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I don't see how this addresses any of the concerns brought up in the article. This entire spat is because SpaceX got approval from the FCC to deploy their syste

I don't see how this addresses any of the concerns brought up in the article. This entire spat is because SpaceX got approval from the FCC to deploy their system in a specific way, and Amazon acknowledged that and designed their system in a way to not interfere with SpaceX. Now SpaceX is coming and saying they want to change their system in a way to interfere with Amazon. Forget the names of the companies and their leaders for a second. We have a shared public resource, like a pond. Company A showed up and says "I am going to set up shop on this side of the pond, and we will leave the rest of the pond open for other people to use." Company B then says "okay, we are going to set up shop on the other side of the pond so we don't interfere with each other." Company A then says "no, we actually want to use that side of the pond, too. too bad for you". In what universe is Company A in the right here, and why does it matter who gets there first? It's clearly anti-competitive practice on the part of Company A trying to shut out Company B, and the only people who will suffer from it are the general public.

bpodgursky 6y ago
How long is an appropriate window for Amazon to lock down orbital slots without a solid plan to use it? I can understand a year or two, especially if they have orbital capacity ready. But six years? The space could provisionally be granted to SpaceX with a 15 year renewal period or something. Locking down options for a decade on wishful thinking does not seem particularly competitive for me.
- marsokod 6y ago
  Six years is not that long. You need to have the frequency to finalize the design of your payload, if not your satellite. And for big constellations you need the frequency to talk seriously with your investors. So 6 years to design a platform, a ground segment and launch half your constellation is not an easy task.
- tidepod12 6y ago
  In 2017 SpaceX was granted a window to "lock down" its proposed slots for 9 years to prevent others from taking those slots, and that was years before they even had a single satellite flying. I don't see why Amazon shouldn't be given the same treatment.
  - bpodgursky 6y ago
    SpaceX was launching large batches of satellites by 2019, two years later! And even in 2017, they had proven mass launch capacity. Yes, sure, give Amazon the same treatment. Start orbiting large numbers of satellites in 2022 or you lose it.
- cozzyd 6y ago
  It's six years to deploy half of the planned satellites, which would assuredly imply the first satellites go significantly before that. Also, it's not like the FCC should be allowed to take it back, even if 6 years is unreasonable.
tidepod12 6y ago
Secondary comment: SpaceX's behavior in this instance is not unlike every other ISP in America engaging in anti-competitive behavior to keep newcomers out. Remember when Google Fiber was rolling out and tried to use fiber/utility poles in a way that allowed ISPs to share public utility poles? But then ATT pitched a fit [1, 2] saying "actually we don't want Google Fiber to do that because it could possibly harm our business in some unspecified and vague way", basically killing the expansion of Fiber [3]? And who suffered? All of us unlucky Americans who are now stuck with exorbitant prices for ridiculous internet plans from ATT because we don't have any other options. We already have an absolutely terrible oligopoly of wired ISPs, do we really want to start down this path of allowing the same to happen for space-based internet, too? 1: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160923/06590635601/att-sues-nashville-to-keep-google-fiber-bay.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160923/06590635601/att-s... 2: https://www.slashgear.com/att-files-lawsuit-to-hinder-google-fiber-in-louisville-26429213/ https://www.slashgear.com/att-files-lawsuit-to-hinder-google... 3: https://www.theverge.com/2019/2/7/18215743/google-fiber-leaving-louisville-service-ending https://www.theverge.com/2019/2/7/18215743/google-fiber-leav...
- jacquesm 6y ago
  And then there is the little detail that this is being decided for the whole world but actually just benefits one, possibly two companies from the United States. Space belongs to all of us, not just to the USA.
  - cozzyd 6y ago
    Yeah, it's not clear to me why the FCC (and not ITU or some multinational body) has jurisdiction here. What remedy would Musk have if Russia decided to launch CosmosNet or whatever that was interfering?
    - tidepod12 6y ago
      The ITU does have jurisdiction. Since SpaceX (and Amazon) are US companies, they work with the FCC, who then works with the ITU on behalf of SpaceX/Amazon.

bpodgursky 6y ago

How long is an appropriate window for Amazon to lock down orbital slots without a solid plan to use it? I can understand a year or two, especially if they have orbital capacity ready. But six years? The space could provisionally be granted to SpaceX with a 15 year renewal period or something. Locking down options for a decade on wishful thinking does not seem particularly competitive for me.

marsokod 6y ago
Six years is not that long. You need to have the frequency to finalize the design of your payload, if not your satellite. And for big constellations you need the frequency to talk seriously with your investors. So 6 years to design a platform, a ground segment and launch half your constellation is not an easy task.
tidepod12 6y ago
In 2017 SpaceX was granted a window to "lock down" its proposed slots for 9 years to prevent others from taking those slots, and that was years before they even had a single satellite flying. I don't see why Amazon shouldn't be given the same treatment.
- bpodgursky 6y ago
  SpaceX was launching large batches of satellites by 2019, two years later! And even in 2017, they had proven mass launch capacity. Yes, sure, give Amazon the same treatment. Start orbiting large numbers of satellites in 2022 or you lose it.
cozzyd 6y ago
It's six years to deploy half of the planned satellites, which would assuredly imply the first satellites go significantly before that. Also, it's not like the FCC should be allowed to take it back, even if 6 years is unreasonable.

tidepod12 6y ago

Secondary comment: SpaceX's behavior in this instance is not unlike every other ISP in America engaging in anti-competitive behavior to keep newcomers out. Remember when Google Fiber was rolling out and tried to use fiber/utility poles in a way that allowed ISPs to share public utility poles? But then ATT pitched a fit [1, 2] saying "actually we don't want Google Fiber to do that because it could possibly harm our business in some unspecified and vague way", basically killing the expansion of Fiber [3]? And who suffered? All of us unlucky Americans who are now stuck with exorbitant prices for ridiculous internet plans from ATT because we don't have any other options. We already have an absolutely terrible oligopoly of wired ISPs, do we really want to start down this path of allowing the same to happen for space-based internet, too? 1: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160923/06590635601/att-sues-nashville-to-keep-google-fiber-bay.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160923/06590635601/att-s... 2: https://www.slashgear.com/att-files-lawsuit-to-hinder-google-fiber-in-louisville-26429213/ https://www.slashgear.com/att-files-lawsuit-to-hinder-google... 3: https://www.theverge.com/2019/2/7/18215743/google-fiber-leaving-louisville-service-ending https://www.theverge.com/2019/2/7/18215743/google-fiber-leav...

jacquesm 6y ago
And then there is the little detail that this is being decided for the whole world but actually just benefits one, possibly two companies from the United States. Space belongs to all of us, not just to the USA.
- cozzyd 6y ago
  Yeah, it's not clear to me why the FCC (and not ITU or some multinational body) has jurisdiction here. What remedy would Musk have if Russia decided to launch CosmosNet or whatever that was interfering?
  - tidepod12 6y ago
    The ITU does have jurisdiction. Since SpaceX (and Amazon) are US companies, they work with the FCC, who then works with the ITU on behalf of SpaceX/Amazon.