3 ms·

Does TikTok have a problem with Black women’s bodies?

13 points by laurex 6y ago

SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
I clicked through to the Twitter thread, and the examples of removed videos seem to be people dancing in their underwear. Does Tiktok allow that in the first place?
- imbnwa 6y ago
  Uh, TikTok is PACKED with softcore content. Them saying Lizzo was posting sexually explicit content is highly questionable if not a lie.
  - SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
    I'll have to take your word for it. I've never seen anything on this level, but the feed is algorithmic enough it's plausible I'm just screened off from it.
    - imbnwa 6y ago
      The For You feed is not the total interface to TikTok content. The article is not talking about being removed from the feed, its talking about being removed from TikTok simpliciter
croissants 6y ago
Also at https://archive.is/2Qnhn https://archive.is/2Qnhn. Maybe it's still in the "honeymoon" phase in the west, but I'm surprised TikTok hasn't attracted more, uh, Twitter opprobrium over stuff like this: > The Intercept published internal documents from TikTok instructing moderators to limit content showing users who were “obese” or with an “abnormal body shape,” who had “ugly facial looks,” and who appeared in front of “shabby and dilapidated” environments. TikTok’s response was that some of the guidelines were initially intended to prevent bullying but were no longer in use when The Intercept published them. The documents, according to The Intercept, made no mention of bullying.
- BelenusMordred 6y ago
  TikTok is in the business of giving people what they want. If you heard a TV or movie producer say "I don't hire fat people" would you really be in the slightest surprised or even angry? If every actor was replaced with plus sized, differently abled people what do you think would happen to their earnings? Would you really go watch those blockbusters now? Folks skirt around this uncomfortable truth anyway they can but it's a cold hard fact of human nature. In the end it's their platform, anyone is free to go make their own tiktok full of dilapidated houses if they want.
  - croissants 6y ago
    I agree that TikTok is incentivized to select videos that people, for whatever reason, like. What I find strange is that there is a vocal group of people that ordinarily find this kind of story upsetting and produce public criticism, but I see a surprisingly small amount of it "in the wild" against TikTok. It's doubly surprising because a lot of those people seem to enjoy and use TikTok. Maybe the story just never got sufficient traction.
  - pedrocr 6y ago
    That would seem like a great defense if it was the algorithm making a choice on what to promote. But they're apparently actively removing the content. There doesn't seem to be any reason for that in their model.
Shadonototro 6y ago
Interesting, since the west got caught doing worse: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/sep/21/twitter-apologises-for-racist-image-cropping-algorithm https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/sep/21/twitter-a...
- rory 6y ago
  Not that your link isn't a problem, but I don't think algorithm bias (which Twitter tried to fix when discovered) is worse than an explicit policy to suppress content with: > Abnormal body shape, chubby, have obvious beer belly, obese, or too thin (not limited to: dwarf, acromegaly). > Ugly facial looks (not limited to: disformatted face, fangs, lack of front teeth, senior people with too many wrinkles, obvious facial scars) or facial deformities (not limited to: eye disorders, crooked mouth disease and other disabilities). Source: https://theintercept.com/document/2020/03/16/ugly-content-policy/ https://theintercept.com/document/2020/03/16/ugly-content-po...
xtiansimon 6y ago
This is icky in lots of ways. In a fashion-industry-sense with skinny bodies. In beauty-industry sense with preference to light to medium skin tones. Some of those things are influenced by technological constraints of photography and printing. Singular body type at runway shows so you can swap an outfit onto any body. There are beauty norms for any culture at any given time, but media and technology have strange effects. Now with TikTok and the virility of videos users are playing with, I’m wondering about memes. my memes and stronger than your memes. BLM is serious and heady material for kids. In the same way every nerd fantasies about light sabers but after Star Wars kid, they might think twice. Push to the middle. Round off the edges. My2c

13 points by laurex 6y ago

I clicked through to the Twitter thread, and the examples of removed videos seem to be people dancing in their underwear. Does Tiktok allow that in the first place?

imbnwa 6y ago
Uh, TikTok is PACKED with softcore content. Them saying Lizzo was posting sexually explicit content is highly questionable if not a lie.
- SpicyLemonZest 6y ago
  I'll have to take your word for it. I've never seen anything on this level, but the feed is algorithmic enough it's plausible I'm just screened off from it.
  - imbnwa 6y ago
    The For You feed is not the total interface to TikTok content. The article is not talking about being removed from the feed, its talking about being removed from TikTok simpliciter

croissants 6y ago

Also at https://archive.is/2Qnhn https://archive.is/2Qnhn. Maybe it's still in the "honeymoon" phase in the west, but I'm surprised TikTok hasn't attracted more, uh, Twitter opprobrium over stuff like this: > The Intercept published internal documents from TikTok instructing moderators to limit content showing users who were “obese” or with an “abnormal body shape,” who had “ugly facial looks,” and who appeared in front of “shabby and dilapidated” environments. TikTok’s response was that some of the guidelines were initially intended to prevent bullying but were no longer in use when The Intercept published them. The documents, according to The Intercept, made no mention of bullying.

BelenusMordred 6y ago
TikTok is in the business of giving people what they want. If you heard a TV or movie producer say "I don't hire fat people" would you really be in the slightest surprised or even angry? If every actor was replaced with plus sized, differently abled people what do you think would happen to their earnings? Would you really go watch those blockbusters now? Folks skirt around this uncomfortable truth anyway they can but it's a cold hard fact of human nature. In the end it's their platform, anyone is free to go make their own tiktok full of dilapidated houses if they want.
- croissants 6y ago
  I agree that TikTok is incentivized to select videos that people, for whatever reason, like. What I find strange is that there is a vocal group of people that ordinarily find this kind of story upsetting and produce public criticism, but I see a surprisingly small amount of it "in the wild" against TikTok. It's doubly surprising because a lot of those people seem to enjoy and use TikTok. Maybe the story just never got sufficient traction.
- pedrocr 6y ago
  That would seem like a great defense if it was the algorithm making a choice on what to promote. But they're apparently actively removing the content. There doesn't seem to be any reason for that in their model.

Shadonototro 6y ago

Interesting, since the west got caught doing worse: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/sep/21/twitter-apologises-for-racist-image-cropping-algorithm https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/sep/21/twitter-a...

rory 6y ago
Not that your link isn't a problem, but I don't think algorithm bias (which Twitter tried to fix when discovered) is worse than an explicit policy to suppress content with: > Abnormal body shape, chubby, have obvious beer belly, obese, or too thin (not limited to: dwarf, acromegaly). > Ugly facial looks (not limited to: disformatted face, fangs, lack of front teeth, senior people with too many wrinkles, obvious facial scars) or facial deformities (not limited to: eye disorders, crooked mouth disease and other disabilities). Source: https://theintercept.com/document/2020/03/16/ugly-content-policy/ https://theintercept.com/document/2020/03/16/ugly-content-po...

xtiansimon 6y ago

This is icky in lots of ways. In a fashion-industry-sense with skinny bodies. In beauty-industry sense with preference to light to medium skin tones. Some of those things are influenced by technological constraints of photography and printing. Singular body type at runway shows so you can swap an outfit onto any body. There are beauty norms for any culture at any given time, but media and technology have strange effects. Now with TikTok and the virility of videos users are playing with, I’m wondering about memes. my memes and stronger than your memes. BLM is serious and heady material for kids. In the same way every nerd fantasies about light sabers but after Star Wars kid, they might think twice. Push to the middle. Round off the edges. My2c