7 ms·

Shoot, the $45 an hour mentioned up this chain would be life changing for me (yes, I live in the U.S.), after 15 years at my job I make 17.26 an hour. It's why

Shoot, the $45 an hour mentioned up this chain would be life changing for me (yes, I live in the U.S.), after 15 years at my job I make 17.26 an hour. It's why this talk of $15 minimum wage mildly terrifies me, I know people need it but man, it suddenly thrusts me nearly to minimum wage (minimum wage is currently 7.25 here).

imtringued 6y ago
The problem with minimum wages is that they don't do anything. There is a mild psychological effect that forces people below minimum wage to find a new job. However, if the economy doesn't have enough jobs above minimum wage, then it does nothing. If the government offered jobs at the minimum wage there would be an effective price floor for wages. Better yet, if those government workers spend their income they can drive economic demand which ends up creating jobs above minimum wage. Eventually every job pays more than minimum wage and nobody is dependent on the jobs guarantee.
- heyoni 6y ago
  And if there are enough jobs, then it does something, and does it well. It forces companies to spend a bit more on their employees and in some ways, redistributes wealth. Your solution isn’t better. The government cannot be everywhere the way that Walmart is. I really don’t think its impact is going to be that big. Low skilled labor will still find ways to get hired for less, off the books if the need is great enough...it happens all the time.
  - 8note 6y ago
    The government is already in more places than Walmart is though? The government already offers jobs like that too, just that it's through the prison system and the floor is much too low
    - heyoni 6y ago
      Look, as much as I hate Walmart, they exist in places at levels that the federal/state does not. Either way, that's not the only thing my argument stands on. I'm as liberal as they come, and would never suggest expanding the government just to fit that capacity.
rswail 6y ago
You should see an increase in your wage when the minimum goes to $15. A rising tide lifts all boats. Inflation is virtually zero, so rising wages are a good thing for the vast majority of wage and salary earning employees.
- protomyth 6y ago
  I would love to see you prove that with actual labor statistics. Employers do not do that, plus now you need to deal with higher prices.
- ryanmercer 6y ago
  My annual merit based increases are often at or just below inflation levels and the cost increase of insurance, I wouldn't hold my breath on my employer upping my pay a comparable amount - shareholders aren't fond of shrinking profits. I think the largest pay bump I've ever seen in a year was right at 2% or possibly even less.
- riffraff 6y ago
  I am not sure it's given that inflation will stay at zero with rising minimum wages. I think GP is worried this may not be the case, and he would lose purchasing power. Nothing may happen, but I think we'll have to wait and see if this is the case or not.
- acomms 6y ago
  Why would inflation stay at 0? That is extremely unlikely.
angus_gh 6y ago
You can feel secure knowing if you lost your job, any other job you find would at worst pay $2.26 less than you're receiving now, so you wouldn't suffer an awful drop in living standards (and you'd hope it would also pressure your employer to give you a raise..)
VincentEvans 6y ago
It “suddenly thrusts” you absolutely nowhere. You still earn exactly as much as you do now, but it is interesting to observe the psychological effect of being surrounded by people who are more miserable than oneself.
- ryanmercer 6y ago
  >You still earn exactly as much as you do now, And one would assume you'd see rents and housing prices very rapidly start going up, then presumably other prices over varying levels of time.
  - VincentEvans 6y ago
    Perhaps. But why wouldn’t the same apply to salaries then? What would happen if we were to set the minimal wage at 100K so that we eliminate the poverty in one swift move and everyone is either equally rich, or as you are worried - equally poor :)
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
luma 6y ago
Having people only make slightly less than you terrifies you? Why does knowing someone else might be getting a tiny raise terrify you?

imtringued 6y ago

The problem with minimum wages is that they don't do anything. There is a mild psychological effect that forces people below minimum wage to find a new job. However, if the economy doesn't have enough jobs above minimum wage, then it does nothing. If the government offered jobs at the minimum wage there would be an effective price floor for wages. Better yet, if those government workers spend their income they can drive economic demand which ends up creating jobs above minimum wage. Eventually every job pays more than minimum wage and nobody is dependent on the jobs guarantee.

heyoni 6y ago
And if there are enough jobs, then it does something, and does it well. It forces companies to spend a bit more on their employees and in some ways, redistributes wealth. Your solution isn’t better. The government cannot be everywhere the way that Walmart is. I really don’t think its impact is going to be that big. Low skilled labor will still find ways to get hired for less, off the books if the need is great enough...it happens all the time.
- 8note 6y ago
  The government is already in more places than Walmart is though? The government already offers jobs like that too, just that it's through the prison system and the floor is much too low
  - heyoni 6y ago
    Look, as much as I hate Walmart, they exist in places at levels that the federal/state does not. Either way, that's not the only thing my argument stands on. I'm as liberal as they come, and would never suggest expanding the government just to fit that capacity.

rswail 6y ago

You should see an increase in your wage when the minimum goes to $15. A rising tide lifts all boats. Inflation is virtually zero, so rising wages are a good thing for the vast majority of wage and salary earning employees.

protomyth 6y ago
I would love to see you prove that with actual labor statistics. Employers do not do that, plus now you need to deal with higher prices.
ryanmercer 6y ago
My annual merit based increases are often at or just below inflation levels and the cost increase of insurance, I wouldn't hold my breath on my employer upping my pay a comparable amount - shareholders aren't fond of shrinking profits. I think the largest pay bump I've ever seen in a year was right at 2% or possibly even less.
riffraff 6y ago
I am not sure it's given that inflation will stay at zero with rising minimum wages. I think GP is worried this may not be the case, and he would lose purchasing power. Nothing may happen, but I think we'll have to wait and see if this is the case or not.
acomms 6y ago
Why would inflation stay at 0? That is extremely unlikely.

angus_gh 6y ago

You can feel secure knowing if you lost your job, any other job you find would at worst pay $2.26 less than you're receiving now, so you wouldn't suffer an awful drop in living standards (and you'd hope it would also pressure your employer to give you a raise..)

VincentEvans 6y ago

It “suddenly thrusts” you absolutely nowhere. You still earn exactly as much as you do now, but it is interesting to observe the psychological effect of being surrounded by people who are more miserable than oneself.

ryanmercer 6y ago
>You still earn exactly as much as you do now, And one would assume you'd see rents and housing prices very rapidly start going up, then presumably other prices over varying levels of time.
- VincentEvans 6y ago
  Perhaps. But why wouldn’t the same apply to salaries then? What would happen if we were to set the minimal wage at 100K so that we eliminate the poverty in one swift move and everyone is either equally rich, or as you are worried - equally poor :)
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

luma 6y ago

Having people only make slightly less than you terrifies you? Why does knowing someone else might be getting a tiny raise terrify you?