6 ms·

We want to be treated as club member and reap all the perks, but we don't want to be in the club though.

lou1306 6y ago
And the irony is, you actually were reaping a lot of the perks while not being "in the club" under many, many respects (the €, first of all). Just a sad, sad turn of events all around.
- that_guy_iain 6y ago
  The UK had literally the best deal in Europe. They had a rebate, they weren't a member of the schengen area, they refused the Euro, etc. They then went and got more concessions and then decided to leave. And now the hardcore Brexit people think all the negative effects they were warned about for 5+ years is the EU punishing them.
  - imtringued 6y ago
    From a pragmatic standpoint the Euro is a complete failure. I don't blame any country that decided against adopting it. However, the rest is relatively solid. There are warts and inefficiencies like in every governing body but it's does its job as an economic union.
    - jokethrowaway 6y ago
      I disagree, every added governing body is a failure in itself. I would prefer to just see a Europe-light with countries maintaining their currency and laws and just dropping trade restrictions, import taxes and need for touristic visas. I'd even extend it to any country in the world, let the customer decide if the want to buy from China or from the UK
      - lou1306 6y ago
        But "dropping trade restrictions, import taxes and need for touristic visas" automatically leads to production shifting towards the countries with the loosest regulation and the lowest wages. So, you need at least a supranational regulation body that tries to make regulations uniform across the zone. But then, you need a supranational body of elected officials to jointly control that regulation body, by passing legislation. But then, you need an executive body that sets the agenda of the legislative body. And some judiciary mechanisms to handle transgressions to the laws and regulations coming from all these organs. And then... you basically end up with something pretty similar to the EU as we know it. (I'm not saying the EU is perfect, mind you. Just that they didn't create such a complex collection of institutions just "for the lulz")
  - ben_w 6y ago
    FWIW, I think the UK would’ve been better off if it had joined the Schengen Agreement. But you are absolutely right that Brexit people are treating the exact things they dismissed as Project Fear as if it was a punishment. I’d personally witnessed this happening even before the referendum, in a conversation which went: Him: “Brexit will be fine because the EU will give us a good deal” Me: “No” Him, shouting: “That proves we should leave!” I almost wish I’d had a camera running at the time. I am well aware how mad it sounds.
    - me_me_me 6y ago
      While not in Schengen zone, UK had minimal check at the boarders when coming from EU. It was a fairly free flow approach.

And the irony is, you actually were reaping a lot of the perks while not being "in the club" under many, many respects (the €, first of all). Just a sad, sad turn of events all around.

that_guy_iain 6y ago
The UK had literally the best deal in Europe. They had a rebate, they weren't a member of the schengen area, they refused the Euro, etc. They then went and got more concessions and then decided to leave. And now the hardcore Brexit people think all the negative effects they were warned about for 5+ years is the EU punishing them.
- imtringued 6y ago
  From a pragmatic standpoint the Euro is a complete failure. I don't blame any country that decided against adopting it. However, the rest is relatively solid. There are warts and inefficiencies like in every governing body but it's does its job as an economic union.
  - jokethrowaway 6y ago
    I disagree, every added governing body is a failure in itself. I would prefer to just see a Europe-light with countries maintaining their currency and laws and just dropping trade restrictions, import taxes and need for touristic visas. I'd even extend it to any country in the world, let the customer decide if the want to buy from China or from the UK
    - lou1306 6y ago
      But "dropping trade restrictions, import taxes and need for touristic visas" automatically leads to production shifting towards the countries with the loosest regulation and the lowest wages. So, you need at least a supranational regulation body that tries to make regulations uniform across the zone. But then, you need a supranational body of elected officials to jointly control that regulation body, by passing legislation. But then, you need an executive body that sets the agenda of the legislative body. And some judiciary mechanisms to handle transgressions to the laws and regulations coming from all these organs. And then... you basically end up with something pretty similar to the EU as we know it. (I'm not saying the EU is perfect, mind you. Just that they didn't create such a complex collection of institutions just "for the lulz")
- ben_w 6y ago
  FWIW, I think the UK would’ve been better off if it had joined the Schengen Agreement. But you are absolutely right that Brexit people are treating the exact things they dismissed as Project Fear as if it was a punishment. I’d personally witnessed this happening even before the referendum, in a conversation which went: Him: “Brexit will be fine because the EU will give us a good deal” Me: “No” Him, shouting: “That proves we should leave!” I almost wish I’d had a camera running at the time. I am well aware how mad it sounds.
  - me_me_me 6y ago
    While not in Schengen zone, UK had minimal check at the boarders when coming from EU. It was a fairly free flow approach.