9 ms·

No, parlor wasn't even doing a "good enough job". It wasn't doing _anything_. It's financial backers supported everything with regards to its users going into a

No, parlor wasn't even doing a "good enough job". It wasn't doing _anything_. It's financial backers supported everything with regards to its users going into a violent frenzy. There really is nothing contentious here, unless you feel that if you know that a group is organizing in your platform with the intent of staging a coup then you're in your right to just let them go about it.

paganel 6y ago
> It's financial backers supported everything with regards to its users going into a violent frenzy. The financial backers of Facebook supported the company a lot through its enabling of the Rohingya genocide. But, then again, the Rohingya are not white, nor Christian, and they don't live in a country that can be a potential source of expats (like the UK or Australia, nice, good countries), only of immigrants.
larrywright 6y ago
There are lots of horrible things on Parler from what I’ve seen (I don’t have an account, I’ve just seen screen shots). The most egregious example was the post from Trump attorney Lin Wood calling for Pence to be executed by firing squad. It was up for days, and only taken down when this all blew up.
- eznzt 6y ago
  I find it hard to understand why that should not be allowed to be said. I know it's in extremely bad taste, but still...
  - NoSorryCannot 6y ago
    You're wondering why making threats of violence against a person or trying to rally a credible threat against them isn't permitted under the first?
    - eznzt 6y ago
      I would have to see the exact text, but the way it was mentioned up in this thread it didn't sound like either of those.
      - a_conservative 6y ago
        He didn't call for him to be executed: https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2021/01/02/06/37509512-9105875-image-a-11_1609569839246.jpg https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2021/01/02/06/37509512-9105875-...
        eznzt 6y ago
        Ah, so it's a load of bullshit. As I imagined.
        marz0 6y ago
        What is he proposing then? https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErGzmjYWMAI_POS?format=jpg&name=large https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErGzmjYWMAI_POS?format=jpg&name=...
        a_conservative 6y ago
        Thanks for sharing that, I hadn't seen that post. I can see how you would take it that way, but honestly people have been saying a lot worse on the internet for a long time now. I believe he's saying that we should have military tribunals to try and execute traitors, but of course those words were implied, not explicitly said. I agree it's inflammatory for sure, but after all the crap I've seen on the internet, this is hardly a post to justify removing the entire platform this was posted on.
        PopsiclePete 6y ago
        And after the tribunals are setup and operational and people are getting executed - would it be enough then? Or not quite yet still? What's your "this is enough, guys" point? Do you have one? We got mighty close this time, didn't we? Do we need to get "closer"? Should Nancy Pelosi have had to be captured by some "patriot" with zip-ties and an AR-15?
  - pixl97 6y ago
    No, it's a violent call to action in front of an angry mob willing to commit violence.
  - myko 6y ago
    Well, it's illegal in the US for one: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/871 https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/871 There's also the fact that an angry mob overran the US Capitol while chanting "Hang Mike Pence" as a direct result of Lin and Trump's posts/comments
- lambdaphagy 6y ago
  I hope no one ever posts a horrible thing like calling for the death of a politician on twitter.
- rrose 6y ago
  and i think a key point about this particular example is that Lin Wood is a very visible public figure. This wasn't a single crazy comment buried in a long thread that a moderator could have missed. If there was any good-faith effort by Parler to moderate content, it would have caught the Lin Wood rant.
- lettergram 6y ago
  For reference, this was on Twitter & Parler. Twitter didn't take him down for at least a week. Similarly, I've seen people regularly call for violence on all sides and not be removed from Twitter. The reality is that the moderators are overwhelmed, etc.
  - TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
    Too busy to moderate Trump's inner circle.
  - clowd 6y ago
    Twitter, though, at least has moderators, and makes an effort to remove threatening content from its service. The speed and efficacy of Twitter's abuse team is a topic for debate, but they have (and enforce) policy. Parler famously had no such policy, that's why it was so attractive to the insurrectionists. The CEO, even after January 6th, went on record that he didn't feel it was Parler's responsibility to moderate user-generated content at all. Whatever last-minute olive branch they tried extending to AWS regarding a potential future volunteer moderator system obviously wasn't sufficient for Amazon.
    - a_band 6y ago
      Twitter and Facebook took how many years and millions of dollars to scale up a moderation strategy? I guarantee they weren't worrying about moderation at Parler's scale.
  - larrywright 6y ago
    Twitter didn't take him down for a week, but they took that post down faster (I think). I regularly report twitter posts that are similar to that - violence mostly. It often takes two or three days, but they do get them taken down.
- threeseed 6y ago
  Here are some examples that are just as egregious: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgBxXcAAuTkC?format=jpg&name=small https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgBxXcAAuTkC?format=jpg&name=... https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgBuXYAAB4y2?format=jpg&name=small https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgBuXYAAB4y2?format=jpg&name=... https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgB3XIAcffGC?format=jpg&name=small https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgB3XIAcffGC?format=jpg&name=...
weaksauce 6y ago
To extend on that... the entire premise of parler was that everyone was censoring them too much(for similar calls for violence) so they needed a platform that was immune from that. well when your entire premise is flawed from the start it's not a stretch to see that they would be targeted from that like stormfront.
- waheoo 6y ago
  That's a stretch. Millions feel censored and diminished. You don't get to the level parler got purely because the few extreme users felt censored. You saw a minority of users taking free speech too far. This wasn't Amazon, Google's or Twitter's place to act. This was a job for the police and the FBI and really the fact they intervened at all is just so fucking American. World police that nobody bloody wants.
  - skuthus 6y ago
    Sounds like reasonable open internet regulation, like the type that "The Left" has been fighting to get for decades, would have really been something useful for Republicans to not oppose simply because of its popularity among the left. Instead, we are left with mega corporations being the arbiters of their own platforms, Just like those supporting deregulation wanted.
    - weaksauce 6y ago
      the stuff they were posting on parler was probably illegal[0][1] and parler specifically didn't moderate their violent or seditious rhetoric. (though they did moderate anything that didn't align with their groupthink) 0: https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/rioting-and-inciting-riots.html https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/rioting-and-in... 1: https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/sedition.html https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/sedition.html
      - snowflake_ptr 6y ago
        > parler specifically didn't moderate their violent or seditious rhetoric Citation needed - this is an extreme claim.
bosswipe 6y ago
No, Parler was doing plenty of moderation. They actively suppressed opposing left-wing view points. It was a pure far-right agitation machine.
humannature1 6y ago
I had an account there for about six months before it went offline. It wasn't a particularly interesting or compelling website. Most people viewed posts of affiliates; there were some memes but most of it was just conservative talking points. The average post being "this person or movement is a jerk because..." I personally never witnessed any violent discussion on Parler. Again, the website was less compelling than Twitter in all ways; it was more like a news website. I have seen more provocative comments on other forums. I have personally witnessed violent statements on Twitter over several years usually coming from leftists such as AOC. Part of this is due to the comments being easier to read on Twitter than Parler. I assume bad behavior on Parler was deep in the comments, but the website didn't make those easy to read. I thought the Parler takedown seemed random. They were used as a scapegoat. If you were a normal user, you used it to hear a different viewpoint but you still lurked on Twitter some because there was no real discussion happening on Parler.
- oneeyedpigeon 6y ago
  I'd appreciate it if you could avoid the term "leftist" in future - this may be a cultural thing, but here in the UK, it's almost always used as a derogatory slur. I get the impression that's also true in NA, but forgive me if that isn't the case. Can you provide an example of a violent statement posted on Twitter by AOC?
  - jen20 6y ago
    Not to mention that "leftist" is necessarily relative to some other position. In the UK (not to mention continental Europe!), "left" means something rather different than in the US...
  - humannature1 6y ago
    I won't use leftist again. My anger at censorship is coming out. The proper academic term is postmodernist; at least that's what the Cynical Theories book by Primose mentioned. I told my husband I would stop looking at Twitter since it upsets me so I'm handcuffed to find specific proof there. But, I was primarily referring to the list tweet where AOC mentioned gathering republicans who worked for Trump. There have been other similar sentiments expressed by her to punish people over time; she has an activist side which can get aggressive for a Congresswoman. To be fair AOC isn't the worse I've seen as far as Twitter threats. The worst I've seen is the guy who acted like the controversial professional Mike Adams's suicide was good who is currently a North Carolina professor. Also, there were tweets against Rand Paul which were violent after he got attacked by a neighbor. There have also been tweets for years mostly by random accounts threatening Trump; Gab has organized all the data.

paganel 6y ago

> It's financial backers supported everything with regards to its users going into a violent frenzy. The financial backers of Facebook supported the company a lot through its enabling of the Rohingya genocide. But, then again, the Rohingya are not white, nor Christian, and they don't live in a country that can be a potential source of expats (like the UK or Australia, nice, good countries), only of immigrants.

larrywright 6y ago

There are lots of horrible things on Parler from what I’ve seen (I don’t have an account, I’ve just seen screen shots). The most egregious example was the post from Trump attorney Lin Wood calling for Pence to be executed by firing squad. It was up for days, and only taken down when this all blew up.

eznzt 6y ago
I find it hard to understand why that should not be allowed to be said. I know it's in extremely bad taste, but still...
- NoSorryCannot 6y ago
  You're wondering why making threats of violence against a person or trying to rally a credible threat against them isn't permitted under the first?
  - eznzt 6y ago
    I would have to see the exact text, but the way it was mentioned up in this thread it didn't sound like either of those.
    - a_conservative 6y ago
      He didn't call for him to be executed: https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2021/01/02/06/37509512-9105875-image-a-11_1609569839246.jpg https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2021/01/02/06/37509512-9105875-...
      - eznzt 6y ago
        Ah, so it's a load of bullshit. As I imagined.
      - marz0 6y ago
        What is he proposing then? https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErGzmjYWMAI_POS?format=jpg&name=large https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErGzmjYWMAI_POS?format=jpg&name=...
        a_conservative 6y ago
        Thanks for sharing that, I hadn't seen that post. I can see how you would take it that way, but honestly people have been saying a lot worse on the internet for a long time now. I believe he's saying that we should have military tribunals to try and execute traitors, but of course those words were implied, not explicitly said. I agree it's inflammatory for sure, but after all the crap I've seen on the internet, this is hardly a post to justify removing the entire platform this was posted on.
        PopsiclePete 6y ago
        And after the tribunals are setup and operational and people are getting executed - would it be enough then? Or not quite yet still? What's your "this is enough, guys" point? Do you have one? We got mighty close this time, didn't we? Do we need to get "closer"? Should Nancy Pelosi have had to be captured by some "patriot" with zip-ties and an AR-15?
- pixl97 6y ago
  No, it's a violent call to action in front of an angry mob willing to commit violence.
- myko 6y ago
  Well, it's illegal in the US for one: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/871 https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/871 There's also the fact that an angry mob overran the US Capitol while chanting "Hang Mike Pence" as a direct result of Lin and Trump's posts/comments
lambdaphagy 6y ago
I hope no one ever posts a horrible thing like calling for the death of a politician on twitter.
rrose 6y ago
and i think a key point about this particular example is that Lin Wood is a very visible public figure. This wasn't a single crazy comment buried in a long thread that a moderator could have missed. If there was any good-faith effort by Parler to moderate content, it would have caught the Lin Wood rant.
lettergram 6y ago
For reference, this was on Twitter & Parler. Twitter didn't take him down for at least a week. Similarly, I've seen people regularly call for violence on all sides and not be removed from Twitter. The reality is that the moderators are overwhelmed, etc.
- TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
  Too busy to moderate Trump's inner circle.
- clowd 6y ago
  Twitter, though, at least has moderators, and makes an effort to remove threatening content from its service. The speed and efficacy of Twitter's abuse team is a topic for debate, but they have (and enforce) policy. Parler famously had no such policy, that's why it was so attractive to the insurrectionists. The CEO, even after January 6th, went on record that he didn't feel it was Parler's responsibility to moderate user-generated content at all. Whatever last-minute olive branch they tried extending to AWS regarding a potential future volunteer moderator system obviously wasn't sufficient for Amazon.
  - a_band 6y ago
    Twitter and Facebook took how many years and millions of dollars to scale up a moderation strategy? I guarantee they weren't worrying about moderation at Parler's scale.
- larrywright 6y ago
  Twitter didn't take him down for a week, but they took that post down faster (I think). I regularly report twitter posts that are similar to that - violence mostly. It often takes two or three days, but they do get them taken down.
threeseed 6y ago
Here are some examples that are just as egregious: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgBxXcAAuTkC?format=jpg&name=small https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgBxXcAAuTkC?format=jpg&name=... https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgBuXYAAB4y2?format=jpg&name=small https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgBuXYAAB4y2?format=jpg&name=... https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgB3XIAcffGC?format=jpg&name=small https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErTzgB3XIAcffGC?format=jpg&name=...

weaksauce 6y ago

To extend on that... the entire premise of parler was that everyone was censoring them too much(for similar calls for violence) so they needed a platform that was immune from that. well when your entire premise is flawed from the start it's not a stretch to see that they would be targeted from that like stormfront.

waheoo 6y ago
That's a stretch. Millions feel censored and diminished. You don't get to the level parler got purely because the few extreme users felt censored. You saw a minority of users taking free speech too far. This wasn't Amazon, Google's or Twitter's place to act. This was a job for the police and the FBI and really the fact they intervened at all is just so fucking American. World police that nobody bloody wants.
- skuthus 6y ago
  Sounds like reasonable open internet regulation, like the type that "The Left" has been fighting to get for decades, would have really been something useful for Republicans to not oppose simply because of its popularity among the left. Instead, we are left with mega corporations being the arbiters of their own platforms, Just like those supporting deregulation wanted.
  - weaksauce 6y ago
    the stuff they were posting on parler was probably illegal[0][1] and parler specifically didn't moderate their violent or seditious rhetoric. (though they did moderate anything that didn't align with their groupthink) 0: https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/rioting-and-inciting-riots.html https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/rioting-and-in... 1: https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/sedition.html https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/sedition.html
    - snowflake_ptr 6y ago
      > parler specifically didn't moderate their violent or seditious rhetoric Citation needed - this is an extreme claim.

bosswipe 6y ago

No, Parler was doing plenty of moderation. They actively suppressed opposing left-wing view points. It was a pure far-right agitation machine.

humannature1 6y ago

I had an account there for about six months before it went offline. It wasn't a particularly interesting or compelling website. Most people viewed posts of affiliates; there were some memes but most of it was just conservative talking points. The average post being "this person or movement is a jerk because..." I personally never witnessed any violent discussion on Parler. Again, the website was less compelling than Twitter in all ways; it was more like a news website. I have seen more provocative comments on other forums. I have personally witnessed violent statements on Twitter over several years usually coming from leftists such as AOC. Part of this is due to the comments being easier to read on Twitter than Parler. I assume bad behavior on Parler was deep in the comments, but the website didn't make those easy to read. I thought the Parler takedown seemed random. They were used as a scapegoat. If you were a normal user, you used it to hear a different viewpoint but you still lurked on Twitter some because there was no real discussion happening on Parler.

oneeyedpigeon 6y ago
I'd appreciate it if you could avoid the term "leftist" in future - this may be a cultural thing, but here in the UK, it's almost always used as a derogatory slur. I get the impression that's also true in NA, but forgive me if that isn't the case. Can you provide an example of a violent statement posted on Twitter by AOC?
- jen20 6y ago
  Not to mention that "leftist" is necessarily relative to some other position. In the UK (not to mention continental Europe!), "left" means something rather different than in the US...
- humannature1 6y ago
  I won't use leftist again. My anger at censorship is coming out. The proper academic term is postmodernist; at least that's what the Cynical Theories book by Primose mentioned. I told my husband I would stop looking at Twitter since it upsets me so I'm handcuffed to find specific proof there. But, I was primarily referring to the list tweet where AOC mentioned gathering republicans who worked for Trump. There have been other similar sentiments expressed by her to punish people over time; she has an activist side which can get aggressive for a Congresswoman. To be fair AOC isn't the worse I've seen as far as Twitter threats. The worst I've seen is the guy who acted like the controversial professional Mike Adams's suicide was good who is currently a North Carolina professor. Also, there were tweets against Rand Paul which were violent after he got attacked by a neighbor. There have also been tweets for years mostly by random accounts threatening Trump; Gab has organized all the data.