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Theory is indeed separated into several disciplines, speaking about mathematization: Phenomenology, Model building, Mathematical Physics. FWIW I think Phenomeno

Theory is indeed separated into several disciplines, speaking about mathematization: Phenomenology, Model building, Mathematical Physics. FWIW I think Phenomenology is where a lot is going on, it's about looking what is there and how it compares to the models. The fully formalized ("axiomatic") mathematical descriptions oftentimes lag behind the theoretical models ("postulated") in use that are used to compare with real data for instance. That said, I would say Atoms are as real as it can get. There are so many experiments about them and applications as well, for instant nuclear fission. How can they not be real? :-) Speaking about Spacetime, of course it is real. There is such a crazy amount of predictions based on Special Relativity.

karmakaze 6y ago
> Atoms are as real as it can get Well put, and also not any specific degree of real, if you accept that the simulation hypothesis can't be disproven. The specific 'real' discovered properties of atoms or spacetime are actually artifacts of simulation.
- mycall 6y ago
  Is simulation time continuous or discrete? If there is only 1x forward speed for simulation time, perhaps relativity could continue to work, as that fixed single speed would be discrete (speed of light). I'm not sure how to postulate this idea further, but I've had it for years.
  - sdwr 6y ago
    I like to imagine the world as being like a distributed game engine running on a computer outside of time. That would mean that life could have existed before physical space or the earth did. History being built piecemeal and in reverse order, a past being created by collective effort and attention. And somewhere along the way Santa planted dinosaur bones. Maybe when you close your eyes you fade to black, and existing is a constant choice. Maybe situation and circumstance are handshake deals made in the collective unconscious, an onion growing layer by layer from the kernel. Just something to think about :)
  - kadoban 6y ago
    I think if we're in a simulation, it's hard to do more than guess at what its properties are. We could try to use mathematics and computer science and physics to see what it looks like from inside, what seems possible to compute (making the probably good assumption that computation and math are universally true), etc. But if you get right down to it, a sufficently advanced/evil simulation could paper over whatever it wants just by modifying our brains, removing troublemakers from existence and memory, etc. Gives me the creeps thinking about it much.

karmakaze 6y ago

> Atoms are as real as it can get Well put, and also not any specific degree of real, if you accept that the simulation hypothesis can't be disproven. The specific 'real' discovered properties of atoms or spacetime are actually artifacts of simulation.

mycall 6y ago
Is simulation time continuous or discrete? If there is only 1x forward speed for simulation time, perhaps relativity could continue to work, as that fixed single speed would be discrete (speed of light). I'm not sure how to postulate this idea further, but I've had it for years.
- sdwr 6y ago
  I like to imagine the world as being like a distributed game engine running on a computer outside of time. That would mean that life could have existed before physical space or the earth did. History being built piecemeal and in reverse order, a past being created by collective effort and attention. And somewhere along the way Santa planted dinosaur bones. Maybe when you close your eyes you fade to black, and existing is a constant choice. Maybe situation and circumstance are handshake deals made in the collective unconscious, an onion growing layer by layer from the kernel. Just something to think about :)
- kadoban 6y ago
  I think if we're in a simulation, it's hard to do more than guess at what its properties are. We could try to use mathematics and computer science and physics to see what it looks like from inside, what seems possible to compute (making the probably good assumption that computation and math are universally true), etc. But if you get right down to it, a sufficently advanced/evil simulation could paper over whatever it wants just by modifying our brains, removing troublemakers from existence and memory, etc. Gives me the creeps thinking about it much.