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I'm asking nicely, can we please not do this? Let's not exacerbate the problems of bad communication by using more sarcasm and hyperbole. If there is some parti

I'm asking nicely, can we please not do this? Let's not exacerbate the problems of bad communication by using more sarcasm and hyperbole. If there is some particular thing that can be done to improve areas where there are perceived design proclivities, can we focus on that instead?

Blikkentrekker 6y ago
But it's not constructive criticism, but humor. I agree that sarcasm provides for poor constructive criticism to get a point across, but the intent was mockery, not being helpful. I certainly do not believe that GNOME would take the advice of an H.N. post, and they are well aware of these criticisms to begin with, as they are commonly levied against them.
- cycloptic 6y ago
  I don't mean criticism, we (HN users) all have heard all the criticism a hundred times before. I mean actual actionable feedback that someone is able to work with, e.g. if there are problems with the design then we can bring some concrete data that shows new, reliable information. That means taking honest efforts to establish two-way communication where there is none.
  - Blikkentrekker 6y ago
    > I mean actual actionable feedback that someone is able to work with Is this not what “constructive criticism”, as I called it, is? GNOME is not going to listen to an H.N. comment an change it's ways, and it was never my intent to reach them or otherwise inspire change in them. My intent was simply to be humorous.
    - cycloptic 6y ago
      Please don't discount yourself like that, by resigning to the usual HN snark. I think you're smart and capable of much more. If there is new, important and relevant information brought to them, they will listen to that. (This applies to most big projects I've seen, not any one in particular. The smaller niche ones that commit to having their small narrow audience are the ones I've seen that tend to be resistant to new ideas)
      - Blikkentrekker 6y ago
        I doubt they scan H.N. comments for input or come across them. If I had wanted to reach them, I would certainly do wiser to simply send them a feature requæst bug report.
        inetknght 6y ago
        Many developers and executives do participate in social media including Hacker News. I have seen plenty of tech-related fixes and features that come directly from Hacker News comments. In all I think the best feedback I can give you would have been to include a `/s` to indicate sarcasm and jest.
        Dylan16807 6y ago
        > Many developers and executives do participate in social media including Hacker News. I have seen plenty of tech-related fixes and features that come directly from Hacker News comments. But the comment wasn't bringing up anything new about GNOME. There is no information someone from GNOME could get from that post, no matter how it was worded. It is not a constructive vs. snark situation. > In all I think the best feedback I can give you would have been to include a `/s` to indicate sarcasm and jest. It seems like the same argument would have happened anyway, so eh.
        cycloptic 6y ago
        To be clear, my request is to avoid rehashing old arguments that have gone nowhere, and stick to providing new information when we can.
        cycloptic 6y ago
        I am sorry if I'm being pushy, it just gets extremely tiring to see all the same type of comments for years on places like here and on /r/linux. You don't have to listen to me if you don't want, it's just my humble plea.
        6y ago

Blikkentrekker 6y ago

But it's not constructive criticism, but humor. I agree that sarcasm provides for poor constructive criticism to get a point across, but the intent was mockery, not being helpful. I certainly do not believe that GNOME would take the advice of an H.N. post, and they are well aware of these criticisms to begin with, as they are commonly levied against them.

cycloptic 6y ago
I don't mean criticism, we (HN users) all have heard all the criticism a hundred times before. I mean actual actionable feedback that someone is able to work with, e.g. if there are problems with the design then we can bring some concrete data that shows new, reliable information. That means taking honest efforts to establish two-way communication where there is none.
- Blikkentrekker 6y ago
  > I mean actual actionable feedback that someone is able to work with Is this not what “constructive criticism”, as I called it, is? GNOME is not going to listen to an H.N. comment an change it's ways, and it was never my intent to reach them or otherwise inspire change in them. My intent was simply to be humorous.
  - cycloptic 6y ago
    Please don't discount yourself like that, by resigning to the usual HN snark. I think you're smart and capable of much more. If there is new, important and relevant information brought to them, they will listen to that. (This applies to most big projects I've seen, not any one in particular. The smaller niche ones that commit to having their small narrow audience are the ones I've seen that tend to be resistant to new ideas)
    - Blikkentrekker 6y ago
      I doubt they scan H.N. comments for input or come across them. If I had wanted to reach them, I would certainly do wiser to simply send them a feature requæst bug report.
      - inetknght 6y ago
        Many developers and executives do participate in social media including Hacker News. I have seen plenty of tech-related fixes and features that come directly from Hacker News comments. In all I think the best feedback I can give you would have been to include a `/s` to indicate sarcasm and jest.
        Dylan16807 6y ago
        > Many developers and executives do participate in social media including Hacker News. I have seen plenty of tech-related fixes and features that come directly from Hacker News comments. But the comment wasn't bringing up anything new about GNOME. There is no information someone from GNOME could get from that post, no matter how it was worded. It is not a constructive vs. snark situation. > In all I think the best feedback I can give you would have been to include a `/s` to indicate sarcasm and jest. It seems like the same argument would have happened anyway, so eh.
        cycloptic 6y ago
        To be clear, my request is to avoid rehashing old arguments that have gone nowhere, and stick to providing new information when we can.
      - cycloptic 6y ago
        I am sorry if I'm being pushy, it just gets extremely tiring to see all the same type of comments for years on places like here and on /r/linux. You don't have to listen to me if you don't want, it's just my humble plea.
        6y ago