4 ms·

The organisation behind it has already ruled there wont be an event this year no matter how thick the ice gets. But people get the “fever” every time the temper

The organisation behind it has already ruled there wont be an event this year no matter how thick the ice gets. But people get the “fever” every time the temperature drops below 0 Celcius. This happens every year, it’s a thing. Also because of next month’s elections some opportunistic/populistic partys are using this event as the hill to die on, hoping to catch some votes and ignoring what people might really be catching in case of such an event.

FriendlyNormie 6y ago
Oh no, not the flu! Die faggot.
Freak_NL 6y ago
As some journalists have noted: the 'fever' shows up mostly below the imaginary line you get if you connect the cities of Alkmaar and Zwolle. That is, there is no 'fever' in the province of Fryslân (or Frisia in English) where the event is held and treasured most dearly. Here in the province people are resigned to the event not happening this year, due to a lack of decent ice and Covid. There will be plenty of skating this weekend, but nothing on the scale of the Elfstedentocht. And indeed, the brandishing of this event by the populist leaders of the two farright political parties in the Netherlands as something that absolutely must go on if the ice does shape up, leaves a sour taste in many a Frisian's mouth. (Source: I'm a born and bred Frisian living there.)
- hutzlibu 6y ago
  "due to a lack of decent ice " Well, at least the ice should be there, soon?
  - Freak_NL 6y ago
    Seems doubtful at this point. The quality of the ice is quite bad up North because of the snow (you get brittle snowy ice), and the weather predications note a 75% chance of thaw setting in come Monday: https://www.knmi.nl/nederland-nu/weer/verwachtingen https://www.knmi.nl/nederland-nu/weer/verwachtingen Some people might go skating in the weekend, but really, the thickness of the ice is pretty minimal. As the local ice master says: > Der sil hjir en dêr wol wat riden wurde, mar dat is de ferantwurdlikens fan minsken sels. Wy sille de sleatten en fearten noch net frij jaan. Dat sjoch ik der net fan kommen. Ik jou pas grien ljocht as der op bepaalde plakken in smak minsken oer it iis kin. (https://www.lc.nl/friesland/IJsmeester-acht-kans-op-schaatsen-op-natuurijs-dit-weekend-niet-zo-groot-Der-leit-noch-mar-in-skyltsje-26481776.html https://www.lc.nl/friesland/IJsmeester-acht-kans-op-schaatse...) That is: he won't green-light the ice for safe use by the public, and it is quite literally nowhere near the thickness required for a mass event.
    - umanwizard 6y ago
      Tangential observation: Google Translate detects your text as Frisian, but regardless of whether I select Frisian or Dutch, it gives an identical translation into English. Which is it really? And are the two languages really so similar that Google should be able to understand them interchangeably?
      - Freak_NL 6y ago
        It is West-Frisian (Frysk), and the languages are close, but so are Dutch and German or West-Frisian and German (so not that close). I'm not getting the behaviour you describe though. It detects West-Frisian and does a passable translation, but if I force it to see Dutch as the source it makes no sense of it at all. It is also failing quite hilariously on „in smak minsken”, which means “quite a bunch of people”, but gets translated as “a taste people”. Google sees „smak” as a misspelling of „smaak” (taste), but it means “a bunch” or “many”.
        umanwizard 6y ago
        You are right: I tried again and I can't reproduce the behavior. Perhaps I got confused and selected Frisian twice, the first time I tried. (Google's UI lists it as simply "Frisian" for me, not West-Frisian).
        Freak_NL 6y ago
        I think most people call it Frisian. West-Frisian is used formally because other (mostly historic) variants exist. What is now the province of Frisia is only a modest part of what was once a larger kingdom stretching into the North-East of modern Germany (where Ost Friesland is the name of a region in Niedersachsen still). Confusingly, in the Netherlands there is a West-Friesland as well to the West of the province, but people don't speak or understand (West-)Frisian there.
- abelaer 6y ago
  "Nei twa kear nachtfroast wol de Hollanner der foar Hy ropt om 't hurdst: 'de tocht der tochten, die gaat door' Mar wy Friezen witte better iis is samar ek wer wetter En dus hâlde wy de kiezzen op elkoar"
  - Freak_NL 6y ago
    „It kin net!” Which means “It's not possible!”, but sounds like “It's just barely possible!” to Dutch not used to the language and dialects from the North of the country. This commercial was popular back in the day, and is a tongue-in-cheek exploration of this topic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUXiqkAKr-0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUXiqkAKr-0 (Piss-poor quality recording unfortunately, but many Dutch here will remember having seen it.)
rocqua 6y ago
Last I heard, the organization said "the event cannot be held with the current corona rules". Which leaves a lot of room, specifically if the government decides to amend the rules. Besides, if the ice does seem like it will be good enough (which might be if the cold snap seems to hold for next week as well) I think the fever will start increasing in Friesland. Once that starts happening, public pressure will also start to mount.
Aeolun 6y ago
I cannot imagine anyone catching covid while traveling at 40 km/h over the ice. It’s basically impossible to get outside in the first place (unless you are standing mouth to mouth with someone).
- Denvercoder9 6y ago
  > I cannot imagine anyone catching covid while traveling at 40 km/h over the ice. The big issue isn't the skating itself, but the logistics at start/finish and the stempelposten with its congestion, as well as the 1 to 1.5 million spectators over a course of 200 km with their parties and alcohol consumption, and the logistics to get everyone there and back (full trains and busses). > It’s basically impossible to get outside in the first place (unless you are standing mouth to mouth with someone). Source?
  - Aeolun 6y ago
    I’m extrapolating from my experiences, though I don’t think research disagrees with me here. Here is the first one I could find: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.04.20053058v1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.04.20053058v... > We identified only a single outbreak in an outdoor environment, which involved two cases. The first salient feature of the 318 identified outbreaks that involved three or more cases is that they all occurred in indoor environments. And another: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/medrxiv/early/2020/09/10/2020.09.04.20188417.1.full.pdf https://www.medrxiv.org/content/medrxiv/early/2020/09/10/202... > A database of more than 20,000 cases (including the 7,324 Chinese cases) found 461 that were associated with transmission in completely outdoor environments — predominantly crowded events like markets and rallies. (emphasis mine) Your points about attendant risks are probably true though. People will definitely congregate to drink beer and eat soup, and we’ll have another carnival on our hands :/
- Cthulhu_ 6y ago
  You seem to be making a few statements based on gut feeling instead of hard numbers. While I also think (opinion, I have no facts to back it) that being outside is safer than staying indoors, I don't think organizing an event is safe. I mean the Netherlands got their first major outbreak thanks to carnaval last year, which is a partially outdoor event. Another one, in the US, the Sturgis motorcycle rally created a big wave in spreading the 'rona (https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6947e1.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6947e1.htm)

FriendlyNormie 6y ago

Oh no, not the flu! Die faggot.

Freak_NL 6y ago

As some journalists have noted: the 'fever' shows up mostly below the imaginary line you get if you connect the cities of Alkmaar and Zwolle. That is, there is no 'fever' in the province of Fryslân (or Frisia in English) where the event is held and treasured most dearly. Here in the province people are resigned to the event not happening this year, due to a lack of decent ice and Covid. There will be plenty of skating this weekend, but nothing on the scale of the Elfstedentocht. And indeed, the brandishing of this event by the populist leaders of the two farright political parties in the Netherlands as something that absolutely must go on if the ice does shape up, leaves a sour taste in many a Frisian's mouth. (Source: I'm a born and bred Frisian living there.)

hutzlibu 6y ago
"due to a lack of decent ice " Well, at least the ice should be there, soon?
- Freak_NL 6y ago
  Seems doubtful at this point. The quality of the ice is quite bad up North because of the snow (you get brittle snowy ice), and the weather predications note a 75% chance of thaw setting in come Monday: https://www.knmi.nl/nederland-nu/weer/verwachtingen https://www.knmi.nl/nederland-nu/weer/verwachtingen Some people might go skating in the weekend, but really, the thickness of the ice is pretty minimal. As the local ice master says: > Der sil hjir en dêr wol wat riden wurde, mar dat is de ferantwurdlikens fan minsken sels. Wy sille de sleatten en fearten noch net frij jaan. Dat sjoch ik der net fan kommen. Ik jou pas grien ljocht as der op bepaalde plakken in smak minsken oer it iis kin. (https://www.lc.nl/friesland/IJsmeester-acht-kans-op-schaatsen-op-natuurijs-dit-weekend-niet-zo-groot-Der-leit-noch-mar-in-skyltsje-26481776.html https://www.lc.nl/friesland/IJsmeester-acht-kans-op-schaatse...) That is: he won't green-light the ice for safe use by the public, and it is quite literally nowhere near the thickness required for a mass event.
  - umanwizard 6y ago
    Tangential observation: Google Translate detects your text as Frisian, but regardless of whether I select Frisian or Dutch, it gives an identical translation into English. Which is it really? And are the two languages really so similar that Google should be able to understand them interchangeably?
    - Freak_NL 6y ago
      It is West-Frisian (Frysk), and the languages are close, but so are Dutch and German or West-Frisian and German (so not that close). I'm not getting the behaviour you describe though. It detects West-Frisian and does a passable translation, but if I force it to see Dutch as the source it makes no sense of it at all. It is also failing quite hilariously on „in smak minsken”, which means “quite a bunch of people”, but gets translated as “a taste people”. Google sees „smak” as a misspelling of „smaak” (taste), but it means “a bunch” or “many”.
      - umanwizard 6y ago
        You are right: I tried again and I can't reproduce the behavior. Perhaps I got confused and selected Frisian twice, the first time I tried. (Google's UI lists it as simply "Frisian" for me, not West-Frisian).
        Freak_NL 6y ago
        I think most people call it Frisian. West-Frisian is used formally because other (mostly historic) variants exist. What is now the province of Frisia is only a modest part of what was once a larger kingdom stretching into the North-East of modern Germany (where Ost Friesland is the name of a region in Niedersachsen still). Confusingly, in the Netherlands there is a West-Friesland as well to the West of the province, but people don't speak or understand (West-)Frisian there.
abelaer 6y ago
"Nei twa kear nachtfroast wol de Hollanner der foar Hy ropt om 't hurdst: 'de tocht der tochten, die gaat door' Mar wy Friezen witte better iis is samar ek wer wetter En dus hâlde wy de kiezzen op elkoar"
- Freak_NL 6y ago
  „It kin net!” Which means “It's not possible!”, but sounds like “It's just barely possible!” to Dutch not used to the language and dialects from the North of the country. This commercial was popular back in the day, and is a tongue-in-cheek exploration of this topic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUXiqkAKr-0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUXiqkAKr-0 (Piss-poor quality recording unfortunately, but many Dutch here will remember having seen it.)

rocqua 6y ago

Last I heard, the organization said "the event cannot be held with the current corona rules". Which leaves a lot of room, specifically if the government decides to amend the rules. Besides, if the ice does seem like it will be good enough (which might be if the cold snap seems to hold for next week as well) I think the fever will start increasing in Friesland. Once that starts happening, public pressure will also start to mount.

Aeolun 6y ago

I cannot imagine anyone catching covid while traveling at 40 km/h over the ice. It’s basically impossible to get outside in the first place (unless you are standing mouth to mouth with someone).

Denvercoder9 6y ago
> I cannot imagine anyone catching covid while traveling at 40 km/h over the ice. The big issue isn't the skating itself, but the logistics at start/finish and the stempelposten with its congestion, as well as the 1 to 1.5 million spectators over a course of 200 km with their parties and alcohol consumption, and the logistics to get everyone there and back (full trains and busses). > It’s basically impossible to get outside in the first place (unless you are standing mouth to mouth with someone). Source?
- Aeolun 6y ago
  I’m extrapolating from my experiences, though I don’t think research disagrees with me here. Here is the first one I could find: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.04.20053058v1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.04.20053058v... > We identified only a single outbreak in an outdoor environment, which involved two cases. The first salient feature of the 318 identified outbreaks that involved three or more cases is that they all occurred in indoor environments. And another: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/medrxiv/early/2020/09/10/2020.09.04.20188417.1.full.pdf https://www.medrxiv.org/content/medrxiv/early/2020/09/10/202... > A database of more than 20,000 cases (including the 7,324 Chinese cases) found 461 that were associated with transmission in completely outdoor environments — predominantly crowded events like markets and rallies. (emphasis mine) Your points about attendant risks are probably true though. People will definitely congregate to drink beer and eat soup, and we’ll have another carnival on our hands :/
Cthulhu_ 6y ago
You seem to be making a few statements based on gut feeling instead of hard numbers. While I also think (opinion, I have no facts to back it) that being outside is safer than staying indoors, I don't think organizing an event is safe. I mean the Netherlands got their first major outbreak thanks to carnaval last year, which is a partially outdoor event. Another one, in the US, the Sturgis motorcycle rally created a big wave in spreading the 'rona (https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6947e1.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6947e1.htm)