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CodeMirror is such an awesome library, its one of the core components in our snippet management tool https://codekeep.io https://codekeep.io
by jp1016 6y ago
CodeMirror is such an awesome library, its one of the core components in our snippet management tool https://codekeep.io https://codekeep.io
- capableweb 6y agoSince it seems you're using CodeMirror commercially and it's a core part of your offering, can I ask if you are currently supporting the development financially?
- amelius 6y agoProseMirror (by the same original author) has this on its homepage: > If you are using ProseMirror to make profit, there is a social expectation that you help fund its maintenance. But I don't see anything similar on the CodeMirror homepage.
- mwest217 6y agoThere is something similar - it's under the About section: > CodeMirror is open source (MIT or GPL3). It is being developed on GitHub. Contributions are welcome. > If you are using CodeMirror commercially, there is a social expectation that you help fund its maintenance. Start here.
- xyzzy_plugh 6y agoThat's a pretty shitty thing to do, in my opinion. Guilt tripping isn't the right way to go about this. If you want your cake and to eat it too, then use a license that expects financial compensation from commercial uses.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- crystaln 6y agoConsensual financial support based on social expectation seems a lot less shitty to me than non-consensual financial support based on legal recourse.
- capableweb 6y ago> If you want your cake and to eat it too Indeed, so let's assume because CodeMirror doesn't have a license like that, the authors don't "want their cake and eat it too", as the license is simply open source. Don't know where you get the whole "guilt tripping" stuff from, having a message that says "if you enjoy this, please donate" is guilt tripping...
- xyzzy_plugh 6y agoIt doesn't say "If you enjoy this, please donate," it says: > If you are using CodeMirror commercially, there is a social expectation that you help fund its maintenance.
- capableweb 6y agoYou seem to be a bit stuck on semantics. The meaning of "there is a social expectation that you" amounts to "please". Just as you go to the doctor and the doctor says "please have a seat", it means you're expected to sit down. The doctor could also have said "There is a social expectation that you sit down now", and you could also say/do "No, I'd like to stand", which would have been fine too.
- raphlinus 6y agoThe use of a permissive license allows CodeMirror to be integrated into a lot more settings than would be possible with a copyleft license, even with a paid dual-license for proprietary applications. Marijn has given CodeMirror to the world for free, and it is in my opinion a very valuable contribution indeed. Comments like yours reflect an entitled view of what proper behavior is for an open source developer. Obviously anyone who wants to use CodeMirror commercially but doesn't feel Marijn is due any compensation for his work is free to act on that belief. I fail to see how that's "shitty."
- brasetvik 6y ago> That's a pretty shitty thing to do, in my opinion. The founder and main developer has shared some of his thoughts in this matter here: https://marijnhaverbeke.nl/blog/sustainable-maintenance.html https://marijnhaverbeke.nl/blog/sustainable-maintenance.html He has put thousands of hours into these projects, and are giving them away for free – that is, if you can stomach the slight hint that if you're making money on it, then maybe contribute a tiny bit. He hasn't blogged about burnout yet, like many other open source maintainers do. A recurring theme is about toxic community members. I hope he scrolls past your comment.
- xyzzy_plugh 6y agoI can't help but be irked by the push to consider profiting off Open Source software without financially contributing to be considered "socially unacceptable." I'm all for donating to Open Source projects and supporting maintainers, but if you expect to profit from corporations exploiting your software, maybe don't license it as OSS? If I use Open Sorce software and make money, but don't donate, is that socially unacceptable? Is that evil? Greedy? What about literally every company that uses Open Source software? Are they evil too? The spirit of Open Source software is that it comes with no or few strings attached. The idea that there is a social expectation to pay goes against that spirit, even if would be nice in theory.
- soamv 6y agoI'm so perplexed that someone would feel the need to attack an open source developer for a gentle suggestion of an optional donation. You're free to pretend there's a constrained license, and pay the project for their work. Are you saying you'd rather be forced to do so by a license? That makes no sense -- you can do it without being forced, if you want to.
- orra 6y agoYeah, it's an absurd complaint. I mean, I like copyleft licensing. But it's perfectly reasonable (albeit possibly naïve) to request commercial donations on a non-copyleft project.
- xyzzy_plugh 6y agoFor an author of an Open Source project to say it's "not socially acceptable" to use their software to make money without contributing back is heavily idealistic, but we don't live in a meritocracy. If I use the software and make money, but don't donate, should I fear being socially reprimanded? What's the line there? Piracy is one thing, but this borders on extortion and frankly would make me uncomfortable using this software.
- orra 6y agoI think you're being a bit melodramatic. It's a request, not a demand. And this project's maintainer is being more upfront than other projects.
- xyzzy_plugh 6y agoI'm not attacking anyone, and it's not a gentle suggestion for an optional donation. If it were, I'd have no problem here. I'm happy to support developers and am fully supportive of developers who accept donations. The developer states the following: > If you are using CodeMirror commercially, there is a social expectation that you help fund its maintenance. Calling it a "social expectation" is frankly a pretty big turn off for me.
- carapace 6y agoIt sounds like you're guilt tripping guilt tripping?
- xyzzy_plugh 6y agoCodeMirror is dual licensed under MIT and GPLv3. I don't mind the question but I do mind the implied shame it brings if the reply is "no". Which would be a perfectly fine reply. No one owes CodeMirror anything.
- capableweb 6y agoNot sure where the "implied shame" comes from, I certainly never put any shame if someone chooses not to donate to something where it's not required. I just saw the statement about the author wanting donations and thought I ask because I was curious. Both yes and no would have been fine in my book since as you say, no one owes CodeMirror nor the people behind it, anything.
- markdown 6y ago> No one owes CodeMirror anything. At the very least we owe people gratitude when they create something that improves our lives. Please get help. You're showing sociopathic tendencies.