7 ms·

Which criticisms? I've just started using it after Firefox's blog post

miles 6y ago
Perhaps this? The Brave web browser is hijacking links, and inserting affiliate codes https://davidgerard.co.uk/blockchain/2020/06/06/the-brave-web-browser-is-hijacking-links-and-inserting-affiliate-codes/ https://davidgerard.co.uk/blockchain/2020/06/06/the-brave-we... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23442027 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23442027
- justsee 6y ago
  Brendan Eich mentioned it was a default completion bug they got no revenue from, which was fixed: https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/1270128401760743424 https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/1270128401760743424
- jonathansampson 6y ago
  Please see https://brave.com/referral-codes-in-suggested-sites/ https://brave.com/referral-codes-in-suggested-sites/ regarding this claim. It's important to note that Brave never hijacked links, modified pages, our injected codes into content. The browser offered a pre-search list of suggestions for a small set of keywords (see blog post for screenshots). Happy to answer any questions you may have beyond the contents of that blog post. Nothing malicious here; no data or privacy impact either. We were able to fix the behavior within 48 hours (IIRC), and burned the associated affiliate code.
  - Shared404 6y ago
    > “Show Brave suggested sites in autocomplete suggestions” setting’s default to “off” This may be the change I needed to know about to try Brave at some point. Are there any plans to get into any Linux distro's repositories? Brave wasn't in Ubuntu's last time I checked, although that was a little while ago. E: Formatting doesn't like asterisks.
    - pbhjpbhj 6y ago
      I just added it to an Ubuntu (actually Kubuntu), very easy instructions, and familiarly default too - https://brave.com/linux/ https://brave.com/linux/. One slight gotcha, if you view the link from Tor it offers an .onion site for the apt repos string, but I wanted the regular repos as I don't use OS-level Tor but happened to be using tor-browser.
- BrendanEich 6y ago
  The phrase "hijacking links" is, in a word, a lie. Its standard meaning implies that Brave changes the URL loaded when you click on a link (any or many links) in a web page. That never happened, and would be fatally scandalous if tried by any reputable browser. What happened was a bug in a keyword and domain autocomplete tier we added. Reminder for those not aware: all browsers add reference codes identifying the browser make (not the user) to keyword queries when you type words into the address bar. This is industry standard. See https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/1273327455105773568?s=20 https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/1273327455105773568?s.... The bug in Brave was a flag set wrong for two domain names, which are not keywords: binance.us and binance.com. These should not have default-completed when typed into the address bar with a Binance affiliate code, they should have been suggested completions the user would have had to pick by arrow down and <return> or mouse equivalent. We fixed the defaulting bug and turned off the entire suggested completions feature. As noted by someone else in a comment nearby, we instructed Binance not to pay us for any referred new users who traded (Binance does not pay on the referral, they pay only after if the user trades, sharing a fixed proportion of trading fees). So this was not "link hijacking" in any case. I'm sorry for the blunder, and we added a process step around any changes to address bar to audit harder.
gandreani 6y ago
Which blog post?
- jejkfmgmgk 6y ago
  Probably the one by the Mozilla CEO, "We need more than deplatforming"[1] 1: https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2021/01/08/we-need-more-than-deplatforming/ https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2021/01/08/we-need-more-than-d...
  - ampdepolymerase 6y ago
    It is not particularly surprising considering that the founder of Brave was fired as Mozilla's CEO and replaced by the current one specifically because of politics.
    - dave5104 6y ago
      > because of politics. Even more specifically because of his anti-LGBT politics.
      - kdtsh 6y ago
        After a bit of reading, it sounds like he has some very nasty personal views. At least he respected the Mozilla community enough to step down when they came to light. His views do not impart themselves onto Brave of course, but I will stay with Firefox.
    - jamienicol 6y ago
      Brendan Eich wasn't replaced by the current CEO though. Nor was he fired. Nor was it just because of [his] politics. Nor does that article say what you think it does. But whatever, think what you like.
  - arsome 6y ago
    That headline is certainly inflammatory, but I don't think the actual content of the post is nearly as bad - they're not suggesting web browser start flagging/blocking sites or anything similar like it initially made me think. They're simply suggesting further transparency in algorithmic suggestions and research be conducted. You could even argue that they're suggesting that deplatforming simply isn't the ultimate solution.
jjd33 6y ago
Peter Thiel (Palantir) is one of their main investors. that should raise all alarm bellas for a product that advertises itself with "privacy"
- erichocean 6y ago
  Palantir exists to improve privacy of citizen data within the government. Without it, government workers have massive, untraceable and unaccountable access to private data. (See Snowden for more info.) I don't like that there's even a need for Palantir, but given the need, I'm glad it exists and I'm glad someone like Thiel is behind it.
  - lasfter 6y ago
    Instead we give that access to Palantir workers? How is that any better?
  - TameAntelope 6y ago
    I very, very much do not buy this at all. I don't honestly care all that much about Palantir specifically (pros and cons, though lots of cons), but one thing they do not do by simply existing is help citizens protect their data. They do a lot of things, but not that. That's just marketing/PR nonsense.
  - webmaven 6y ago
    > Palantir exists to improve privacy of citizen data within the government. Huh. So the argument to overcome objections to a
    - webmaven 6y ago
      Well, that's annoying. Here is what I meant to post, more or less: Huh. So the argument to overcome objections to a system designed for ingesting, canonicalizing, normalizing, and correlating private data acquired via dubious means from dubious sources is that at least the access to and use of the data is controlled monitored and auditable, reducing the incidence of LOVEINT and similar abuses as compared to ad-hoc systems constructed on the sly? That's really damning with faint praise, especially since Jevon's Paradox ensures that both the use AND abuse of such data will increase when you reduce the 'costs' of doing so, and that's assuming there is no unsanctioned/off-book/'black' use or egress of the data (which is far from assured, IMO, given what we know about the history of these systems and projects, eg. Total Information Awareness and Trailblazer vs. ThinThread).

Perhaps this? The Brave web browser is hijacking links, and inserting affiliate codes https://davidgerard.co.uk/blockchain/2020/06/06/the-brave-web-browser-is-hijacking-links-and-inserting-affiliate-codes/ https://davidgerard.co.uk/blockchain/2020/06/06/the-brave-we... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23442027 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23442027

justsee 6y ago
Brendan Eich mentioned it was a default completion bug they got no revenue from, which was fixed: https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/1270128401760743424 https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/1270128401760743424
jonathansampson 6y ago
Please see https://brave.com/referral-codes-in-suggested-sites/ https://brave.com/referral-codes-in-suggested-sites/ regarding this claim. It's important to note that Brave never hijacked links, modified pages, our injected codes into content. The browser offered a pre-search list of suggestions for a small set of keywords (see blog post for screenshots). Happy to answer any questions you may have beyond the contents of that blog post. Nothing malicious here; no data or privacy impact either. We were able to fix the behavior within 48 hours (IIRC), and burned the associated affiliate code.
- Shared404 6y ago
  > “Show Brave suggested sites in autocomplete suggestions” setting’s default to “off” This may be the change I needed to know about to try Brave at some point. Are there any plans to get into any Linux distro's repositories? Brave wasn't in Ubuntu's last time I checked, although that was a little while ago. E: Formatting doesn't like asterisks.
  - pbhjpbhj 6y ago
    I just added it to an Ubuntu (actually Kubuntu), very easy instructions, and familiarly default too - https://brave.com/linux/ https://brave.com/linux/. One slight gotcha, if you view the link from Tor it offers an .onion site for the apt repos string, but I wanted the regular repos as I don't use OS-level Tor but happened to be using tor-browser.
BrendanEich 6y ago
The phrase "hijacking links" is, in a word, a lie. Its standard meaning implies that Brave changes the URL loaded when you click on a link (any or many links) in a web page. That never happened, and would be fatally scandalous if tried by any reputable browser. What happened was a bug in a keyword and domain autocomplete tier we added. Reminder for those not aware: all browsers add reference codes identifying the browser make (not the user) to keyword queries when you type words into the address bar. This is industry standard. See https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/1273327455105773568?s=20 https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/1273327455105773568?s.... The bug in Brave was a flag set wrong for two domain names, which are not keywords: binance.us and binance.com. These should not have default-completed when typed into the address bar with a Binance affiliate code, they should have been suggested completions the user would have had to pick by arrow down and <return> or mouse equivalent. We fixed the defaulting bug and turned off the entire suggested completions feature. As noted by someone else in a comment nearby, we instructed Binance not to pay us for any referred new users who traded (Binance does not pay on the referral, they pay only after if the user trades, sharing a fixed proportion of trading fees). So this was not "link hijacking" in any case. I'm sorry for the blunder, and we added a process step around any changes to address bar to audit harder.

gandreani 6y ago

Which blog post?

jejkfmgmgk 6y ago
Probably the one by the Mozilla CEO, "We need more than deplatforming"[1] 1: https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2021/01/08/we-need-more-than-deplatforming/ https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2021/01/08/we-need-more-than-d...
- ampdepolymerase 6y ago
  It is not particularly surprising considering that the founder of Brave was fired as Mozilla's CEO and replaced by the current one specifically because of politics.
  - dave5104 6y ago
    > because of politics. Even more specifically because of his anti-LGBT politics.
    - kdtsh 6y ago
      After a bit of reading, it sounds like he has some very nasty personal views. At least he respected the Mozilla community enough to step down when they came to light. His views do not impart themselves onto Brave of course, but I will stay with Firefox.
  - jamienicol 6y ago
    Brendan Eich wasn't replaced by the current CEO though. Nor was he fired. Nor was it just because of [his] politics. Nor does that article say what you think it does. But whatever, think what you like.
- arsome 6y ago
  That headline is certainly inflammatory, but I don't think the actual content of the post is nearly as bad - they're not suggesting web browser start flagging/blocking sites or anything similar like it initially made me think. They're simply suggesting further transparency in algorithmic suggestions and research be conducted. You could even argue that they're suggesting that deplatforming simply isn't the ultimate solution.

jjd33 6y ago

Peter Thiel (Palantir) is one of their main investors. that should raise all alarm bellas for a product that advertises itself with "privacy"

erichocean 6y ago
Palantir exists to improve privacy of citizen data within the government. Without it, government workers have massive, untraceable and unaccountable access to private data. (See Snowden for more info.) I don't like that there's even a need for Palantir, but given the need, I'm glad it exists and I'm glad someone like Thiel is behind it.
- lasfter 6y ago
  Instead we give that access to Palantir workers? How is that any better?
- TameAntelope 6y ago
  I very, very much do not buy this at all. I don't honestly care all that much about Palantir specifically (pros and cons, though lots of cons), but one thing they do not do by simply existing is help citizens protect their data. They do a lot of things, but not that. That's just marketing/PR nonsense.
- webmaven 6y ago
  > Palantir exists to improve privacy of citizen data within the government. Huh. So the argument to overcome objections to a
  - webmaven 6y ago
    Well, that's annoying. Here is what I meant to post, more or less: Huh. So the argument to overcome objections to a system designed for ingesting, canonicalizing, normalizing, and correlating private data acquired via dubious means from dubious sources is that at least the access to and use of the data is controlled monitored and auditable, reducing the incidence of LOVEINT and similar abuses as compared to ad-hoc systems constructed on the sly? That's really damning with faint praise, especially since Jevon's Paradox ensures that both the use AND abuse of such data will increase when you reduce the 'costs' of doing so, and that's assuming there is no unsanctioned/off-book/'black' use or egress of the data (which is far from assured, IMO, given what we know about the history of these systems and projects, eg. Total Information Awareness and Trailblazer vs. ThinThread).