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I left the bay area for good after being burned repeatedly by folks whose social and moral beliefs aligned most closely with SSC’s grey tribe definition (as ori

I left the bay area for good after being burned repeatedly by folks whose social and moral beliefs aligned most closely with SSC’s grey tribe definition (as originally posted, not the summary from this article). While no doubt “not all Silicon Valley residents” applies, certainly after fifteen years of primacy of such beliefs my social circles, I’m sick of the grey tribe and will avoid living anywhere with a loud presence of it again.

robin21 6y ago
I’m very curious - not knowing much about these tribes myself. Could you give some examples of the beliefs that most disturbed you?
- floatingatoll 6y ago
  I’m not interested in derailing the thread, so with apologies I must decline. I encourage you to read the original source material if you’d like to learn more.
yeetawayhn 6y ago
Which beliefs burned you?
- floatingatoll 6y ago
  https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26154810 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26154810
  - yeetawayhn 6y ago
    That's a cop-out of an answer, and one that makes people less inclined to believe in the entire story.
    - floatingatoll 6y ago
      Your loss, not mine.
      - yeetawayhn 6y ago
        Well, without any data it's impossible to say. ;)
        floatingatoll 6y ago
        it’s certainly your right to believe that, but I don’t envy you the frustration and alienation that such an approach can lead to with others who don’t feel the same way about conversation as you do. Your challenge does present an interesting question for other greys, though: What process of data collection and rational evaluation did you use to test your hypothesis that it’s beneficial to your human development to disregard any story that doesn’t have the degree of supporting evidence you require? I have a hypothesis that few are truly applying the principles of grey so deeply, as it’s quite a cognitive burden to do so, but to decry the question would contradict their principles to the core, exposing unconsidered cognitive dissonance that - if they’re rational enough - would force them to question their entire belief model to its very core. And so, instead, they will challenge the question itself, rather than apply their belief’s principles of rationality to their own beliefs. Your datapoint in this matter would be a valuable contribution to my rational evaluation of this hypothesis, but of course I understand if you feel unable or unwilling to contribute. I shall continue developing it regardless, for any future encounters with greyfolk. It would please me greatly to find that none are willing to respond to it, as that would perfectly contradict your belief using the honorable practices and methods of the greyfolk themselves. But it would please me most to find that they are able to reason and respond to such a question, and acknowledge their own irrationality if any is exposed, because it’s more important to me that they integrate rationality and human nature than it is that I be right. (One caveat. The question you I expected you to have asked is why I would consider it appropriate to make such a statement without defending it further, and how I could possibly expect any outcome from that other than complete disregard by all readers. Your reply ignored that rational opportunity in favor of being dismissive. It’s a curious choice that conflicts with my read of you as a grey rationalist who’s set out to try and promote rationality at HN. If that is indeed your mission here, feedback duly noted so that you can improve the quality of your evangelism. If you aren’t a rationalist, I apologize for my misread and intend no insult by describing you as such, and I will take no offense if you simply disregard this entire reply.)

robin21 6y ago

I’m very curious - not knowing much about these tribes myself. Could you give some examples of the beliefs that most disturbed you?

floatingatoll 6y ago
I’m not interested in derailing the thread, so with apologies I must decline. I encourage you to read the original source material if you’d like to learn more.

yeetawayhn 6y ago

Which beliefs burned you?

floatingatoll 6y ago
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26154810 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26154810
- yeetawayhn 6y ago
  That's a cop-out of an answer, and one that makes people less inclined to believe in the entire story.
  - floatingatoll 6y ago
    Your loss, not mine.
    - yeetawayhn 6y ago
      Well, without any data it's impossible to say. ;)
      - floatingatoll 6y ago
        it’s certainly your right to believe that, but I don’t envy you the frustration and alienation that such an approach can lead to with others who don’t feel the same way about conversation as you do. Your challenge does present an interesting question for other greys, though: What process of data collection and rational evaluation did you use to test your hypothesis that it’s beneficial to your human development to disregard any story that doesn’t have the degree of supporting evidence you require? I have a hypothesis that few are truly applying the principles of grey so deeply, as it’s quite a cognitive burden to do so, but to decry the question would contradict their principles to the core, exposing unconsidered cognitive dissonance that - if they’re rational enough - would force them to question their entire belief model to its very core. And so, instead, they will challenge the question itself, rather than apply their belief’s principles of rationality to their own beliefs. Your datapoint in this matter would be a valuable contribution to my rational evaluation of this hypothesis, but of course I understand if you feel unable or unwilling to contribute. I shall continue developing it regardless, for any future encounters with greyfolk. It would please me greatly to find that none are willing to respond to it, as that would perfectly contradict your belief using the honorable practices and methods of the greyfolk themselves. But it would please me most to find that they are able to reason and respond to such a question, and acknowledge their own irrationality if any is exposed, because it’s more important to me that they integrate rationality and human nature than it is that I be right. (One caveat. The question you I expected you to have asked is why I would consider it appropriate to make such a statement without defending it further, and how I could possibly expect any outcome from that other than complete disregard by all readers. Your reply ignored that rational opportunity in favor of being dismissive. It’s a curious choice that conflicts with my read of you as a grey rationalist who’s set out to try and promote rationality at HN. If that is indeed your mission here, feedback duly noted so that you can improve the quality of your evangelism. If you aren’t a rationalist, I apologize for my misread and intend no insult by describing you as such, and I will take no offense if you simply disregard this entire reply.)