22 ms·

What's not mentioned in the OP: - INSANE peer pressure. If you're skinny as a twig in the US, you're probably considered normal in Japan. If you're actually an

by euske 6y ago

What's not mentioned in the OP: - INSANE peer pressure. If you're skinny as a twig in the US, you're probably considered normal in Japan. If you're actually an obese person (again, in the US standard), people here wouldn't even look at you straight. This kind of environment put a huge pressure for one to stay in shape. - INSANE obsession for health. I hear that Americans are obsessed with health, but oh boy, have they looked into Japan. Small clinics are everywhere and they're always filled with anxious patients because they have a benign stomach pain or something. Physical checkup is mandatory for most companies. I also read that the fear of COVID in Japan is the strongest in the world, despite a relatively low infection/death number here. People are always talking about their health, and so is the national media. If you watch the Japanese TV, you'll also feel sick, simply because there's so much fear! Maybe this is good for public health overall, but I bet there's a certain mental toll.

agumonkey 6y ago
Japan wearing face mask 24/7 since the 90s I believe (I wonder if it was all started after the diesel scandal)
- Torkel 6y ago
  This is not correct. Before covid only people who felt like thay might have a cold or similar wore face masks, to reduce risk of infecting others. (This is my understanding after living there for one year and then travelling for a month every other year for ~20 years. I’m not native though so there may be some nuance to mask wearing I’m missing)
  - bobthepanda 6y ago
    IIRC, I've also read that they consider it helpful for allergy season. Japan supposedly has one of the worst allergy seasons in the world due to misguided industrial policy around timber. TL,DR; After WWII Japan heavily incentivized reforestation to provide cheap domestic timber for industrial and defense purposes, but only with two types of trees, Japanese cedar and Japanese cypress. It turns out that even with this explicit industrial policy, it's cheaper to import timber, so trees weren't being cut down as fast as expected and the forestry industry had a declining workforce that couldn't maintain the forests. The resulting bi-cultural conifer forests grew so thickly that no sunlight reached the forest floor and these forests became devoid of biodiversity. And now all of these trees release a lot of pollen. 10 minute Youtube video explaining all this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VC4gRGPbTqE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VC4gRGPbTqE
    - hbarka 6y ago
      “Male trees are one of the most significant reasons why seasonal allergies have gotten so bad in the recent decades.” https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/seasonal-allergies-blame-male-trees https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/seasonal-allergies-bla...
      - bobthepanda 6y ago
        That’s a US practice. In Japan this isn’t really a problem, since the forests are clearly able to breed if they are growing denser, and the streets are mostly not wide enough to have trees except maybe on major roads.
    - glandium 6y ago
      There's also Japanese Alder allergy. And various flowers. It's hell for people with multiple allergies because it can be all year round for them.
  - flippinburgers 6y ago
    Allergy sufferers as well.
- woutr_be 6y ago
  That’s just false. In many places in Asia it’s considered a must to wear a mask when you’re sick, but nobody in Japan is wearing it 24/7. Not sure where you got this information from.
howlgarnish 6y ago
> people here wouldn't even look at you straight Quite the opposite! Random strangers will stare, and friends and colleagues will make blunt comments in a way that would send them straight to HR in the US: you'll be told to your face you're fat, asked how much you weigh, get poked in the belly, asked if you've tried sumo wrestling, etc. A random デブちゃん's experience: https://www.tofugu.com/japan/fat-in-japan/ https://www.tofugu.com/japan/fat-in-japan/
- reedf1 6y ago
  I've had a real example of this! I've never even been overweight but a Japanese friend, who was an exchange student, would poke me in the stomach and if there was the slightest pudge he would yell "Hamburger!"
- woutr_be 6y ago
  I’ve had those experiences in China, my friends would often comment on my weight. They never meant it in a offensive way, but it’s still hurtful.
  - sneak 6y ago
    Empathy isn't a cultural thing, it's a human thing. If people are doing things that are hurtful and they don't care to notice, they aren't your friends, they're just people you know.
    - woutr_be 6y ago
      I beg to differ. What is considered as normal in some cultures, can be considered offensive in other cultures. It's not because those people lack empathy.
      - sneak 6y ago
        What matters is who is doing the considering. Each friendship between people is its own "culture" in that sense; I don't generally do things that my friend would consider offensive, if they are actually my friend. It's nothing to do with the wider culture or ethnic environment, or what third parties may or may not be offended by: I don't do things that I know would hurt my friends.
ben_w 6y ago
> I also read that the fear of COVID in Japan is the strongest in the world, despite a relatively low infection/death number here. I’d expect the former to cause the latter.
fxtentacle 6y ago
There's also the different family organization. My impression in Asia was that the elderly there spend a lot of time with their grandchildren, to the point where they cannot travel because they're on babysitting duty. Many people feel younger after playing with kids. I wouldn't be surprised if it also affects you on a more chemical level, for example by triggering different methylation and thereby changing gene expressions.
tkgally 6y ago
Long-term resident of Japan here with no particular expertise or insights on longevity or health. Something that has struck me recently are the government-led educational efforts focused on nutrition for infants and children. My daughter and one-year-old grandson live with me, and ever since he started eating solid food she has been feeding him exclusively homemade, vegetable-centric meals. When preparing the food, especially at first, she referred to guidelines for ri’nyū shoku (“weaning food”) in the Maternal and Child Health Handbook issued by the government for all babies [0, 1] as well as some cookbooks she bought. The emphasis of ri’nyū shoku guidance is on handmade, nonprocessed food; my daughter has yet to buy any commercial babyfood. She hasn't been able to have much interaction with other young parents (for obvious reasons), so I don't know how typical her approach to babyfood is. But my impression is that she is not unusual. For older children, the government promotes something called shokuiku (food and nutrition education, [2]) that is incorporated into the school curriculum and is coordinated with the food that children actually eat at school. (Most schoolchildren eat school-supplied hot lunches.) The specific guidelines for ri’nyū shoku and shokuiku seem to reflect both scientific research on nutrition and a nationalist nostalgia for traditional Japanese diet and eating customs. [0] https://www.med.or.jp/english/journal/pdf/2010_04/259_265.pdf https://www.med.or.jp/english/journal/pdf/2010_04/259_265.pd... [1] https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jaih/27/2/27_121/_pdf https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jaih/27/2/27_121/_pdf [2] https://www.maff.go.jp/e/policies/tech_res/shokuiku.html https://www.maff.go.jp/e/policies/tech_res/shokuiku.html
- howlgarnish 6y ago
  That all sounds very wholesome, but based on what I've seen, reality is pretty different. That commercial baby food you mentioned seems to avoid salt entirely and make up for it with gobs of sugar. Snacks for kids like tamago boro are little puffs of sugar and starch. I'll readily grant that the universal free school food is a huge improvement on the US swill, although this too has its share on unhealthy practices: mandating that everything served has to be eaten whether you're hungry or not or you like it or not (kids are regularly told that sukikirai, liking/hating foods, is not allowed), and the mandatory milk & milk bun for that sugar kick. At least whale meat has become too expensive to feature regularly anymore.
- 6y ago
marcyb5st 6y ago
As an Italian person (also our life expectancy is really good on average) this hits home. An anecdotal example: I now live in Switzerland and my current doctor was shocked when I ask to get some blood analysis without being sick. He believed that I lied to my insurance company and hid some pre-existing condition. In Italy, instead, it is pretty common that every couple of years you get a complete blood analysis just to see if everything is ok and whether you need to change something in your lifestyle. Additionally, Sardinia (another "blue zone" with great life expectancy) also has a different diet compared to mainland Italy. Loads of seafood and relatively small amounts of livestock proteins.
- chaosite 6y ago
  As an Israeli, are blood tests not a normal thing done everywhere? I did not realize that... My family doctor asks for a battery of lab tests about once a year (or whenever I get around to scheduling a check-up), including glucose and cholesterol and liver functions and so on. This has been going on since I was twenty something.
  - marcyb5st 6y ago
    Not in my experience. I also lived in Sweden and UK. Blood tests are usually only a reactivate thing. You're sick you get blood tests. As prevention not as common I'm afraid.
    - ynfnehf 6y ago
      The reason Sweden doesn't do regular health checks of the population is because there is no good scientific evidence that it has any effect. And that if a person feels healthy, they most likely are. I think the similar reasoning is used in other countries. If you can read swedish/use Google translate, this page explains it very clearly: https://www.1177.se/fragor--svar/nationellt/behandling--hjalpmedel/ska-jag-ga-pa-halsokontroll-varje-ar/ https://www.1177.se/fragor--svar/nationellt/behandling--hjal...
      - 6y ago
CodeGlitch 6y ago
A culture that promotes health and well-being sounds great to me. Here in the West any criticism of someone's health gets you sent to HR, or accused of hate speech (ok I'm exaggerating a little but I don't think we're far off from that). Perhaps after covid people will take their health more seriously? Edit: by health I meant fitness, obviously many people have health issues that they cannot help.
- yowlingcat 6y ago
  > Perhaps after covid people will take their health more seriously? I'm not hopeful of it. The problem is that it's just such good business to keep people in poor health. Consider all the products that can be sold to them: - addictive junk food to exacerbate the cycle - type 2 diabetes medication - plus-size clothing - plus-size identity media - weight loss programs and medications Now, I'm not saying that all of this is done intentionally. But what I am saying is that strong incentives exist to keep selling these products and keep demand for them high, unless society as a whole agrees that it's wrong to do so, (as it eventually did with tobacco) at least without warning.
  - CodeGlitch 6y ago
    Possibly, although the "healthy living" industry is also pretty large - think about all the vitamins, self-help books / media, non-GM food, etc.
  - amanaplanacanal 6y ago
    It’s unlikely the problem will be solved until we can get some agreement on what is causing it. There isn’t consensus on this one. Why are people now overweight in many countries when they weren’t 50 years ago? What changed?
    - mensetmanusman 6y ago
      Your using it. The computer. All the interesting things in the world compressed into a device that you mostly use while immobile. Also, cost per calorie has never been lower, so technology has made it super cheap to feed us.
belorn 6y ago
I have a hard time imagine that stress and fear over ones health is positive correlated to long life span. One possibility however is that less uncertainty in regard to health has a strong beneficial effect.
Tade0 6y ago
> Maybe this is good for public health overall, but I bet there's a certain mental toll. I'm trying to weigh this over the model in my country where even in private healthcare the doctors tend to downplay the severity of your ailments. A friend of mine is currently suffering from multiple afflictions and this is his experience. I've only ever got roped into unnecessary treatments (only affecting aesthetics really), so it was a surprise for me that even those who have all the incentive to look closely at your problems tend to leave it unless it something that can be done quickly.
ekianjo 6y ago
> I also read that the fear of COVID in Japan is the strongest in the world, despite a relatively low infection/death number here You mau want to reconsider your sources because having a promotional campaign to enhance travel during the midst of the pandemic has made lots of Japanese travel all over the place in crowds and stack in small restaurants. Does not match at all with a supposed fear of COVID.
ekianjo 6y ago
> Small clinics are everywhere and they're always filled with anxious patients because they have a benign stomach pain or something What are you talking about ? They are filled woth old people most of the time because of the large elderly population in Japan. Most salary men are too busy with their jobs to even take a break from office work which is why the OTC market is so large in Japan to treat various ailments without seeing doctors.
namelosw 6y ago
> INSANE peer pressure. In China, it's even more so. If you're an obese person and many will throw "wow you're fat" and "you should really lose some weight" right in your face. Although it sounds terrible, most of the time they're more concerned about you rather than trying to hurt you intentionally. But it does make people feel more guilty about being fat or eating high-calorie foods.
- Blikkentrekker 6y ago
  It's really quite interesting that it's really quite easy to insults that come from genuine concern, and insults that come from a desire to insult with no actual concern, and oddly enough, the former is what is often more a cultural taboo than the latter. Insults such as “Get mental help.” are rarely a form of genuine concern, and fly around far more than legitimate concerned advise that one might benefit from such therapy.
africanboy 6y ago
> - INSANE peer pressure As an Italian I wouldn't call it peer pressure, but attention to ones health. I have a mild condition of high blood pressure, it runs in my family, when my doctor visited me the first thing he said was "you're a bit overweight, let's lose 4-5 kg, it usually helps and if it doesn't we'll work on the drug dosage" (my current intake is a "kids' dose") and it actually worked, I went from a minimum of ~85 to 70 just by losing some weight. Some body shapes, like being to skinny or too fat, are linked to "not being well". > but I bet there's a certain mental toll. We talk about three things in Italy: food, health and weather (and soccer if you are into it, I am not). There's no real mental toll to it, we just talk about it, but there is no real pressure around it (except those who spread fear for personal or political gain, but that's not different from Trump saying that Mexicans bring 'tremendous infectious disease' to the US). What's different, I think, it's that we grow up with the notion that "good health begins at the table" meaning that eating well is the most important thing to stay healthy, we keep doing it and teach it to our children.
collyw 6y ago
From an external perspective being slim and healthy seems like to sensible things to be obsessed about.(Though your comment implies "too skinny" over "slim"). It seems better than "body positive" movements telling us that being overweight is "healthy" despite it being pretty common knowledge that it isn't. To me it's the equivalent of saying that smoking a few cigarettes a day is healthy.
Blikkentrekker 6y ago
> - INSANE obsession for health. I hear that Americans are obsessed with health, but oh boy, have they looked into Japan. Small clinics are everywhere and they're always filled with anxious patients because they have a benign stomach pain or something. Physical checkup is mandatory for most companies. I also read that the fear of COVID in Japan is the strongest in the world, despite a relatively low infection/death number here. People are always talking about their health, and so is the national media. If you watch the Japanese TV, you'll also feel sick, simply because there's so much fear! Maybe this is good for public health overall, but I bet there's a certain mental toll. Ah, this explains how the rapey, but criminally attractive, bisyounen love interest in my favorite Japanese love fiction always rushes the protagonist to the infirmary in schools at the slightest cough, missing valuable lessons, and at the approval of the teacher, for merely walking their on one's own ambulance would be too much of a risk, if one have recently caughed. From what I understand, in the U.S.A. and U.K. schools also have an infirmary and a licensed nurse that works there. — here in the Netherlands, no such thing existed, and a simple cough or headache was certainly not a reason to miss lessons.
- NoOneNew 6y ago
  The nurses in US schools (I've been out for 15 years, things may be different now) are mostly there if a kid gets a bloody nose, deals with a kid's allergic reaction, verify a sudden extreme temperature to dismiss the kid or generally stabilize before a paramedic arrives if it's serious. In high school, one kid cracked his head open on the gym floor from slipping while playing indoor soccer. Pretty much all she could do was slow the bleeding. Plus, school nurse isnt a cert nurse's first pick in jobs. Which I dont blame them. Who would want to deal with kids all day trying to fake sickness so they can skip class? A simple cough and low fever wouldn't get you out of class. You needed head lice, vomit 3 times within 1 hour, vomit blood, or a 101f fever to get out of class back in my day... or a cracked skull. But "infirmary"... it's a $25 first aid kit (at best) and like 2 EpiPens. I carry a better medical kit in the trunk of my car just because I like being prepared.
  - Blikkentrekker 6y ago
    Well, all of those things happened in my school too, including cracking my head open such that I had to go to a hospital's e.r. unit. All of it was done by normal teachers that would otherwise teach history or geography and simply had taken a first aid course. I do not have a trained nurse at home either, and I can just as easily be hurt so to crack my head open there, dare I say more easily.
WhyNotHugo 6y ago
The pressure is partially due to an understand of how public healthcare works. If you're very obese, you're costing all other taxpayers a substantial amount of money. You're being careless with your health, and everyone collectively pays for it. It's socially irresponsibly to be unhealthy.

by euske 6y ago

agumonkey 6y ago

Japan wearing face mask 24/7 since the 90s I believe (I wonder if it was all started after the diesel scandal)

Torkel 6y ago
This is not correct. Before covid only people who felt like thay might have a cold or similar wore face masks, to reduce risk of infecting others. (This is my understanding after living there for one year and then travelling for a month every other year for ~20 years. I’m not native though so there may be some nuance to mask wearing I’m missing)
- bobthepanda 6y ago
  IIRC, I've also read that they consider it helpful for allergy season. Japan supposedly has one of the worst allergy seasons in the world due to misguided industrial policy around timber. TL,DR; After WWII Japan heavily incentivized reforestation to provide cheap domestic timber for industrial and defense purposes, but only with two types of trees, Japanese cedar and Japanese cypress. It turns out that even with this explicit industrial policy, it's cheaper to import timber, so trees weren't being cut down as fast as expected and the forestry industry had a declining workforce that couldn't maintain the forests. The resulting bi-cultural conifer forests grew so thickly that no sunlight reached the forest floor and these forests became devoid of biodiversity. And now all of these trees release a lot of pollen. 10 minute Youtube video explaining all this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VC4gRGPbTqE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VC4gRGPbTqE
  - hbarka 6y ago
    “Male trees are one of the most significant reasons why seasonal allergies have gotten so bad in the recent decades.” https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/seasonal-allergies-blame-male-trees https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/seasonal-allergies-bla...
    - bobthepanda 6y ago
      That’s a US practice. In Japan this isn’t really a problem, since the forests are clearly able to breed if they are growing denser, and the streets are mostly not wide enough to have trees except maybe on major roads.
  - glandium 6y ago
    There's also Japanese Alder allergy. And various flowers. It's hell for people with multiple allergies because it can be all year round for them.
- flippinburgers 6y ago
  Allergy sufferers as well.
woutr_be 6y ago
That’s just false. In many places in Asia it’s considered a must to wear a mask when you’re sick, but nobody in Japan is wearing it 24/7. Not sure where you got this information from.

howlgarnish 6y ago

> people here wouldn't even look at you straight Quite the opposite! Random strangers will stare, and friends and colleagues will make blunt comments in a way that would send them straight to HR in the US: you'll be told to your face you're fat, asked how much you weigh, get poked in the belly, asked if you've tried sumo wrestling, etc. A random デブちゃん's experience: https://www.tofugu.com/japan/fat-in-japan/ https://www.tofugu.com/japan/fat-in-japan/

reedf1 6y ago
I've had a real example of this! I've never even been overweight but a Japanese friend, who was an exchange student, would poke me in the stomach and if there was the slightest pudge he would yell "Hamburger!"
woutr_be 6y ago
I’ve had those experiences in China, my friends would often comment on my weight. They never meant it in a offensive way, but it’s still hurtful.
- sneak 6y ago
  Empathy isn't a cultural thing, it's a human thing. If people are doing things that are hurtful and they don't care to notice, they aren't your friends, they're just people you know.
  - woutr_be 6y ago
    I beg to differ. What is considered as normal in some cultures, can be considered offensive in other cultures. It's not because those people lack empathy.
    - sneak 6y ago
      What matters is who is doing the considering. Each friendship between people is its own "culture" in that sense; I don't generally do things that my friend would consider offensive, if they are actually my friend. It's nothing to do with the wider culture or ethnic environment, or what third parties may or may not be offended by: I don't do things that I know would hurt my friends.

ben_w 6y ago

> I also read that the fear of COVID in Japan is the strongest in the world, despite a relatively low infection/death number here. I’d expect the former to cause the latter.

fxtentacle 6y ago

There's also the different family organization. My impression in Asia was that the elderly there spend a lot of time with their grandchildren, to the point where they cannot travel because they're on babysitting duty. Many people feel younger after playing with kids. I wouldn't be surprised if it also affects you on a more chemical level, for example by triggering different methylation and thereby changing gene expressions.

tkgally 6y ago

Long-term resident of Japan here with no particular expertise or insights on longevity or health. Something that has struck me recently are the government-led educational efforts focused on nutrition for infants and children. My daughter and one-year-old grandson live with me, and ever since he started eating solid food she has been feeding him exclusively homemade, vegetable-centric meals. When preparing the food, especially at first, she referred to guidelines for ri’nyū shoku (“weaning food”) in the Maternal and Child Health Handbook issued by the government for all babies [0, 1] as well as some cookbooks she bought. The emphasis of ri’nyū shoku guidance is on handmade, nonprocessed food; my daughter has yet to buy any commercial babyfood. She hasn't been able to have much interaction with other young parents (for obvious reasons), so I don't know how typical her approach to babyfood is. But my impression is that she is not unusual. For older children, the government promotes something called shokuiku (food and nutrition education, [2]) that is incorporated into the school curriculum and is coordinated with the food that children actually eat at school. (Most schoolchildren eat school-supplied hot lunches.) The specific guidelines for ri’nyū shoku and shokuiku seem to reflect both scientific research on nutrition and a nationalist nostalgia for traditional Japanese diet and eating customs. [0] https://www.med.or.jp/english/journal/pdf/2010_04/259_265.pdf https://www.med.or.jp/english/journal/pdf/2010_04/259_265.pd... [1] https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jaih/27/2/27_121/_pdf https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jaih/27/2/27_121/_pdf [2] https://www.maff.go.jp/e/policies/tech_res/shokuiku.html https://www.maff.go.jp/e/policies/tech_res/shokuiku.html

howlgarnish 6y ago
That all sounds very wholesome, but based on what I've seen, reality is pretty different. That commercial baby food you mentioned seems to avoid salt entirely and make up for it with gobs of sugar. Snacks for kids like tamago boro are little puffs of sugar and starch. I'll readily grant that the universal free school food is a huge improvement on the US swill, although this too has its share on unhealthy practices: mandating that everything served has to be eaten whether you're hungry or not or you like it or not (kids are regularly told that sukikirai, liking/hating foods, is not allowed), and the mandatory milk & milk bun for that sugar kick. At least whale meat has become too expensive to feature regularly anymore.
6y ago

marcyb5st 6y ago

As an Italian person (also our life expectancy is really good on average) this hits home. An anecdotal example: I now live in Switzerland and my current doctor was shocked when I ask to get some blood analysis without being sick. He believed that I lied to my insurance company and hid some pre-existing condition. In Italy, instead, it is pretty common that every couple of years you get a complete blood analysis just to see if everything is ok and whether you need to change something in your lifestyle. Additionally, Sardinia (another "blue zone" with great life expectancy) also has a different diet compared to mainland Italy. Loads of seafood and relatively small amounts of livestock proteins.

chaosite 6y ago
As an Israeli, are blood tests not a normal thing done everywhere? I did not realize that... My family doctor asks for a battery of lab tests about once a year (or whenever I get around to scheduling a check-up), including glucose and cholesterol and liver functions and so on. This has been going on since I was twenty something.
- marcyb5st 6y ago
  Not in my experience. I also lived in Sweden and UK. Blood tests are usually only a reactivate thing. You're sick you get blood tests. As prevention not as common I'm afraid.
  - ynfnehf 6y ago
    The reason Sweden doesn't do regular health checks of the population is because there is no good scientific evidence that it has any effect. And that if a person feels healthy, they most likely are. I think the similar reasoning is used in other countries. If you can read swedish/use Google translate, this page explains it very clearly: https://www.1177.se/fragor--svar/nationellt/behandling--hjalpmedel/ska-jag-ga-pa-halsokontroll-varje-ar/ https://www.1177.se/fragor--svar/nationellt/behandling--hjal...
    - 6y ago

CodeGlitch 6y ago

A culture that promotes health and well-being sounds great to me. Here in the West any criticism of someone's health gets you sent to HR, or accused of hate speech (ok I'm exaggerating a little but I don't think we're far off from that). Perhaps after covid people will take their health more seriously? Edit: by health I meant fitness, obviously many people have health issues that they cannot help.

yowlingcat 6y ago
> Perhaps after covid people will take their health more seriously? I'm not hopeful of it. The problem is that it's just such good business to keep people in poor health. Consider all the products that can be sold to them: - addictive junk food to exacerbate the cycle - type 2 diabetes medication - plus-size clothing - plus-size identity media - weight loss programs and medications Now, I'm not saying that all of this is done intentionally. But what I am saying is that strong incentives exist to keep selling these products and keep demand for them high, unless society as a whole agrees that it's wrong to do so, (as it eventually did with tobacco) at least without warning.
- CodeGlitch 6y ago
  Possibly, although the "healthy living" industry is also pretty large - think about all the vitamins, self-help books / media, non-GM food, etc.
- amanaplanacanal 6y ago
  It’s unlikely the problem will be solved until we can get some agreement on what is causing it. There isn’t consensus on this one. Why are people now overweight in many countries when they weren’t 50 years ago? What changed?
  - mensetmanusman 6y ago
    Your using it. The computer. All the interesting things in the world compressed into a device that you mostly use while immobile. Also, cost per calorie has never been lower, so technology has made it super cheap to feed us.

belorn 6y ago

I have a hard time imagine that stress and fear over ones health is positive correlated to long life span. One possibility however is that less uncertainty in regard to health has a strong beneficial effect.

Tade0 6y ago

> Maybe this is good for public health overall, but I bet there's a certain mental toll. I'm trying to weigh this over the model in my country where even in private healthcare the doctors tend to downplay the severity of your ailments. A friend of mine is currently suffering from multiple afflictions and this is his experience. I've only ever got roped into unnecessary treatments (only affecting aesthetics really), so it was a surprise for me that even those who have all the incentive to look closely at your problems tend to leave it unless it something that can be done quickly.

ekianjo 6y ago

> I also read that the fear of COVID in Japan is the strongest in the world, despite a relatively low infection/death number here You mau want to reconsider your sources because having a promotional campaign to enhance travel during the midst of the pandemic has made lots of Japanese travel all over the place in crowds and stack in small restaurants. Does not match at all with a supposed fear of COVID.

ekianjo 6y ago

> Small clinics are everywhere and they're always filled with anxious patients because they have a benign stomach pain or something What are you talking about ? They are filled woth old people most of the time because of the large elderly population in Japan. Most salary men are too busy with their jobs to even take a break from office work which is why the OTC market is so large in Japan to treat various ailments without seeing doctors.

namelosw 6y ago

> INSANE peer pressure. In China, it's even more so. If you're an obese person and many will throw "wow you're fat" and "you should really lose some weight" right in your face. Although it sounds terrible, most of the time they're more concerned about you rather than trying to hurt you intentionally. But it does make people feel more guilty about being fat or eating high-calorie foods.

Blikkentrekker 6y ago
It's really quite interesting that it's really quite easy to insults that come from genuine concern, and insults that come from a desire to insult with no actual concern, and oddly enough, the former is what is often more a cultural taboo than the latter. Insults such as “Get mental help.” are rarely a form of genuine concern, and fly around far more than legitimate concerned advise that one might benefit from such therapy.

africanboy 6y ago

> - INSANE peer pressure As an Italian I wouldn't call it peer pressure, but attention to ones health. I have a mild condition of high blood pressure, it runs in my family, when my doctor visited me the first thing he said was "you're a bit overweight, let's lose 4-5 kg, it usually helps and if it doesn't we'll work on the drug dosage" (my current intake is a "kids' dose") and it actually worked, I went from a minimum of ~85 to 70 just by losing some weight. Some body shapes, like being to skinny or too fat, are linked to "not being well". > but I bet there's a certain mental toll. We talk about three things in Italy: food, health and weather (and soccer if you are into it, I am not). There's no real mental toll to it, we just talk about it, but there is no real pressure around it (except those who spread fear for personal or political gain, but that's not different from Trump saying that Mexicans bring 'tremendous infectious disease' to the US). What's different, I think, it's that we grow up with the notion that "good health begins at the table" meaning that eating well is the most important thing to stay healthy, we keep doing it and teach it to our children.

collyw 6y ago

From an external perspective being slim and healthy seems like to sensible things to be obsessed about.(Though your comment implies "too skinny" over "slim"). It seems better than "body positive" movements telling us that being overweight is "healthy" despite it being pretty common knowledge that it isn't. To me it's the equivalent of saying that smoking a few cigarettes a day is healthy.

Blikkentrekker 6y ago

> - INSANE obsession for health. I hear that Americans are obsessed with health, but oh boy, have they looked into Japan. Small clinics are everywhere and they're always filled with anxious patients because they have a benign stomach pain or something. Physical checkup is mandatory for most companies. I also read that the fear of COVID in Japan is the strongest in the world, despite a relatively low infection/death number here. People are always talking about their health, and so is the national media. If you watch the Japanese TV, you'll also feel sick, simply because there's so much fear! Maybe this is good for public health overall, but I bet there's a certain mental toll. Ah, this explains how the rapey, but criminally attractive, bisyounen love interest in my favorite Japanese love fiction always rushes the protagonist to the infirmary in schools at the slightest cough, missing valuable lessons, and at the approval of the teacher, for merely walking their on one's own ambulance would be too much of a risk, if one have recently caughed. From what I understand, in the U.S.A. and U.K. schools also have an infirmary and a licensed nurse that works there. — here in the Netherlands, no such thing existed, and a simple cough or headache was certainly not a reason to miss lessons.

NoOneNew 6y ago
The nurses in US schools (I've been out for 15 years, things may be different now) are mostly there if a kid gets a bloody nose, deals with a kid's allergic reaction, verify a sudden extreme temperature to dismiss the kid or generally stabilize before a paramedic arrives if it's serious. In high school, one kid cracked his head open on the gym floor from slipping while playing indoor soccer. Pretty much all she could do was slow the bleeding. Plus, school nurse isnt a cert nurse's first pick in jobs. Which I dont blame them. Who would want to deal with kids all day trying to fake sickness so they can skip class? A simple cough and low fever wouldn't get you out of class. You needed head lice, vomit 3 times within 1 hour, vomit blood, or a 101f fever to get out of class back in my day... or a cracked skull. But "infirmary"... it's a $25 first aid kit (at best) and like 2 EpiPens. I carry a better medical kit in the trunk of my car just because I like being prepared.
- Blikkentrekker 6y ago
  Well, all of those things happened in my school too, including cracking my head open such that I had to go to a hospital's e.r. unit. All of it was done by normal teachers that would otherwise teach history or geography and simply had taken a first aid course. I do not have a trained nurse at home either, and I can just as easily be hurt so to crack my head open there, dare I say more easily.

WhyNotHugo 6y ago

The pressure is partially due to an understand of how public healthcare works. If you're very obese, you're costing all other taxpayers a substantial amount of money. You're being careless with your health, and everyone collectively pays for it. It's socially irresponsibly to be unhealthy.