5 ms·

That doesn't sound like the network effect, but rather granting a single person veto right over the privacy preference of the others. Just create the Signal gro

by jalk 6y ago

That doesn't sound like the network effect, but rather granting a single person veto right over the privacy preference of the others. Just create the Signal group between the 4 of you and the network effect will ensure that democracy prevails

teekert 6y ago
Well I could do so, but as said the majority won't really see the benefits of pushing so hard. They're willing to switch but not willing to advocate.
- MrDresden 6y ago
  Long before this recent flurry around Whatsapp (and Facebook in general) I duplicated one of my primary Whatsapp groups on Signal after getting most there to at least created an account. Slowly, by only replying in that group and sending my messages there, I was able to move more of them over and finally the other group died which lead to the last individuals to come over to Signal. It takes time, but can be done.
  - m000 6y ago
    Whether it's doable depends on the time you can wait, and ultimately your objective. Is it enough to stop using WhatsApp within one year? Or should we be striving to migrate and delete our accounts before the policy change takes effect, to also prevent our historical WhatsApp data to be linked to our FB account? I don't have a clear answer myself. Anyone more informed, please elaborate.
- victords 6y ago
  So, in other words is not one person who is pushing to remain on Whatsapp, but instead only one person pushing to leave.
  - black_puppydog 6y ago
    I read that as "only one person who is pushing to remain on Whatsapp, and only one person pushing to leave."
- piyush_soni 6y ago
  I have seen the same problem. I got 6 to 7 of my groups migrated (completely or partially), but some outspoken people who don't care (and arguably don't know better) prevent the 'upgrade' for everyone.
reader_mode 6y ago
Signal is privacy focused at the cost of functionality and IMO the UI looks like programmer art - you might like the tradeoffs but I suspect most people won't.
- benhurmarcel 6y ago
  > the UI looks like programmer art The UI looks like iMessage. So it doesn't seem it should be any issue there.
  - brainerazer 6y ago
    iMessage has shitty UI though. Always strange being reminded it is used extensively in US, but then I remember people in US still send non-robot-made SMS (even robot-made are shifting here to messaging platforms though)
    - georgyo 6y ago
      I don't really understand... Does WhatsApp have a better UI? Why? To me signal is the best UI, and WhatsApp looks like a child designed it. Especially with the horrid default colors and backgrounds. But I don't really see a difference in UIs in most chat programs. There are only two types of UIs. Point-to-point (signal, WhatsApp, imessage, etc) and room based (irc, matrix, slack). Their all so similar, I don't understand what is better or worse in Signal compared to WhatsApp.
  - reader_mode 6y ago
    How many people would use iMessage if it wasn't bundled with the phone ?
    - pmiller2 6y ago
      What's wrong with iMessage?
      - reader_mode 6y ago
faichai 6y ago
Taleb's thoughts on this kind of effect are quite interesting [1]. There's a kind "Tyranny of the Minority" where the group goes with the minority decision on something like this simply because the majority doesn't care _enough_. [1] https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dictatorship-of-the-small-minority-3f1f83ce4e15 https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dict...
- jpdus 6y ago
  But that doesn't fit with this example, the minority here is definitely ppl who switch to signal or want to use Signal as their main communication app. Talebs arguments are more fitting in instances in which the cost of providing a different solution for a minority is too high and the cost (for some central provider) of just complying with minority demands for everyone is lower. Doesn't apply here at all.
  - faichai 6y ago
    I was referring to the friend who refused to leave WhatsApp not the broader global effect of migrating to Signal. For small group sizes the minority group’s preference will vary.

by jalk 6y ago

teekert 6y ago

Well I could do so, but as said the majority won't really see the benefits of pushing so hard. They're willing to switch but not willing to advocate.

MrDresden 6y ago
Long before this recent flurry around Whatsapp (and Facebook in general) I duplicated one of my primary Whatsapp groups on Signal after getting most there to at least created an account. Slowly, by only replying in that group and sending my messages there, I was able to move more of them over and finally the other group died which lead to the last individuals to come over to Signal. It takes time, but can be done.
- m000 6y ago
  Whether it's doable depends on the time you can wait, and ultimately your objective. Is it enough to stop using WhatsApp within one year? Or should we be striving to migrate and delete our accounts before the policy change takes effect, to also prevent our historical WhatsApp data to be linked to our FB account? I don't have a clear answer myself. Anyone more informed, please elaborate.
victords 6y ago
So, in other words is not one person who is pushing to remain on Whatsapp, but instead only one person pushing to leave.
- black_puppydog 6y ago
  I read that as "only one person who is pushing to remain on Whatsapp, and only one person pushing to leave."
piyush_soni 6y ago
I have seen the same problem. I got 6 to 7 of my groups migrated (completely or partially), but some outspoken people who don't care (and arguably don't know better) prevent the 'upgrade' for everyone.

reader_mode 6y ago

Signal is privacy focused at the cost of functionality and IMO the UI looks like programmer art - you might like the tradeoffs but I suspect most people won't.

benhurmarcel 6y ago
> the UI looks like programmer art The UI looks like iMessage. So it doesn't seem it should be any issue there.
- brainerazer 6y ago
  iMessage has shitty UI though. Always strange being reminded it is used extensively in US, but then I remember people in US still send non-robot-made SMS (even robot-made are shifting here to messaging platforms though)
  - georgyo 6y ago
    I don't really understand... Does WhatsApp have a better UI? Why? To me signal is the best UI, and WhatsApp looks like a child designed it. Especially with the horrid default colors and backgrounds. But I don't really see a difference in UIs in most chat programs. There are only two types of UIs. Point-to-point (signal, WhatsApp, imessage, etc) and room based (irc, matrix, slack). Their all so similar, I don't understand what is better or worse in Signal compared to WhatsApp.
- reader_mode 6y ago
  How many people would use iMessage if it wasn't bundled with the phone ?
  - pmiller2 6y ago
    What's wrong with iMessage?
    - reader_mode 6y ago

faichai 6y ago

Taleb's thoughts on this kind of effect are quite interesting [1]. There's a kind "Tyranny of the Minority" where the group goes with the minority decision on something like this simply because the majority doesn't care _enough_. [1] https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dictatorship-of-the-small-minority-3f1f83ce4e15 https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dict...

jpdus 6y ago
But that doesn't fit with this example, the minority here is definitely ppl who switch to signal or want to use Signal as their main communication app. Talebs arguments are more fitting in instances in which the cost of providing a different solution for a minority is too high and the cost (for some central provider) of just complying with minority demands for everyone is lower. Doesn't apply here at all.
- faichai 6y ago
  I was referring to the friend who refused to leave WhatsApp not the broader global effect of migrating to Signal. For small group sizes the minority group’s preference will vary.