17 ms·

I hate the obsession with touch screens. Screens are great ways to show information, but a terrible way to take input. No tactile feedback, stateful placement o

• dannyw 6y ago
  I would love a hybrid approach: gimme touchscreens, gimme some physical controls especially for hardware actions like popping the trunk. C'mon, a software update isn't going to delete my trunk, so put a button for it.
  • margaretdouglas 6y ago
    That's how Crew Dragon works, I wish Elon would apply that process to his cars.
    • m463 6y ago
      Hard enough to control this stuff in a moving car, let alone in zero g and a hard vacuum. (you know, it could be because touch sensors don't work with space gloves)
  • zamfi 6y ago
    > gimme some physical controls especially for hardware actions like popping the trunk I'm with you on this, but it's a pretty great example of when a touchscreen isn't a safety hazard: very unlikely I'll want to pop the trunk while I need to keep my eyes on the road.
    • p1mrx 6y ago
      What if someone's trying to rear end me, and the trunk is where I keep my inflatable ramp?
    • smrq 6y ago
      But you might want to pop the trunk containing your jumper cables if your battery is dead.
      • zbrozek 6y ago
        That would be great. My older BMW doesn't let me do that despite having physical buttons for almost everything. I got stranded once because of this. Manual said to call roadside assistance, which is real helpful when I don't have cell service.
      • zamfi 6y ago
        Yes, though that's a different requirement -- most trunk "buttons" are electronically, not mechanically, connected to the latch, aren't they?
  • deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
• gdulli 6y ago
  I agree, and when I rent a car with a touchscreen it feels unusable and unsafe. I don't want to have to look at the screen every time I use it. What's even crazier to me is the way futuristic movies depict interfaces that float in the air. Has anyone thought that through? Your arms would get tired so fast. There's a reason our best input methods have our arms resting on a surface.
  • SilasX 6y ago
    Yes! I remember a comedian making fun the Minority Report interface and having to flail your arms wildly to use it.
  • KirillPanov 6y ago
    > Has anyone thought that through? Your arms would get tired so fast. This has been known since 1963. Not kidding: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sketchpad https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sketchpad That was the first complete light-pen system that could be used by a non-programmer. Sutherland immediately declared the light pen was a stupid idea because all the blood drains out of your hand.
• hliyan 6y ago
  My car has a very nice compromise: the center screen is surrounded by physical buttons, with a mini-screen on the surface of each button. The buttons display different, relevant functions based on the context being displayed on the center screen. Even the rotary dial switches context.
  • mardiyah 6y ago
    the brand?
• mc32 6y ago
  Did you see the new Mercedes[1] photo revelations and Ford[2] spy photos --dashboard-wide touchscreens. Sigh. Mazda on the other hand has announced getting rid of touchscreens from their vehicles. [1]https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2021/01/07/mercedes-benz-hyperscreen-ces-eqs-daimler-consumer-electronics-show/4140185001/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2021/01/07/mercede... [2]https://www.motortrend.com/news/2022-ford-fusion-active-cuv-suv-wagon-spied-massive-interior-screen/ https://www.motortrend.com/news/2022-ford-fusion-active-cuv-...
  • phs318u 6y ago
    Oh no. That ridiculously huge dash-shaped Merc screen is going to be one damn expensive part to replace!
    • userbinator 6y ago
      It's a Mercedes. Is there any part of one that isn't expensive?
      • jacquesm 6y ago
        Mercedes also makes the A-series and they're really entry level cars, parts are affordable, and the engines are super reliable. The bigger problem with Mercedes is that their electronics and software positively suck.
        • cue_the_strings 6y ago
          > Mercedes A series parts are affordable > The headlight is only sold together with an electronics module for steerable headlight control attached, for a cool 800€. That module is positioned in such a way that water collects around it if the car gets sufficiently splashed from the front, and it dies even though the PCB is conformally coated.
          • jacquesm 6y ago
• crooked-v 6y ago
  Mazda has been removing touchscreens from its vehicles a model at a time and replacing them with HUD designs and physical controls, explicitly for driving safety reasons.
  • simplemen 6y ago
    I love my Outback but Mazda looks like a strong contender for my next car.
    • Rebelgecko 6y ago
      With the new outback, it's whack how it takes around 5 seconds of staring at the touchscreen to accomplish acts like turning off the heated seats. In most cars you don't have to take your eyes off the road to do that
      • jhy 6y ago
        Really? My 2020 Outback 3.6 has dedicated buttons for driver's and passenger's heated seats. They are four stage, depending on how hot I want my bot. Maybe different trim levels move more things to physical buttons than touch screens?
        • Rebelgecko 6y ago
          Maybe? This article shows how they're setup on the outback I've driven (maybe if the bigger screen depends on trim level it's only on those ones?) https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a29654225/analysis-the-2020-subaru-outback-wins-at-ergonomics-mostly/ https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a29654225/analysis-the...
  • culopatin 6y ago
    I just wish Mazda had higher output cars, I’d buy in a heartbeat. I have a Miata for Autocross but I want a turbo/good ev for daily, and I can’t get it from them.
• warent 6y ago
  > Screens are great ways to show information, but a terrible way to take input. No tactile feedback, stateful placement of buttons I never understand this. Unless the interface has like, no more than 2 buttons on it, I'm no better at using buttons than a touch screen. Are people regularly interfacing with complex analogue button systems without even glancing at them?
  • ruined 6y ago
    yes! do you not touch type? have you used a game controller? at least some tesla UI requires touchscreen interface for things such as wiper control [1]. normally this is a lever and tactile knob, with zero distraction potential and no learning curve beyond where to put your hand. personally, i've memorized the stereo controls of every car i've driven more than a few times. 1. https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-53666222 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-53666222
    • judge2020 6y ago
      The alternative for adjusting the wipers is to either press once, leave it on 'auto' (it seems to work well enough for me, but talk from last year suggested it didn't work well), or use voice commands like 'wipers up', 'wipers down', 'wipers max/min/1/2/3/4'.
    • watwut 6y ago
      > do you not touch type I do and it is strictly inferior to keyboard.
      • Nition 6y ago
        "Touch typing" means typing on a physical keyboard without looking at it. Different to typing on a touch screen.
  • simplemen 6y ago
    Back in old days, I could send text messages with phone in my pocket. In my car, I can control all analog knobs without taking my eyes off the road but still need to look at touchscreen for a few interactions.
• gibolt 6y ago
  This means you likely haven't driven a Tesla. Most driving interactions in a Tesla are through the stalk or knob rollers on the steering wheel (that adjust based on situation). It is very well thought out. Voice is an option for nearly everything as well, and it is actually good. The key is that they aren't locked into an outdated fixed UI. Blackberry lost because of their keyboard. Finally, for the scattering of buttons in a traditional vehicle that are used rarely, you still have to visually scan the entire dash to find it and hope their icon is meaningful. This takes your eyes further from the road than a well positioned, responsive screen.
  • ikiris 6y ago
    No, there are still touch screen actions required, which are super distracting if not in FSD mode. Fog lights for example.
    • gibolt 6y ago
      The number required while driving is tiny, available in dedicated top-level menus near the driver, and still voice controllable. I couldn't turn on fog lights in my ICE car without looking for the knob behind the steering wheel, and then fiddling with the options.
    • adwn 6y ago
      > Fog lights for example. I've never driven a Tesla or another car with a touchscreen. I almost never need fog lights, so I wouldn't even know which knob to turn which way in my new car. Doesn't help that it's different for every car manufacturer. I'd actually prefer a touchscreen with big, properly labeled buttons for this.
      • henrikschroder 6y ago
        The controls might be different, but the symbols are a global standard.
        • adwn 6y ago
• _trampeltier 6y ago
  Yes the same for me. Just touch is so bad and backward inovation in so many ways. No blind use etc. I wonder if the idea from B&R Automation is any good. They engrave buttons and sliders in touch displays for this reason. https://www.br-automation.com/en/about-us/press-room/say-goodbye-to-switches-24-06-2020/ https://www.br-automation.com/en/about-us/press-room/say-goo...
• dreamcompiler 6y ago
  Completely agree. The new electric Mustang seems like a pretty decent car (despite being a Mustang in name only), but the godawful screen stuck to the dash ruins it for me. https://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/5/2019/11/2021-Ford-Mustang-Mach-E-dashboard.jpg https://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/5/2019/11/2021-Ford-...
  • nikau 6y ago
    At least they kept a physical volume knob, although apparently its just glued onto the screen and has virtual fingers that emulate a finger touching the screen.
• deepGem 6y ago
  Dials are way better than buttons. For one you need to find out up/down etc where as the dial is just one operation. Esp for things like volume and temperature adjustment. Top top that dials/knobs are more reliable than buttons. I still covet the Honda Civic/Accord 2004-2008 dashboard. I didn't even use the steering mounted controls as the knobs were so easy to use.
• m463 6y ago
  It's significantly worse for model 3 and y with the touchscreen off to the side and no status display looking down the road.
  • deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
• Laarlf 6y ago
  Muscle memory kicks in just like with buttons. The Volvo infotainment does that really well. You can easily learn where something is. Meanwhile with BMWs you still constantly have to look at what you are doing. But that was even normal back when iDrive first came out. The problem is the execution and design, not the technology itself.
• hehehaha 6y ago
  Agreed. Rather than a built-in screen I want to see a simple slot for a tablet with an app that is fully integrated with your car. The screen will be outdated within a couple of years and is a waste of resource. Really wish people designed products with longevity in mind. Edit: just realized this is probably what Apple will end up doing.
• refracture 6y ago
  I can't stand this aspect of newer cars. It also means you're often hosed if you want to update the infotainment system. I've driven a model 3 and I find the gigantic tablet to be not only distracting but impossible to safely interact with while driving. Maybe I'd get used to it but I heavily rely on the tactility and feel of buttons and dials to know what I'm doing while keeping my eyes on the road. It was not a pleasant surprise when I was looking at some mid 2010 Ford Super Duties and wanted to research what it would take to add in an Apple CarPlay head unit. (wasn't added an option from the factory until 2017). Turns out if you get a Lariat or even a well optioned out XLT you get saddled with a touch screen that integrates nonsense like the HVAC and heated seats. The interface is dreadful and you'd be stuck with it for the life of the vehicle. Thanks for nothing Ford.
  • crmrc114 6y ago
    Yeah I hate it, I do have some friends who have upgraded their head units with canbus interfaces that allow aftermarket head units to control things like heated seats and climate. To them the cost was worth it- I am still too cheap.