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I find the idea of Facebook being "necessary" for anyone quite spectacularly laughable. This isn't, air or water. You can live without it, and many people happi

I find the idea of Facebook being "necessary" for anyone quite spectacularly laughable. This isn't, air or water. You can live without it, and many people happily do. Facebook is about as essential as essential oils.

coryrc 6y ago
Phones, like food and water, are considered "essential" by the US government and provided for free to citizens who can't afford them. The definition of "essential" grows every year. AFAICT you need a FB account to apply for a job at FB and to look up some business' address.
- root_axis 6y ago
  FB is not a phone, it's a website that you don't have to visit.
  - wizzwizz4 6y ago
    A website containing the only copy in the world of a lot of information that Facebook has no real right to monopolise.
    - drcongo 6y ago
      None of that information is "necessary" though otherwise I would be dead. Painting Facebook as some kind of loft extension built on top of Maslow's hierarchy of needs is disingenuous at best and propaganda at worst. I've lived happily without Facebook for many years, not using it has had zero impact on my life. Not zero _meaningful_ impact, but _zero_ impact. Facebook is NOT a necessity.
    - root_axis 6y ago
      You're conflating monopoly with popularity. Take it up with the individuals that willingly put their information in there, nobody is forcing them to do that.
CogitoCogito 6y ago
Facebook is used as an identity provider. Are users allowed to continue that service when their accounts are disabled?
- drcongo 6y ago
  They can use other identity providers.
  - wizzwizz4 6y ago
    Hey, can you move this account over to this identity provider, please? No, I can't prove I own the account, but… Hello? Hello?
    - Avamander 6y ago
      Yes, it's a footgun. Don't even start using FB as an identity provider.
      - wizzwizz4 6y ago
        What do you propose instead? And before you answer, consider that many systems only let you sign in with Facebook or Google.
        fastball 6y ago
        Well I think Google is a better choice than FB, but I can't think of any services I use where one or both of those are the only options and email signup isn't. The only one that comes to mind (and that annoyed me the other day) is ProductHunt, which has 4 options for signup, but not email.
        caskstrength 6y ago
        Can you name some of them? All apps/services I've used always had some way of register account with email. Granted, this option is sometimes "de-prioritized" (displayed less prominently).
chrissnell 6y ago
That's a short-sighted statement. On a personal level, I completely agree with you. Facebook is a giant waste of time for the typical user and a big +1 for your life if you ditch it. For many business, however, it's critical. My local Snap-on Tools dealer uses it to announce where his truck will be each day and what tools and equipment he's running on special. He hates Facebook but told me the other day that he conducted almost a million dollars in business using the platform in 2020. Sure, he could kill it or switch to MeWe, but that would significantly hurt his exposure to his customers, who use it regularly.
- drcongo 6y ago
  I run a business and don’t use Facebook. It’s not necessary.
  - inglor_cz 6y ago
    I deleted my Facebook in July 2019 and my business still runs. So, for me, it was neither water nor air. I am not so sure about candidates for public offices, though. Especially in majority voting systems. Not having a social network presence may be crippling for their electability.
  - benhurmarcel 6y ago
    It depends on your location and market.
- fastball 6y ago
  A lot of businesses in the developing world just use messaging apps for effectively the same purpose. You don't need FB.
  - benhurmarcel 6y ago
    And the messaging app they often use belongs to FB.
    - 6y ago
capableweb 6y ago
It's not black and white. For some, Facebook is indeed a necessity and for others, not. If you're a private individual, you're probably on the lower side of "I need Facebook" but if you're a business today, it's hard to compete with others who do have a good social media presence on Facebook and Instagram (depends on the business) if you get banned and cannot use either.
syntheticnature 6y ago
The number of organizations that have given up other means of organizing for FB groups is, well, far too many. With Yahoo Groups gone and Google Groups having the Sword of Damocles hanging over it (not to mention the issues average folks have with using email discussion lists and their effective deprecation by anti-spam measures), FB groups looks like an easy option to people, and suddenly to participate in an activity you need a FB account, or a very communicative friend with one.
theknocker 6y ago
Necessary in the sense mail is necessary, obviously, genius.
rektide 6y ago
> I find the idea of Facebook being "necessary" for anyone quite spectacularly laughable. Facebook may not be necessary, but there is a very high probability it is the only social medium that the majority of your acquaintances & relatives use. Being forcibly disconnected from humanity is extremely isolating & harsh.
- airstrike 6y ago
  You're not disconnected from humanity. You can still call people, text them, message them on Whatsapp, meet them in person (maybe not as easily these days) It's not like leaving Facebook turns you into a hermit. If it does, then maybe it's time to find a new group of friends.
  - rektide 6y ago
    These people are attempting to actively share their status, are broadcasting their lives. But the medium has cut you the receiver off. This is an obvious & horrific & disconmect. Even if I did have contact info for a thousand people & kept a schedule, maintained contact on a 1:1 basis, took the time to inform myself of people's lives, isn't it a bit rude & disrespectful, an ineffective use of other people's time, to make them recount toe personally what's going on, what's happened to them? Literally call them up & ask them to repeat the events of their social media deed for the past month? Oh and read me peoplecs tries too. Who "loved" that status update? Can you send those pictures? The asks, the wastes of time, to get anything resbling the faintest hint of parity, are practically endless. This is just blindingly blaringly obviously unacceptable in every way. Facebook's monopoly on mainstream people-you-know social media has ipso facto come to be humanities warm glow, the fire we gather by. Getting dropped out of the exchanges & chatter of humanity is a cruel & bitter fate, a shocking act.
    - drcongo 6y ago
      The melodrama in this comment reads like Stockholm syndrome. Honestly mate, it’s not that bad. Give it a go, try not using it for a week. Humans managed for thousands of years without knowing what great Aunt Flo thinks of immigrants or 5G every waking second. You don’t need your life validated by someone liking your posts, there’s real life ways of finding actual meaning in your actions.
aerosmile 6y ago
I applaud you on a moral level, but I hope you realize how wrong you are on a practical level. Being connected to the pulse of the world comes with very powerful pros (meeting a partner, finding a job) and cons (disinformation, social pressures). Comparing it to essential oils is wrong. Also, the Facebook story isn't finished yet. Is it really that far-fetched to believe that their influence over our lives could 10x over the next 50 years? I hope it won't, but I wouldn't be willing to put my money on it. So keeping in mind that the context of this thread is about getting permanently banned on Facebook, for anyone who thinks that might have zero impact on them, I would suggest you still keep a foot in the door in case you change your mind down the road.
tiagod 6y ago
At least in my country/city, you MUST publish your events on Facebook to get an audience. Even I keep a Facebook account just because it's the only place that has every single event happening in my city. Before COVID I would always open Facebook's event calendar before a night out to check out what concerts/parties are happening that night.
AdmiralGinge 6y ago
To be fair nothing is really "necessary" beyond a 8' x 6' cell, potable water, and a crate full of Huel or something but no sane person outside of those who actively seek an ascetic lifestyle would actually want to live like that. Just because something isn't strictly necessary doesn't mean that life can't become difficult without it. The sad fact of the matter is that by cutting off Facebook you're also cutting off the primary way of staying in touch with some people along with things like events and so on. Yes there are workarounds, of course there is but the vast majority of people don't care and can't be convinced to care about the politics and social effects of Facebook's dominant position.
csomar 6y ago
Facebook has complete monopoly for online sales where I live (no ecommerce platform is well developed), and thus getting cut from Facebook will probably mean you are no longer in the business. Also as a buyer, I have to use my mother or friend Facebook account to find items or contact sellers.
type0 6y ago
In certain areas it actually is essential for small businesses (or so they think). Consider that such small shop owners would say they're even saving money by not having their own webpage because it's expensive compared to FB page.
pcthrowaway 6y ago
I can give my personal example of how facebook is literally a life-saver for me, and I'm sure there are many others. I'm strongly passionate about rock climbing, and try to structure my life around it as my primary form of recreation. If I'm traveling for leisure, climbing is a big part of the agenda. There are many communities for finding people to climb with on Facebook, and I've used them extensively. Without facebook, I'd more often have to resort to self-belaying, which is much more dangerous (among other reasons, if you're knocked unconscious there's no one to start a rescue or call for help). Having access to the various regional climbing groups on facebook has put me in touch with so many people, so I have only had to do that on a handful of occasions. There are other examples I can think of, even if none of them have been so drastic. But without access to Facebook, many people would have their lives seriously impacted, and possible lack of access to life-saving resources.

coryrc 6y ago

Phones, like food and water, are considered "essential" by the US government and provided for free to citizens who can't afford them. The definition of "essential" grows every year. AFAICT you need a FB account to apply for a job at FB and to look up some business' address.

root_axis 6y ago
FB is not a phone, it's a website that you don't have to visit.
- wizzwizz4 6y ago
  A website containing the only copy in the world of a lot of information that Facebook has no real right to monopolise.
  - drcongo 6y ago
    None of that information is "necessary" though otherwise I would be dead. Painting Facebook as some kind of loft extension built on top of Maslow's hierarchy of needs is disingenuous at best and propaganda at worst. I've lived happily without Facebook for many years, not using it has had zero impact on my life. Not zero _meaningful_ impact, but _zero_ impact. Facebook is NOT a necessity.
  - root_axis 6y ago
    You're conflating monopoly with popularity. Take it up with the individuals that willingly put their information in there, nobody is forcing them to do that.

CogitoCogito 6y ago

Facebook is used as an identity provider. Are users allowed to continue that service when their accounts are disabled?

drcongo 6y ago
They can use other identity providers.
- wizzwizz4 6y ago
  Hey, can you move this account over to this identity provider, please? No, I can't prove I own the account, but… Hello? Hello?
  - Avamander 6y ago
    Yes, it's a footgun. Don't even start using FB as an identity provider.
    - wizzwizz4 6y ago
      What do you propose instead? And before you answer, consider that many systems only let you sign in with Facebook or Google.
      - fastball 6y ago
        Well I think Google is a better choice than FB, but I can't think of any services I use where one or both of those are the only options and email signup isn't. The only one that comes to mind (and that annoyed me the other day) is ProductHunt, which has 4 options for signup, but not email.
      - caskstrength 6y ago
        Can you name some of them? All apps/services I've used always had some way of register account with email. Granted, this option is sometimes "de-prioritized" (displayed less prominently).

chrissnell 6y ago

That's a short-sighted statement. On a personal level, I completely agree with you. Facebook is a giant waste of time for the typical user and a big +1 for your life if you ditch it. For many business, however, it's critical. My local Snap-on Tools dealer uses it to announce where his truck will be each day and what tools and equipment he's running on special. He hates Facebook but told me the other day that he conducted almost a million dollars in business using the platform in 2020. Sure, he could kill it or switch to MeWe, but that would significantly hurt his exposure to his customers, who use it regularly.

drcongo 6y ago
I run a business and don’t use Facebook. It’s not necessary.
- inglor_cz 6y ago
  I deleted my Facebook in July 2019 and my business still runs. So, for me, it was neither water nor air. I am not so sure about candidates for public offices, though. Especially in majority voting systems. Not having a social network presence may be crippling for their electability.
- benhurmarcel 6y ago
  It depends on your location and market.
fastball 6y ago
A lot of businesses in the developing world just use messaging apps for effectively the same purpose. You don't need FB.
- benhurmarcel 6y ago
  And the messaging app they often use belongs to FB.
  - 6y ago

capableweb 6y ago

It's not black and white. For some, Facebook is indeed a necessity and for others, not. If you're a private individual, you're probably on the lower side of "I need Facebook" but if you're a business today, it's hard to compete with others who do have a good social media presence on Facebook and Instagram (depends on the business) if you get banned and cannot use either.

syntheticnature 6y ago

The number of organizations that have given up other means of organizing for FB groups is, well, far too many. With Yahoo Groups gone and Google Groups having the Sword of Damocles hanging over it (not to mention the issues average folks have with using email discussion lists and their effective deprecation by anti-spam measures), FB groups looks like an easy option to people, and suddenly to participate in an activity you need a FB account, or a very communicative friend with one.

theknocker 6y ago

Necessary in the sense mail is necessary, obviously, genius.

rektide 6y ago

> I find the idea of Facebook being "necessary" for anyone quite spectacularly laughable. Facebook may not be necessary, but there is a very high probability it is the only social medium that the majority of your acquaintances & relatives use. Being forcibly disconnected from humanity is extremely isolating & harsh.

airstrike 6y ago
You're not disconnected from humanity. You can still call people, text them, message them on Whatsapp, meet them in person (maybe not as easily these days) It's not like leaving Facebook turns you into a hermit. If it does, then maybe it's time to find a new group of friends.
- rektide 6y ago
  These people are attempting to actively share their status, are broadcasting their lives. But the medium has cut you the receiver off. This is an obvious & horrific & disconmect. Even if I did have contact info for a thousand people & kept a schedule, maintained contact on a 1:1 basis, took the time to inform myself of people's lives, isn't it a bit rude & disrespectful, an ineffective use of other people's time, to make them recount toe personally what's going on, what's happened to them? Literally call them up & ask them to repeat the events of their social media deed for the past month? Oh and read me peoplecs tries too. Who "loved" that status update? Can you send those pictures? The asks, the wastes of time, to get anything resbling the faintest hint of parity, are practically endless. This is just blindingly blaringly obviously unacceptable in every way. Facebook's monopoly on mainstream people-you-know social media has ipso facto come to be humanities warm glow, the fire we gather by. Getting dropped out of the exchanges & chatter of humanity is a cruel & bitter fate, a shocking act.
  - drcongo 6y ago
    The melodrama in this comment reads like Stockholm syndrome. Honestly mate, it’s not that bad. Give it a go, try not using it for a week. Humans managed for thousands of years without knowing what great Aunt Flo thinks of immigrants or 5G every waking second. You don’t need your life validated by someone liking your posts, there’s real life ways of finding actual meaning in your actions.

aerosmile 6y ago

I applaud you on a moral level, but I hope you realize how wrong you are on a practical level. Being connected to the pulse of the world comes with very powerful pros (meeting a partner, finding a job) and cons (disinformation, social pressures). Comparing it to essential oils is wrong. Also, the Facebook story isn't finished yet. Is it really that far-fetched to believe that their influence over our lives could 10x over the next 50 years? I hope it won't, but I wouldn't be willing to put my money on it. So keeping in mind that the context of this thread is about getting permanently banned on Facebook, for anyone who thinks that might have zero impact on them, I would suggest you still keep a foot in the door in case you change your mind down the road.

tiagod 6y ago

At least in my country/city, you MUST publish your events on Facebook to get an audience. Even I keep a Facebook account just because it's the only place that has every single event happening in my city. Before COVID I would always open Facebook's event calendar before a night out to check out what concerts/parties are happening that night.

AdmiralGinge 6y ago

To be fair nothing is really "necessary" beyond a 8' x 6' cell, potable water, and a crate full of Huel or something but no sane person outside of those who actively seek an ascetic lifestyle would actually want to live like that. Just because something isn't strictly necessary doesn't mean that life can't become difficult without it. The sad fact of the matter is that by cutting off Facebook you're also cutting off the primary way of staying in touch with some people along with things like events and so on. Yes there are workarounds, of course there is but the vast majority of people don't care and can't be convinced to care about the politics and social effects of Facebook's dominant position.

csomar 6y ago

Facebook has complete monopoly for online sales where I live (no ecommerce platform is well developed), and thus getting cut from Facebook will probably mean you are no longer in the business. Also as a buyer, I have to use my mother or friend Facebook account to find items or contact sellers.

type0 6y ago

In certain areas it actually is essential for small businesses (or so they think). Consider that such small shop owners would say they're even saving money by not having their own webpage because it's expensive compared to FB page.

pcthrowaway 6y ago

I can give my personal example of how facebook is literally a life-saver for me, and I'm sure there are many others. I'm strongly passionate about rock climbing, and try to structure my life around it as my primary form of recreation. If I'm traveling for leisure, climbing is a big part of the agenda. There are many communities for finding people to climb with on Facebook, and I've used them extensively. Without facebook, I'd more often have to resort to self-belaying, which is much more dangerous (among other reasons, if you're knocked unconscious there's no one to start a rescue or call for help). Having access to the various regional climbing groups on facebook has put me in touch with so many people, so I have only had to do that on a handful of occasions. There are other examples I can think of, even if none of them have been so drastic. But without access to Facebook, many people would have their lives seriously impacted, and possible lack of access to life-saving resources.