4 ms·

There were more than what I'd call dozens, there's already been over 100 arrests and it's early in the investigation. Also basing this on the videos I've seen.

There were more than what I'd call dozens, there's already been over 100 arrests and it's early in the investigation. Also basing this on the videos I've seen. There were hallways full of people packed behind barriers, streams of people going by different locations, etc. I wouldn't say violence of this sort is representative of Republicans, but Republicans are too accepting of the extremists that this event grew out of. One of them is the leader of their party.

steve_adams_86 6y ago
You're right, it was more than dozens. I think my mental model is something like: - Dozens of severely bad actors - many of which actually did intend abduction or murder. These people are terrifying. - Hundreds of bad actors. People attempting to subvert democracy which, despite sounding alarmist or cheesy without proper context (You need to see the videos to understand, I think) is also very scary. These people will hurt you for their political cause. - Thousands of people convinced that their political system, their democracy, isn't serving them. This is alright with me - I think they were convinced by the bad/severely bad actors, and I believe this happens on all political spectrums. I know many "left leaning" folks with arguably insane ideas about politics and society in general, so this isn't a republican disorder. I don't resent them or even myself for coming to unreasonable conclusions and I believe they're actually trying to improve their situation in the way they know how. Being wrong in and of itself isn't a crime, I suppose. Protesting on bad information is unfortunate, but not criminal. I have sympathy for all of these people. Things seem pretty awful for them right now, whether it should or not. It all seems very self-inflicted. Regardless, it seems a lot of manipulation has been involved. It's very cult-like. Power hungry folks have recruited disenfranchised individuals to serve their agendas. It's really sad. The rest of the republican voters will be a mix of these groups, but I suspect they've come to terms with the election despite disappointment. They don't want to zip tie anyone in congress or illegally overturn the election. The bad actors really should experience consequences. They are a rot that contaminates the people around them. Whether they intend that or not, have good intentions or not, they have become so unreasonable and dangerous that they need to be contained at the least. I believe that includes Donald Trump most of all.
- hajile 6y ago
  The FBI only lists around 30 people wanted on anything more serious than unlawful entry, violent entry, trespassing, or similar. They weren't even charged with rioting because (as these videos show), wandering around gawking at the Capitol building isn't rioting by any reasonable definition. That wandering also doesn't play well with the idea that they intended violence against the legislature. Yes, they should probably be charged with something, but the punishment should fit the crime and I doubt most of those people will have anything super serious happen (even if the Judge is trying to send a message). EDIT: as it seems unclear, these are people WANTED for crimes NOT people actually charged (that number is lower).
  - dragonwriter 6y ago
    > The FBI only lists around 30 people wanted on anything more serious than unlawful entry, violent entry, trespassing, or similar. That number is increasing daily. The easy charges come first, because the evidence needed to make them withstand a probable cause hearing is trivial. > They weren't even charged with rioting because ...For the people (those charged only in D.C. Superior Court) for whom more serious charges weren't already clearly available, the unlawful entry charge is open and shut for arrest and extra charges while investigation continues as to the full set of charges each should face doesn't actually do anything. Also, riot in the D.C. code isn't a more serious offense than unlawful entry on public property. While for those already charged in US District Court for US Code offenses, most of which are felonies, the D.C. Code misdemeanor for rioting is an irrelevancy.

steve_adams_86 6y ago

You're right, it was more than dozens. I think my mental model is something like: - Dozens of severely bad actors - many of which actually did intend abduction or murder. These people are terrifying. - Hundreds of bad actors. People attempting to subvert democracy which, despite sounding alarmist or cheesy without proper context (You need to see the videos to understand, I think) is also very scary. These people will hurt you for their political cause. - Thousands of people convinced that their political system, their democracy, isn't serving them. This is alright with me - I think they were convinced by the bad/severely bad actors, and I believe this happens on all political spectrums. I know many "left leaning" folks with arguably insane ideas about politics and society in general, so this isn't a republican disorder. I don't resent them or even myself for coming to unreasonable conclusions and I believe they're actually trying to improve their situation in the way they know how. Being wrong in and of itself isn't a crime, I suppose. Protesting on bad information is unfortunate, but not criminal. I have sympathy for all of these people. Things seem pretty awful for them right now, whether it should or not. It all seems very self-inflicted. Regardless, it seems a lot of manipulation has been involved. It's very cult-like. Power hungry folks have recruited disenfranchised individuals to serve their agendas. It's really sad. The rest of the republican voters will be a mix of these groups, but I suspect they've come to terms with the election despite disappointment. They don't want to zip tie anyone in congress or illegally overturn the election. The bad actors really should experience consequences. They are a rot that contaminates the people around them. Whether they intend that or not, have good intentions or not, they have become so unreasonable and dangerous that they need to be contained at the least. I believe that includes Donald Trump most of all.

hajile 6y ago
The FBI only lists around 30 people wanted on anything more serious than unlawful entry, violent entry, trespassing, or similar. They weren't even charged with rioting because (as these videos show), wandering around gawking at the Capitol building isn't rioting by any reasonable definition. That wandering also doesn't play well with the idea that they intended violence against the legislature. Yes, they should probably be charged with something, but the punishment should fit the crime and I doubt most of those people will have anything super serious happen (even if the Judge is trying to send a message). EDIT: as it seems unclear, these are people WANTED for crimes NOT people actually charged (that number is lower).
- dragonwriter 6y ago
  > The FBI only lists around 30 people wanted on anything more serious than unlawful entry, violent entry, trespassing, or similar. That number is increasing daily. The easy charges come first, because the evidence needed to make them withstand a probable cause hearing is trivial. > They weren't even charged with rioting because ...For the people (those charged only in D.C. Superior Court) for whom more serious charges weren't already clearly available, the unlawful entry charge is open and shut for arrest and extra charges while investigation continues as to the full set of charges each should face doesn't actually do anything. Also, riot in the D.C. code isn't a more serious offense than unlawful entry on public property. While for those already charged in US District Court for US Code offenses, most of which are felonies, the D.C. Code misdemeanor for rioting is an irrelevancy.