 6y ago
  It's wild how tastes differ. I absolutely abhor the keypress of macbook keyboards, even more than the one in extremely cheap Acer laptop from ~2009.
- GuB-42 6y ago
  I think it is all about preference. I hated the new MacBook keys the instant I tried them. It felt like I was typing directly on the table. I had no problem with accuracy, but I found it really uncomfortable. I guess it is like a mattress, some people prefer it firm and others prefer it soft. I have a Topre keyboard BTW, which I chose by going to a shop and trying plenty of different keyboards without looking at the price and specs. Unfortunately, I ended up preferring the most expensive one...
- austinkhale 6y ago
  Switching to an Ergodox with a Dvorak layout changed my life. I used to have crazy pain after 6 - 8 hours of typing. Now I can easily go 12 - 14 with no issues whatsoever. Obviously that is not healthy or sustainable in the long term for other reasons but it’s a huge weight off my shoulders not thinking I’m ruining my wrists trying to meet a launch date.
KozmoNau7 6y ago
I could never get used to mechanical keyboards either, so I've been using a Logitech UltraX Premium for ages[1] now, a laptop-style scissor-switch design that rivals my Thinkpad X220 for typing feel. Honestly, I have no idea what will replace it when/if it finally gives up the ghost. [1] I bought it back when USB keyboards were the hot new thing to have, back in the stone age.
- marianov 6y ago
  Best keyboard I ever used is my current Thinkpad x220. I would need something with a better CPU tough
  - KozmoNau7 6y ago
    I'm still hanging on to my X220i with the i3, upgraded to 8GB RAM, SSD, 5GHz WLAN and a 9-cell battery. It's not a speed machine, but it's still adequate for everyday use.
m463 6y ago
I have a topre keyboard. It is the most solid keyboard I've used and love it. I bought the realforce RGB. I didn't really care about the RGB, but it's nice to turn on a solid color dimly so I can find the keyboard in the dark. It also has an adjustable actuation point, so you can make it less or more sensitive. I keep it above the point where resting fingers on the keys can set it off. I could probably tune the actuation point higher on the home keys and make all the rest lighter. I've tried lots of other keyboards including cherry keys, and did not feel as solid. I think it's because the topre keys move up and down in a plastic cylinder that prevents side to side wiggling. I seem to type more accurately. My previous favorite keyboard was an apple keyboard (older non-flat version) and I thought it was great. Then after getting used to the topre keyboard, I laughed - it didn't feel very good.
- Syzygies 6y ago
  I also have a Topre keyboard, the Leopold FC660C, with a Hasu FC660C Controller supporting QMK firmware. The 12 keys closest to my non-pinky fingers are all tap/hold, so for example my hands don't move for control sequences. Alternate keymaps like Dvorak make sense if one needs to optimize letters for composing words. Shortening finger travel for programmers is an entirely different ball of wax, with many solutions involving QMK firmware. I had bought or built various mechanical keyboards, before settling on Topre switches. Topre switches are an obsession killer; many people find them vastly superior to any mechanical switch, and the customization options are nonexistent. One can't post pretty pictures of one's newest keycap set; one has to focus on the QMK keymap.
  - deagle50 6y ago
    Can you share your config file? I just installed my Hasu controller and I’m not sure where to start.
executesorder66 6y ago
So I'm not alone. I really can't understand the appeal of a mechanical keyboard. - They are loud - They are expensive - The keys are massive and ugly - Massive travel time (So slow to type on) Sure they are a bit more customizable, but is that really worth all the drawbacks? Especially the worse typing, which is the main point of a keyboard. If you are a mechanical keyboard fanatic, and my comment angered you, please know that was not my intention. I really don't see the appeal, and I haven't been able to find any advantages (mentioned online or by asking friends that have them). I would love it if someone could explain to me what the actual advantages are, and/or why I am wrong on any of the points I mentioned.
- schwartzworld 6y ago
  I probably don't speak for everybody, but I can try to speak to your points above: - They are loud They can be loud, depending on the switches you get. However, some people feel that they benefit from it. The loud clicks are satisfying in some way. Maybe it's an ASMR thing for some people. For me, the sound feels like feedback. - They are expensive They can be. But so can regular keyboards. My first mechanical was like $40. - The keys are massive and ugly Unless you put low profile switches on your keyboard - Massive travel time (So slow to type on) Unless you put fast switches on your keyboard. The clickiest keys tend to be the slowest, but I don't type more than 80 words per minute anyway, and when I'm coding a lot less than that. But you can definitely get faster switches. Here's another reason: it's fun. It's just fun. Sure maybe it's just cosplaying as a hacker, but it's still fun. And most mechanicals can be remapped really easily, to allow custom workflows. Or layers. What I may potentially lose in words per minute, I gain by creating an intuitive key map that lets me reach the keys that I actually need day to day.
  - mewse 6y ago
    > They can be loud, depending on the switches you get. It’s worth noting that for folks who don’t know proper typing technique (which is probably nearly everybody under the age of 40, as nobody really teaches it any more, at least in the countries where I’ve lived) it almost doesn’t matter what sort of mechanical switch you’re using, in terms of noise. In my experience, the majority of mechanical keyboard noise for most folks doesn’t actually come from the switches at all; it comes from the keys noisily bottoming out on each keystroke. My theory is that most folks these days learned to type on membrane keyboards where you have to bottom out the keys (often with quite a lot of force, if the keyboard is old), or else on a laptop’s scissor switches where you can’t avoid bottoming out due to the extremely short throw, and so everyone’s just typing with much more force than necessary and driving the keys all the way down to the backplate on every press because that’s what they had to do with the keyboards they learned on. Which of course makes typing far less pleasant, and also much noisier! The complaints are totally understandable, from that perspective. This also links into the “Massive travel time” comment; most folks push the keys much too far down while typing on mechanical keyboards! Cherry MX Blue switches (as one example) actuate at 2mm, which is almost exactly the same distance as most (non-Apple) laptop scissor switches. The only reason that a mechanical keyboard would have “massive travel time” compared to a laptop keyboard is if you’re needlessly pushing the keys all the way down, when you actually only need a gentle tap on them.
christophilus 6y ago
Anecdote: I switched from my old ergonomic Microsoft mechanical keyboard to the Varmilo VA87M[0]. It's not ergonomic, but man, is this a great keyboard. My problem with ergonomic keyboards is how wide they are. I have to move my had too far to get to the mouse. This little keyboard, with a good palm rest, has been fantastic. The travel distance isn't anywhere near what it was on my old mechanical Microsoft keyboard, so that's much improved with more modern keyboards. Anyway, I was very skeptical of the Varmilo, since it's not ergonomic, but it's been excellent, and my wrist pain has gone away. [0] https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/index.php?l=product_list&c=324 https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/index.php?l=product_lis...
projektfu 6y ago
I discovered in a group project once that a Model M can support a cockatiel walking on it without pressing a key. This was a timesaver.
RHSeeger 6y ago
Different strokes for different folks, though. I've been working on a mac for a decade, and I _cannot_ get used to the chicklet keyboards. I use an external keyboard and need to bring it with me when I travel in order to be productive.
nkrisc 6y ago
I don't think it's overblown. I think it's spending $500 chasing that "perfect" typing experience and all the different switches that is overblown. I spent $50 on a basic G.Skill mechanical keyboard with Cherry Red switches and it's great. It's cheap, and best of all, it's very simple and repairable. When I spilled a drink on it and gummed up a switch, I popped off the keycaps, took out a few screws, pulled out the board, desoldered the switch and soldered in a replacement switch. Good as new. My favorite feature? The cord connects to the body with USB Type-C so even the cord is easily replaceable. The raised keycap design is nice too since I can just blow compressed air under all the keycaps to clean it and there's no raised edge around the faceplate to catch it.
u678u 6y ago
The high rise keys are a problem. There are a variant of mech keyboards with low risk keys that I definitely prefer. https://www.amazon.com/s?k=low+profile+mechnical+keyboard https://www.amazon.com/s?k=low+profile+mechnical+keyboard
dayvid 6y ago
Mechanical keyboards are kind of annoying because: 1. You have to try out a few to find one you like and most of them are only available online. 2. Mechanical keyboard enthusiasts drown out casual mechanical keyboard users. Most discussions you can find focus on overly advanced topics and most manufacturers cater to the enthusiast crowd. I don't think most casual users care aren't that nitpicky about performance or aesthetic, but the customization options appeal to the enthusiast crowd I suppose. In my experience, I like low-profile mechanical keyboards with blue or brown switches. I was happily using a keyboard I found on Amazon for $40 that's now unavailable. I ordered two more expensive ones later on and hated them. I recently got a Keychron K3 low-profile keyboard with optical switches and enjoy it a lot. It might be worth giving that one a shot when it's available again.
- cheqpat 6y ago
  Low profile mechanical keyboards are definitely gaining more attention in the market. For a lot of my friends that complained about how keys were too spaced or too high profile some keyboards marketed as "slim" or "travel size" worked a lot better. I myself am close to buying whatever I can that has much lower travel height and switch weight (my current keyboard is lovely but can make my hands cramp after a couple hours if it's cold or after repetitive use). I'm convinced the only real metric that is worth chasing in expensive keyboards is build quality, followed by whether you like how the switches feel and the form factor.
hinkley 6y ago
I've said it before but I can say it again. I tried and tried to love mechanical keyboards, but when I was gaming I settled on the Apple USB keyboard because I could button mash all day without any distress. I now have a little cache of ones I bought from residual stock after they were discontinued. The wireless ones are not the same (for one you can't plug usb devices into it, like the Logitech receiver)
ghaff 6y ago
I have a mechanical keyboard and I've used them going back to the Model M and then improved Northgate versions. But I must admit that I type so much on laptops with short key travel that my mechanical keyboard takes a little adjustment.
baxuz 6y ago
I wish I could find an Apple Magic keyboard with all the functionality of a QMK-compatible keyboard.
gala8y 6y ago
For me the main factor for using mechanical keyboard is the amount of force required to press keys (Actuation Force) - its much smaller compared to cheaper membrane keyboards and it makes a huge difference if you type a lot (much less strain). Travel Distance, distance a key needs to travel to be actuated, is sometimes within 2mm (eg. cherry mx browns). If you learn to use just enough force to type, you glide over keys. No need to bottom out. If I ever need to type something on a standard keyboard, I feel like moving stones.

westoncb 6y ago

I've gone through a similar experience. I like the other concepts in keyboards like Ergodox/Moonlander etc., but as far as actual key-press-feel, none of these enthusiast keyboards come close to e.g. macbook keys. I think my ideal keyboard would be something like the Moonlander + the keys on the new macbook: a little bit of a click but basically zero travel.

KptMarchewa 6y ago
It's wild how tastes differ. I absolutely abhor the keypress of macbook keyboards, even more than the one in extremely cheap Acer laptop from ~2009.
GuB-42 6y ago
I think it is all about preference. I hated the new MacBook keys the instant I tried them. It felt like I was typing directly on the table. I had no problem with accuracy, but I found it really uncomfortable. I guess it is like a mattress, some people prefer it firm and others prefer it soft. I have a Topre keyboard BTW, which I chose by going to a shop and trying plenty of different keyboards without looking at the price and specs. Unfortunately, I ended up preferring the most expensive one...
austinkhale 6y ago
Switching to an Ergodox with a Dvorak layout changed my life. I used to have crazy pain after 6 - 8 hours of typing. Now I can easily go 12 - 14 with no issues whatsoever. Obviously that is not healthy or sustainable in the long term for other reasons but it’s a huge weight off my shoulders not thinking I’m ruining my wrists trying to meet a launch date.

KozmoNau7 6y ago

I could never get used to mechanical keyboards either, so I've been using a Logitech UltraX Premium for ages[1] now, a laptop-style scissor-switch design that rivals my Thinkpad X220 for typing feel. Honestly, I have no idea what will replace it when/if it finally gives up the ghost. [1] I bought it back when USB keyboards were the hot new thing to have, back in the stone age.

marianov 6y ago
Best keyboard I ever used is my current Thinkpad x220. I would need something with a better CPU tough
- KozmoNau7 6y ago
  I'm still hanging on to my X220i with the i3, upgraded to 8GB RAM, SSD, 5GHz WLAN and a 9-cell battery. It's not a speed machine, but it's still adequate for everyday use.

m463 6y ago

I have a topre keyboard. It is the most solid keyboard I've used and love it. I bought the realforce RGB. I didn't really care about the RGB, but it's nice to turn on a solid color dimly so I can find the keyboard in the dark. It also has an adjustable actuation point, so you can make it less or more sensitive. I keep it above the point where resting fingers on the keys can set it off. I could probably tune the actuation point higher on the home keys and make all the rest lighter. I've tried lots of other keyboards including cherry keys, and did not feel as solid. I think it's because the topre keys move up and down in a plastic cylinder that prevents side to side wiggling. I seem to type more accurately. My previous favorite keyboard was an apple keyboard (older non-flat version) and I thought it was great. Then after getting used to the topre keyboard, I laughed - it didn't feel very good.

Syzygies 6y ago
I also have a Topre keyboard, the Leopold FC660C, with a Hasu FC660C Controller supporting QMK firmware. The 12 keys closest to my non-pinky fingers are all tap/hold, so for example my hands don't move for control sequences. Alternate keymaps like Dvorak make sense if one needs to optimize letters for composing words. Shortening finger travel for programmers is an entirely different ball of wax, with many solutions involving QMK firmware. I had bought or built various mechanical keyboards, before settling on Topre switches. Topre switches are an obsession killer; many people find them vastly superior to any mechanical switch, and the customization options are nonexistent. One can't post pretty pictures of one's newest keycap set; one has to focus on the QMK keymap.
- deagle50 6y ago
  Can you share your config file? I just installed my Hasu controller and I’m not sure where to start.

executesorder66 6y ago

So I'm not alone. I really can't understand the appeal of a mechanical keyboard. - They are loud - They are expensive - The keys are massive and ugly - Massive travel time (So slow to type on) Sure they are a bit more customizable, but is that really worth all the drawbacks? Especially the worse typing, which is the main point of a keyboard. If you are a mechanical keyboard fanatic, and my comment angered you, please know that was not my intention. I really don't see the appeal, and I haven't been able to find any advantages (mentioned online or by asking friends that have them). I would love it if someone could explain to me what the actual advantages are, and/or why I am wrong on any of the points I mentioned.

schwartzworld 6y ago
I probably don't speak for everybody, but I can try to speak to your points above: - They are loud They can be loud, depending on the switches you get. However, some people feel that they benefit from it. The loud clicks are satisfying in some way. Maybe it's an ASMR thing for some people. For me, the sound feels like feedback. - They are expensive They can be. But so can regular keyboards. My first mechanical was like $40. - The keys are massive and ugly Unless you put low profile switches on your keyboard - Massive travel time (So slow to type on) Unless you put fast switches on your keyboard. The clickiest keys tend to be the slowest, but I don't type more than 80 words per minute anyway, and when I'm coding a lot less than that. But you can definitely get faster switches. Here's another reason: it's fun. It's just fun. Sure maybe it's just cosplaying as a hacker, but it's still fun. And most mechanicals can be remapped really easily, to allow custom workflows. Or layers. What I may potentially lose in words per minute, I gain by creating an intuitive key map that lets me reach the keys that I actually need day to day.
- mewse 6y ago
  > They can be loud, depending on the switches you get. It’s worth noting that for folks who don’t know proper typing technique (which is probably nearly everybody under the age of 40, as nobody really teaches it any more, at least in the countries where I’ve lived) it almost doesn’t matter what sort of mechanical switch you’re using, in terms of noise. In my experience, the majority of mechanical keyboard noise for most folks doesn’t actually come from the switches at all; it comes from the keys noisily bottoming out on each keystroke. My theory is that most folks these days learned to type on membrane keyboards where you have to bottom out the keys (often with quite a lot of force, if the keyboard is old), or else on a laptop’s scissor switches where you can’t avoid bottoming out due to the extremely short throw, and so everyone’s just typing with much more force than necessary and driving the keys all the way down to the backplate on every press because that’s what they had to do with the keyboards they learned on. Which of course makes typing far less pleasant, and also much noisier! The complaints are totally understandable, from that perspective. This also links into the “Massive travel time” comment; most folks push the keys much too far down while typing on mechanical keyboards! Cherry MX Blue switches (as one example) actuate at 2mm, which is almost exactly the same distance as most (non-Apple) laptop scissor switches. The only reason that a mechanical keyboard would have “massive travel time” compared to a laptop keyboard is if you’re needlessly pushing the keys all the way down, when you actually only need a gentle tap on them.

christophilus 6y ago

Anecdote: I switched from my old ergonomic Microsoft mechanical keyboard to the Varmilo VA87M[0]. It's not ergonomic, but man, is this a great keyboard. My problem with ergonomic keyboards is how wide they are. I have to move my had too far to get to the mouse. This little keyboard, with a good palm rest, has been fantastic. The travel distance isn't anywhere near what it was on my old mechanical Microsoft keyboard, so that's much improved with more modern keyboards. Anyway, I was very skeptical of the Varmilo, since it's not ergonomic, but it's been excellent, and my wrist pain has gone away. [0] https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/index.php?l=product_list&c=324 https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/index.php?l=product_lis...

projektfu 6y ago

I discovered in a group project once that a Model M can support a cockatiel walking on it without pressing a key. This was a timesaver.

RHSeeger 6y ago

Different strokes for different folks, though. I've been working on a mac for a decade, and I _cannot_ get used to the chicklet keyboards. I use an external keyboard and need to bring it with me when I travel in order to be productive.

nkrisc 6y ago

I don't think it's overblown. I think it's spending $500 chasing that "perfect" typing experience and all the different switches that is overblown. I spent $50 on a basic G.Skill mechanical keyboard with Cherry Red switches and it's great. It's cheap, and best of all, it's very simple and repairable. When I spilled a drink on it and gummed up a switch, I popped off the keycaps, took out a few screws, pulled out the board, desoldered the switch and soldered in a replacement switch. Good as new. My favorite feature? The cord connects to the body with USB Type-C so even the cord is easily replaceable. The raised keycap design is nice too since I can just blow compressed air under all the keycaps to clean it and there's no raised edge around the faceplate to catch it.

u678u 6y ago

The high rise keys are a problem. There are a variant of mech keyboards with low risk keys that I definitely prefer. https://www.amazon.com/s?k=low+profile+mechnical+keyboard https://www.amazon.com/s?k=low+profile+mechnical+keyboard

dayvid 6y ago

Mechanical keyboards are kind of annoying because: 1. You have to try out a few to find one you like and most of them are only available online. 2. Mechanical keyboard enthusiasts drown out casual mechanical keyboard users. Most discussions you can find focus on overly advanced topics and most manufacturers cater to the enthusiast crowd. I don't think most casual users care aren't that nitpicky about performance or aesthetic, but the customization options appeal to the enthusiast crowd I suppose. In my experience, I like low-profile mechanical keyboards with blue or brown switches. I was happily using a keyboard I found on Amazon for $40 that's now unavailable. I ordered two more expensive ones later on and hated them. I recently got a Keychron K3 low-profile keyboard with optical switches and enjoy it a lot. It might be worth giving that one a shot when it's available again.

cheqpat 6y ago
Low profile mechanical keyboards are definitely gaining more attention in the market. For a lot of my friends that complained about how keys were too spaced or too high profile some keyboards marketed as "slim" or "travel size" worked a lot better. I myself am close to buying whatever I can that has much lower travel height and switch weight (my current keyboard is lovely but can make my hands cramp after a couple hours if it's cold or after repetitive use). I'm convinced the only real metric that is worth chasing in expensive keyboards is build quality, followed by whether you like how the switches feel and the form factor.

hinkley 6y ago

I've said it before but I can say it again. I tried and tried to love mechanical keyboards, but when I was gaming I settled on the Apple USB keyboard because I could button mash all day without any distress. I now have a little cache of ones I bought from residual stock after they were discontinued. The wireless ones are not the same (for one you can't plug usb devices into it, like the Logitech receiver)

ghaff 6y ago

I have a mechanical keyboard and I've used them going back to the Model M and then improved Northgate versions. But I must admit that I type so much on laptops with short key travel that my mechanical keyboard takes a little adjustment.

baxuz 6y ago

I wish I could find an Apple Magic keyboard with all the functionality of a QMK-compatible keyboard.

gala8y 6y ago

For me the main factor for using mechanical keyboard is the amount of force required to press keys (Actuation Force) - its much smaller compared to cheaper membrane keyboards and it makes a huge difference if you type a lot (much less strain). Travel Distance, distance a key needs to travel to be actuated, is sometimes within 2mm (eg. cherry mx browns). If you learn to use just enough force to type, you glide over keys. No need to bottom out. If I ever need to type something on a standard keyboard, I feel like moving stones.