10 ms·

Why are so many keyboards tiny like this? If I want a small keyboard, I will just use a laptop. I have a huge desk, I don't want a 12" keyboard with 2 weird sm

Why are so many keyboards tiny like this? If I want a small keyboard, I will just use a laptop. I have a huge desk, I don't want a 12" keyboard with 2 weird small space keys, and the arrow keys smashed into the right side.

least 6y ago
Because other people want small keyboards, I'd imagine.
- throwaway81523 6y ago
  If I want a small keyboard I want it with a built in pointing device, and those are hard to find. Lenovo trackpoint keyboard is one of the few I can think of.
  - chr 6y ago
    Tex in Taiwan also make keyboards with trackpoints. https://www.tex-design.com.tw/us-en/products.php?cid=17 https://www.tex-design.com.tw/us-en/products.php?cid=17
  - Semaphor 6y ago
    The Logitech K400 (sold as a smart TV keyboard mainly) is pretty well known, and they have a bunch of other keyboards with touchpad.
    - airbreather 6y ago
      Yeah it's great (I have 5 of them) for remote keyboard for netflix with bigscreen, or for raspberry pi where you can just plug in one USB thing and have keyboard/mouse, but I don't think many people would cope with it for ongoing use.
  - rideontime 6y ago
    UHK offers trackpads, trackballs, and trackpoints for all your tracking needs. https://ultimatehackingkeyboard.com/shop https://ultimatehackingkeyboard.com/shop
    - devenvdev 6y ago
      Modularity is avery cool feature! :drooling: My problem with UHK though that it's not ortholinear...
  - throwaway81523 6y ago
    Thanks to those who responded. The Tex keyboard looks nice but it is $300! I had seen the Logitech 400 before, but forgot about it because it is wireless and I'm old-fashioned enough to want to still use USB keyboards, to not broadcast passwords and that sort of thing. I should have been more specific though. Those clip-on accessory trackpoints etc do look nice and I didn't know about them.
est31 6y ago
I don't get it either. Most of the custom mechanical keyboard market seems to focus on 60% keyboards, but personally I use keys beyond that set. The reasoning I read on the internet is that customizable keyboards let you choose the keys you actually need... But I've done a lot of thinking, I need keys beyond 60% all the time. My suspicion is that the market for TKL keyboards or even full keyboards is already served by the big brands so the custom vendors have a harder time.
- bcrosby95 6y ago
  No one I know using a 60% keyboard only uses the 60%. As someone else mentioned, you use things like the fn key. For my keyboard: fn + jkli (or fn + wsad) for arrow keys. fn + uo for page up/down. fn + hn for home/end. fn + <number> for f1-12. I rarely used insert/delete. I never used the number pad. I have my capslock set to be fn. I was tired of a full sized monster keyboard taking so much space on my desk. At first I tried TKL but enter key placement turned out to be awkward for me, so I switched it out for a 60% since there was going to be a learning curve regardless.
  - est31 6y ago
    > fn + uo for page up/down. That would make the ctrl+ pg up/down shortcut that I use to switch between tabs in Firefox (or Kate) much harder. I'd suddenly have to press 3 keys at once instead of two.
    - mypalmike 6y ago
      You can just assign the functionality to different keys. Maybe fn with = and -.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - square_usual 6y ago
      I use a 60% and I find that shortcut easier on the 60 than on a fullsize. I've mapped PgDn to Fn + ; and pressing Ctrl + Fn + ; feels easier than reaching for PgDn with my right hand.
momania 6y ago
As a programmer you need (or actually want) to make use of some of the most acrobatic shortcuts that cross a large portion of the keyboard. Having a smaller keyboard just makes that a lot more comfortable, because you don't need to have hands the size of King Kong to be able to utilise those shortcuts. :-)
- varispeed 6y ago
  Do you have examples of such shortcuts? Apart from CTRL+C/X and CTRL+V I can't think of any useful?
  - selfhoster11 6y ago
    Lots of IDEs have complicated keyboard chords. For IntelliJ, there's Alt+[1..9], Shift+F6, Ctrl+Alt+L, and others on a daily basis. Some of them cross basically the entire keyboard, and it's not convenient to use one hand to do so.
  - douglaswlance 6y ago
    Anything a computer can do can be assigned to a shortcut.
- bregma 6y ago
  Use vim and the command line. Why would I need anything other than a full-size mechanical clicky keyboard with full travel? My hands rarely stray off the home row.
semi-extrinsic 6y ago
I've been very happy with a layout that is a middle ground between full-size and 60%. Basically you have 18 keys on the right-hand side that can be toggled (using a dedicated button) between arrows + pageup/down + insert etc, and the traditional numpad layout. It is very rare that I need both numpad and arrow keys at the exact same time, so I don't lose any functionality but my hands are more centered towards the front. Even things like Blender that rely heavily on numpad for 3D navigation works well. My model is old, looks like the most similar current model is the Coolermaster "Masterkeys Pro M" (RGB or white LEDs available): https://www.coolermaster.com/us/en-us/catalog/peripheral/keyboards/masterkeys-pro-m-white/ https://www.coolermaster.com/us/en-us/catalog/peripheral/key... Picture of the layout: https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/cdn.coolermaster.com/assets/1017/masterkeys-pro-m-white-gallery-3-image.png https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/cdn.coolermaster.com/asse...
- peteri 6y ago
  Another name for this layout is 96 key. I built my own using a YMDK melody 96 layout but before that build I bought the VictSing 96 key which was super cheap (around $50 delivered from the US) and apart from the keycaps having awful legends wasn't too bad. I did a bit of blog series as I went through the design and build process after my Model M died after a coffee accident. https://www.ibbotson.co.uk/tag/keyboards/ https://www.ibbotson.co.uk/tag/keyboards/ I'm mulling over doing a custom design with a ISO/US layout so I can kill the function key row but keep both ~` and the escape key. Basically the "Vortex Vibe" but with an ISO layout.
rualca 6y ago
> Why are so many keyboards tiny like this? If I want a small keyboard, I will just use a laptop. That makes absolutely no sense. Your choice of keyboard should not come attached to a monitor. Furthermore, laptop keyboards are notoriously unmaintainable and uncleanable. If all you want is to be able to use a nice keyboard that doesn't take over half your desk space, specially if it's already cramped, then this is the stuff you crave.
jeromenerf 6y ago
Let aside the personal preferences, 60% was popularized by the gaming crowd: 1. Small means the mouse is closer to the keyboard 2. Games often rely on wasd instead of arrows 3. 40% cheaper for alternative switches and keycaps, or higher margins for the producers 4. Style and look may feel like more exclusive, competitive, make hands look bigger. Fashion is important in this community. Thanks to their firmware, they are very usable but it is really a matter of personal preferences.
carlesfe 6y ago
In my case, I would like to use a bigger keyboard, but I need a 60%-style layout for RSI reasons. Unless my right hand (mouse) is very close to my left one, I get RSI. I started using keyboards without a numpad first, then without the nav cluster. Nowadays I choose keyboard which are taller but narrower, so that I can get the most functionality but without needing to force my right arm too far away: https://tex.com.tw/products/shinobi?variant=16969883648090 https://tex.com.tw/products/shinobi?variant=16969883648090
- gnud 6y ago
  I've never had 'proper' RSI, but I solved all my wrist strain woes by simply placing the mouse smack bang in front of the space key, at a 270 degree angle, so moving the mouse to my left translates to the pointer moving up. It gives my right hand a much better position, it's quick to switch between mouse and keyboard, and it gives my elbows room to rest on the table. The only downside is that it requires a slightly deeper desk than having the mouse next to the keyboard, but you probably want space on the desk for your arms anyway.
  - BigJ1211 6y ago
    I'm using a linear columnar split keyboard now (moonlander from zsa, redox from falbatech before that). That has done much more to reduce strain than anything else I tried. I would also highly recommend getting a trackball, personally I'm a programmer and have to rely on my hands despite having RSI and CTS.
    - devenvdev 6y ago
      I was getting RSI constantly no matter what ergonomic keyboard I had (MS sculp or whatsitsname was the only one bearable), eventually I got a programmable split keyboard, ZSA Moonlander - RSI immediately gone. But apparently that was even an overkill, I loved the programmable part so much that I decided to buy Planck for my gaming pc because it's tiny and can fit on my couch-mouse-pad setup... No RSI either! I use it for programming too now. I have a theory that what was hurting me was the need to move fingers to backspace, ctrl, etc. And maybe the staggering as you need to twist your wrists a little all the time. Ortholinear feels just... more sensible, for muscle memory... From now on I buy only ortholinear programmable keyboards, they are fun, make more sense, and don't get me RSI!
sonnyp 6y ago
In this case I believe it's because System76 want to start designing their own laptop rather than relying on off-the-shelf Clevo designs and some of this keyboard design might make it into their own laptop. I do like smaller keyboards though, easier to switch with laptop, less finger travel, less travel to the mouse and so on
- kohlerm 6y ago
  That would be great, e.g. a customizable laptop keyboard with an open source firmware :-)
slightwinder 6y ago
They are small in number of keys, not in size. Moving hands too much is not benefitial for typing, so why bother with it? If you need more keys, you can just attatch an extra keyboard, macropad/numberpad or other input-device, reconfigure it with specific settings and waste all the space you want.
jeffchien 6y ago
Many commenters offered reasons to like 60%, but as a TKL enthusiast myself, I'm inclined to think that it's mostly a supply issue, because I've seen many 75% and TKL group buys get a ton of demand. 60% is just easier to machine: the top is just a frame and thus doesn't need various holes for ESC, function groups, etc.
jbki 6y ago
it makes zero sense that the space bar is the size that it is.
squarefoot 6y ago
If you're lucky, you can find old IBM model M keyboards for free, or close. I got two, first one like 25 years ago from a surplus store for like 10 Euros of today and the second one a few years later for free as it was being thrown away by a government office "because it doesn't fit the rack drawer and doesn't have windows keys". I'm still using the first one, which is old enough to carry a shiny Lotus 1-2-3 version 2.2 sticker on it. Those are rock solid beasts; I already know I'll die a lot before any of these keyboards will fail, and I don't plan to die soon:). No USB connection of course as those keyboards predate the standard, but any cheapo PS/2-USB converter will work.
- bluGill 6y ago
  I've been told that not all PS2-USB converters work. But many cheap ones do, so just get from a place with a good return policy. Beware that the Model M draws more power than USB is allowed to supply. I've never heard of this being a problem in the real world, but I always plug my model M into a powered hub to ensure there is plenty of power available.
  - mohaine 6y ago
    Many PS2-USB "converters" are really just "adapters" that actually rely on the keyboard to do the heavy lifting internally. These do not work at all. It sounds like it has gotten better but it used to be quite hard to get an M working. Of course these isn't much(any?) other ~40 year old PC equipment that is this easy to get working.
  - squarefoot 6y ago
    > I've been told that not all PS2-USB converters work. True converters do. Those that don't work are just connector adapters relying on the mainboard to recognize that a PS/2 device is connected although on a USB port. To be sure you get a working adapter, never buy single port ones as they often contain just connection wires. All converters I tried with dual PS2 port, to be used with mouse and keyboard together, contained a real protocol converter and worked flawlessly on all PCs. An image search for "ps/2 usb" returns may examples of the two converters types.
swalsh 6y ago
The Model M really was the pinnacle of keyboards.
- bluGill 6y ago
  The much older model F was very good - some people tell me better. I believe I've tried one in the past, but it was so long ago that I can't remember. There were a lot of great keyboards back then. Keyboard quality went off a cliff in the mid 1990s. Someday I want to find a Northgate omni-key from that era which people tell me is the best.
LeonidasXIV 6y ago
Personally I have my keyboard on my lap so having a full-size keyboard is rather inconvenient. But I think this video is an excellent introduction on the reasoning why tiny keyboards are popular: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKGXZ1ReU54 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKGXZ1ReU54
tgtweak 6y ago
I always wondered this too and it seems odd, but, over the last 5 years I'm noticing a trend of developers using their macbooks/ultrabooks as primary and they are used to that format and look for it in a workstation/docked keyboard. Personally my numpad is indispensable and I never understood the desire to have a tiny keyboard.
- retzkek 6y ago
  Most "tiny" keyboard layouts put the numpad one keypress away, right under your hand. With an ortho keyboard you don't even have to retrain muscle memory. There's very little downside.
Weebs 6y ago
Two main reasons for me 1) More space for my mouse when playing games. I prefer a low sens and full sized keyboards are a legitimate problem for this 2) Desk space. If I'm not playing games it's also helpful to have space for a notebook next to my keyboard when working, or my MIDI controller while making music.
chrisBob 6y ago
My primary keyboard now is a Kinesis Freestyle Pro, and my favorite feature isn't the split, it that it's programmable and has a split spacebar. The main reason I moved my hands around before was to use the arrow keys, and now they are mapped to [right spacebar] + [IJKL]. I have also expanded a little to use U and O as backspace and delete on that same layer. I don't think I could ever memorize 3+ layers, but this small use of a second layer that is very easy to access has been great for me.
rovr138 6y ago
Some people like them. I use a kinesis advantage which is not small.
allenu 6y ago
I prefer the smaller footprint because it means I don't have to reach too far to the right when I use my trackpad. I've been using a HHKB for the past 3 years and have gotten used to not having to stretch my right arm to reach the trackpad. You get used to the arrow keys being in a different place as well, especially with the HHKB which requires you to press a function key to use them.

least 6y ago

Because other people want small keyboards, I'd imagine.

throwaway81523 6y ago
If I want a small keyboard I want it with a built in pointing device, and those are hard to find. Lenovo trackpoint keyboard is one of the few I can think of.
- chr 6y ago
  Tex in Taiwan also make keyboards with trackpoints. https://www.tex-design.com.tw/us-en/products.php?cid=17 https://www.tex-design.com.tw/us-en/products.php?cid=17
- Semaphor 6y ago
  The Logitech K400 (sold as a smart TV keyboard mainly) is pretty well known, and they have a bunch of other keyboards with touchpad.
  - airbreather 6y ago
    Yeah it's great (I have 5 of them) for remote keyboard for netflix with bigscreen, or for raspberry pi where you can just plug in one USB thing and have keyboard/mouse, but I don't think many people would cope with it for ongoing use.
- rideontime 6y ago
  UHK offers trackpads, trackballs, and trackpoints for all your tracking needs. https://ultimatehackingkeyboard.com/shop https://ultimatehackingkeyboard.com/shop
  - devenvdev 6y ago
    Modularity is avery cool feature! :drooling: My problem with UHK though that it's not ortholinear...
- throwaway81523 6y ago
  Thanks to those who responded. The Tex keyboard looks nice but it is $300! I had seen the Logitech 400 before, but forgot about it because it is wireless and I'm old-fashioned enough to want to still use USB keyboards, to not broadcast passwords and that sort of thing. I should have been more specific though. Those clip-on accessory trackpoints etc do look nice and I didn't know about them.

est31 6y ago

I don't get it either. Most of the custom mechanical keyboard market seems to focus on 60% keyboards, but personally I use keys beyond that set. The reasoning I read on the internet is that customizable keyboards let you choose the keys you actually need... But I've done a lot of thinking, I need keys beyond 60% all the time. My suspicion is that the market for TKL keyboards or even full keyboards is already served by the big brands so the custom vendors have a harder time.

bcrosby95 6y ago
No one I know using a 60% keyboard only uses the 60%. As someone else mentioned, you use things like the fn key. For my keyboard: fn + jkli (or fn + wsad) for arrow keys. fn + uo for page up/down. fn + hn for home/end. fn + <number> for f1-12. I rarely used insert/delete. I never used the number pad. I have my capslock set to be fn. I was tired of a full sized monster keyboard taking so much space on my desk. At first I tried TKL but enter key placement turned out to be awkward for me, so I switched it out for a 60% since there was going to be a learning curve regardless.
- est31 6y ago
  > fn + uo for page up/down. That would make the ctrl+ pg up/down shortcut that I use to switch between tabs in Firefox (or Kate) much harder. I'd suddenly have to press 3 keys at once instead of two.
  - mypalmike 6y ago
    You can just assign the functionality to different keys. Maybe fn with = and -.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - square_usual 6y ago
    I use a 60% and I find that shortcut easier on the 60 than on a fullsize. I've mapped PgDn to Fn + ; and pressing Ctrl + Fn + ; feels easier than reaching for PgDn with my right hand.

momania 6y ago

As a programmer you need (or actually want) to make use of some of the most acrobatic shortcuts that cross a large portion of the keyboard. Having a smaller keyboard just makes that a lot more comfortable, because you don't need to have hands the size of King Kong to be able to utilise those shortcuts. :-)

varispeed 6y ago
Do you have examples of such shortcuts? Apart from CTRL+C/X and CTRL+V I can't think of any useful?
- selfhoster11 6y ago
  Lots of IDEs have complicated keyboard chords. For IntelliJ, there's Alt+[1..9], Shift+F6, Ctrl+Alt+L, and others on a daily basis. Some of them cross basically the entire keyboard, and it's not convenient to use one hand to do so.
- douglaswlance 6y ago
  Anything a computer can do can be assigned to a shortcut.
bregma 6y ago
Use vim and the command line. Why would I need anything other than a full-size mechanical clicky keyboard with full travel? My hands rarely stray off the home row.

semi-extrinsic 6y ago

I've been very happy with a layout that is a middle ground between full-size and 60%. Basically you have 18 keys on the right-hand side that can be toggled (using a dedicated button) between arrows + pageup/down + insert etc, and the traditional numpad layout. It is very rare that I need both numpad and arrow keys at the exact same time, so I don't lose any functionality but my hands are more centered towards the front. Even things like Blender that rely heavily on numpad for 3D navigation works well. My model is old, looks like the most similar current model is the Coolermaster "Masterkeys Pro M" (RGB or white LEDs available): https://www.coolermaster.com/us/en-us/catalog/peripheral/keyboards/masterkeys-pro-m-white/ https://www.coolermaster.com/us/en-us/catalog/peripheral/key... Picture of the layout: https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/cdn.coolermaster.com/assets/1017/masterkeys-pro-m-white-gallery-3-image.png https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/cdn.coolermaster.com/asse...

peteri 6y ago
Another name for this layout is 96 key. I built my own using a YMDK melody 96 layout but before that build I bought the VictSing 96 key which was super cheap (around $50 delivered from the US) and apart from the keycaps having awful legends wasn't too bad. I did a bit of blog series as I went through the design and build process after my Model M died after a coffee accident. https://www.ibbotson.co.uk/tag/keyboards/ https://www.ibbotson.co.uk/tag/keyboards/ I'm mulling over doing a custom design with a ISO/US layout so I can kill the function key row but keep both ~` and the escape key. Basically the "Vortex Vibe" but with an ISO layout.

rualca 6y ago

> Why are so many keyboards tiny like this? If I want a small keyboard, I will just use a laptop. That makes absolutely no sense. Your choice of keyboard should not come attached to a monitor. Furthermore, laptop keyboards are notoriously unmaintainable and uncleanable. If all you want is to be able to use a nice keyboard that doesn't take over half your desk space, specially if it's already cramped, then this is the stuff you crave.

jeromenerf 6y ago

Let aside the personal preferences, 60% was popularized by the gaming crowd: 1. Small means the mouse is closer to the keyboard 2. Games often rely on wasd instead of arrows 3. 40% cheaper for alternative switches and keycaps, or higher margins for the producers 4. Style and look may feel like more exclusive, competitive, make hands look bigger. Fashion is important in this community. Thanks to their firmware, they are very usable but it is really a matter of personal preferences.

carlesfe 6y ago

In my case, I would like to use a bigger keyboard, but I need a 60%-style layout for RSI reasons. Unless my right hand (mouse) is very close to my left one, I get RSI. I started using keyboards without a numpad first, then without the nav cluster. Nowadays I choose keyboard which are taller but narrower, so that I can get the most functionality but without needing to force my right arm too far away: https://tex.com.tw/products/shinobi?variant=16969883648090 https://tex.com.tw/products/shinobi?variant=16969883648090

gnud 6y ago
I've never had 'proper' RSI, but I solved all my wrist strain woes by simply placing the mouse smack bang in front of the space key, at a 270 degree angle, so moving the mouse to my left translates to the pointer moving up. It gives my right hand a much better position, it's quick to switch between mouse and keyboard, and it gives my elbows room to rest on the table. The only downside is that it requires a slightly deeper desk than having the mouse next to the keyboard, but you probably want space on the desk for your arms anyway.
- BigJ1211 6y ago
  I'm using a linear columnar split keyboard now (moonlander from zsa, redox from falbatech before that). That has done much more to reduce strain than anything else I tried. I would also highly recommend getting a trackball, personally I'm a programmer and have to rely on my hands despite having RSI and CTS.
  - devenvdev 6y ago
    I was getting RSI constantly no matter what ergonomic keyboard I had (MS sculp or whatsitsname was the only one bearable), eventually I got a programmable split keyboard, ZSA Moonlander - RSI immediately gone. But apparently that was even an overkill, I loved the programmable part so much that I decided to buy Planck for my gaming pc because it's tiny and can fit on my couch-mouse-pad setup... No RSI either! I use it for programming too now. I have a theory that what was hurting me was the need to move fingers to backspace, ctrl, etc. And maybe the staggering as you need to twist your wrists a little all the time. Ortholinear feels just... more sensible, for muscle memory... From now on I buy only ortholinear programmable keyboards, they are fun, make more sense, and don't get me RSI!

sonnyp 6y ago

In this case I believe it's because System76 want to start designing their own laptop rather than relying on off-the-shelf Clevo designs and some of this keyboard design might make it into their own laptop. I do like smaller keyboards though, easier to switch with laptop, less finger travel, less travel to the mouse and so on

kohlerm 6y ago
That would be great, e.g. a customizable laptop keyboard with an open source firmware :-)

slightwinder 6y ago

They are small in number of keys, not in size. Moving hands too much is not benefitial for typing, so why bother with it? If you need more keys, you can just attatch an extra keyboard, macropad/numberpad or other input-device, reconfigure it with specific settings and waste all the space you want.

jeffchien 6y ago

Many commenters offered reasons to like 60%, but as a TKL enthusiast myself, I'm inclined to think that it's mostly a supply issue, because I've seen many 75% and TKL group buys get a ton of demand. 60% is just easier to machine: the top is just a frame and thus doesn't need various holes for ESC, function groups, etc.

jbki 6y ago

it makes zero sense that the space bar is the size that it is.

squarefoot 6y ago

If you're lucky, you can find old IBM model M keyboards for free, or close. I got two, first one like 25 years ago from a surplus store for like 10 Euros of today and the second one a few years later for free as it was being thrown away by a government office "because it doesn't fit the rack drawer and doesn't have windows keys". I'm still using the first one, which is old enough to carry a shiny Lotus 1-2-3 version 2.2 sticker on it. Those are rock solid beasts; I already know I'll die a lot before any of these keyboards will fail, and I don't plan to die soon:). No USB connection of course as those keyboards predate the standard, but any cheapo PS/2-USB converter will work.

bluGill 6y ago
I've been told that not all PS2-USB converters work. But many cheap ones do, so just get from a place with a good return policy. Beware that the Model M draws more power than USB is allowed to supply. I've never heard of this being a problem in the real world, but I always plug my model M into a powered hub to ensure there is plenty of power available.
- mohaine 6y ago
  Many PS2-USB "converters" are really just "adapters" that actually rely on the keyboard to do the heavy lifting internally. These do not work at all. It sounds like it has gotten better but it used to be quite hard to get an M working. Of course these isn't much(any?) other ~40 year old PC equipment that is this easy to get working.
- squarefoot 6y ago
  > I've been told that not all PS2-USB converters work. True converters do. Those that don't work are just connector adapters relying on the mainboard to recognize that a PS/2 device is connected although on a USB port. To be sure you get a working adapter, never buy single port ones as they often contain just connection wires. All converters I tried with dual PS2 port, to be used with mouse and keyboard together, contained a real protocol converter and worked flawlessly on all PCs. An image search for "ps/2 usb" returns may examples of the two converters types.

swalsh 6y ago

The Model M really was the pinnacle of keyboards.

bluGill 6y ago
The much older model F was very good - some people tell me better. I believe I've tried one in the past, but it was so long ago that I can't remember. There were a lot of great keyboards back then. Keyboard quality went off a cliff in the mid 1990s. Someday I want to find a Northgate omni-key from that era which people tell me is the best.

LeonidasXIV 6y ago

Personally I have my keyboard on my lap so having a full-size keyboard is rather inconvenient. But I think this video is an excellent introduction on the reasoning why tiny keyboards are popular: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKGXZ1ReU54 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKGXZ1ReU54

tgtweak 6y ago

I always wondered this too and it seems odd, but, over the last 5 years I'm noticing a trend of developers using their macbooks/ultrabooks as primary and they are used to that format and look for it in a workstation/docked keyboard. Personally my numpad is indispensable and I never understood the desire to have a tiny keyboard.

retzkek 6y ago
Most "tiny" keyboard layouts put the numpad one keypress away, right under your hand. With an ortho keyboard you don't even have to retrain muscle memory. There's very little downside.

Weebs 6y ago

Two main reasons for me 1) More space for my mouse when playing games. I prefer a low sens and full sized keyboards are a legitimate problem for this 2) Desk space. If I'm not playing games it's also helpful to have space for a notebook next to my keyboard when working, or my MIDI controller while making music.

chrisBob 6y ago

My primary keyboard now is a Kinesis Freestyle Pro, and my favorite feature isn't the split, it that it's programmable and has a split spacebar. The main reason I moved my hands around before was to use the arrow keys, and now they are mapped to [right spacebar] + [IJKL]. I have also expanded a little to use U and O as backspace and delete on that same layer. I don't think I could ever memorize 3+ layers, but this small use of a second layer that is very easy to access has been great for me.

rovr138 6y ago

Some people like them. I use a kinesis advantage which is not small.

allenu 6y ago

I prefer the smaller footprint because it means I don't have to reach too far to the right when I use my trackpad. I've been using a HHKB for the past 3 years and have gotten used to not having to stretch my right arm to reach the trackpad. You get used to the arrow keys being in a different place as well, especially with the HHKB which requires you to press a function key to use them.