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Before Christmas, i downloaded StreetComplete so I have something to do on my daily walks. This post just reminded me to actually upload my changes. The whole

by luplex 6y ago

Before Christmas, i downloaded StreetComplete so I have something to do on my daily walks. This post just reminded me to actually upload my changes. The whole process worked flawlessly, i can recommend it. The only problem is that there seems to be not a lot of community coordination, so I'm not sure which data types I should focus on.

matkoniecz 6y ago
Glad to hear that it works nicely :) (I am one of contributors to that software) > The only problem is that there seems to be not a lot of community coordination, so I'm not sure which data types I should focus on. So you want to know how data contributed with SC is actually used? Address data and road names are obviously heavily used, surface data is used for routing, opening hours is shown in multiple places showing shop data from OSM. https://github.com/streetcomplete/StreetComplete/blob/master/app/src/main/java/de/westnordost/streetcomplete/quests/QuestModule.kt#L119 https://github.com/streetcomplete/StreetComplete/blob/master... has list of quests in terms of their priority with some mentions in comments with some examples this data is used.
- lucb1e 6y ago
  Is surface data really that helpful in routing when the road type is accurate? If a road is indicated to be a major one, the surface ought to match its heavy use. What's more, if you've ever driven in Belgium, or crossed the border from Germany into the Netherlands over a highway while it's raining (pervious asphalt, "ZOAB"), you'll find that asphalt != asphalt. Driving from Aachen to Nijmegen might be much nicer over Dutch roads than over German ones in the rain, but both would be tagged with the same surface. It's a very easy quest so I complete it when I'm checking the location anyway, but I do find it to be quite a bit less useful than, say, whether a road is lit, which I have been tagging near me because my girlfriend mentioned that she was having trouble planning runs because she doesn't know which streets are lit. The lit tag is prioritized below surface data, and road type isn't a quest at all. (Ties into a book I'm reading: invisible women. We're not purposefully ignoring them, but men developed the app and we are much less likely to care whether a road is lit when going out after dark. I don't actually know why prioritization was set this way, just that I wouldn't be surprised if this bias subconsciously played into it, or perhaps is the reason why there are so few apps that display it.)
  - MayeulC 6y ago
    It's quite useful to me when biking (I prefer to avoid gravel on my road bike, OSMAnd and brouter will show you the type and allow a few tweaks), and when on rollers (smooth asphalt is really needed, there is also a smoothness tag in OSM). https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:smoothness https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:smoothness Also useful if your vehicle is capable of light offroad but not heavy offroad. After having a few fright down a dirt road in a relatively light duty off-road vehicle, I went back and made it "very horrible" in OSM.
  - matkoniecz 6y ago
    `surface=asphalt` can be in general assumed in many places. But it is worth tagging surface values to catch `surface=sett`/`surface=unhewn_cobblestone`/`surface=dirt` And yes, in some areas all roads are asphalt ones. But it is basically impossible to guess which places and where is border of "everything is asphalt here" area. So this quest is asked everywhere - it is not easy to distinguish "obviously asphalt" from "unsurveyed". And tagging at least some surface values in given area makes easier to be certain about what is obvious in a given location.
lucb1e 6y ago
I would argue one should mainly focus on what you would use yourself, and only if you enjoy it and are running out of things to add, move onto other types (here it can be tricky to know what is really needed/used). The reason I recommend starting with your own priorities, is that this (when done by enough people) adds what is really being used the most by everyone. Mind that the existence of data also creates purposes for it. Let's say that features for blind people are mapped very well in your area and there is a developer involved with that community, s/he could create software to make use of it. For this example, StreetComplete asks for things like tactile paving at bus stops and crossings and auditory signals at traffic lights. One thing I don't see the use of at all but that is a ton of work in most areas is the "building kind" and "number of levels for this building". One could color-code the building type or render an approximate height for each building on 3d maps, but really, most maps don't do either of this, and these two quests are far more work than the dozens of other quests combined.
- matkoniecz 6y ago
  +1 there is plenty of things that are tagged quite poorly in OSM, but are likely to be used if data quality is better (like say kosher status of some food places that can be usefully tagged - this quest just appeared in StreetComplete, disabled by default. You can enable it if you want to record such info in your area).
morsch 6y ago
Your comment made me take another look at StreetComplete, and there is now a lot more to do than when I last used it. So that's nice.

by luplex 6y ago

matkoniecz 6y ago

Glad to hear that it works nicely :) (I am one of contributors to that software) > The only problem is that there seems to be not a lot of community coordination, so I'm not sure which data types I should focus on. So you want to know how data contributed with SC is actually used? Address data and road names are obviously heavily used, surface data is used for routing, opening hours is shown in multiple places showing shop data from OSM. https://github.com/streetcomplete/StreetComplete/blob/master/app/src/main/java/de/westnordost/streetcomplete/quests/QuestModule.kt#L119 https://github.com/streetcomplete/StreetComplete/blob/master... has list of quests in terms of their priority with some mentions in comments with some examples this data is used.

lucb1e 6y ago
Is surface data really that helpful in routing when the road type is accurate? If a road is indicated to be a major one, the surface ought to match its heavy use. What's more, if you've ever driven in Belgium, or crossed the border from Germany into the Netherlands over a highway while it's raining (pervious asphalt, "ZOAB"), you'll find that asphalt != asphalt. Driving from Aachen to Nijmegen might be much nicer over Dutch roads than over German ones in the rain, but both would be tagged with the same surface. It's a very easy quest so I complete it when I'm checking the location anyway, but I do find it to be quite a bit less useful than, say, whether a road is lit, which I have been tagging near me because my girlfriend mentioned that she was having trouble planning runs because she doesn't know which streets are lit. The lit tag is prioritized below surface data, and road type isn't a quest at all. (Ties into a book I'm reading: invisible women. We're not purposefully ignoring them, but men developed the app and we are much less likely to care whether a road is lit when going out after dark. I don't actually know why prioritization was set this way, just that I wouldn't be surprised if this bias subconsciously played into it, or perhaps is the reason why there are so few apps that display it.)
- MayeulC 6y ago
  It's quite useful to me when biking (I prefer to avoid gravel on my road bike, OSMAnd and brouter will show you the type and allow a few tweaks), and when on rollers (smooth asphalt is really needed, there is also a smoothness tag in OSM). https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:smoothness https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:smoothness Also useful if your vehicle is capable of light offroad but not heavy offroad. After having a few fright down a dirt road in a relatively light duty off-road vehicle, I went back and made it "very horrible" in OSM.
- matkoniecz 6y ago
  `surface=asphalt` can be in general assumed in many places. But it is worth tagging surface values to catch `surface=sett`/`surface=unhewn_cobblestone`/`surface=dirt` And yes, in some areas all roads are asphalt ones. But it is basically impossible to guess which places and where is border of "everything is asphalt here" area. So this quest is asked everywhere - it is not easy to distinguish "obviously asphalt" from "unsurveyed". And tagging at least some surface values in given area makes easier to be certain about what is obvious in a given location.

lucb1e 6y ago

I would argue one should mainly focus on what you would use yourself, and only if you enjoy it and are running out of things to add, move onto other types (here it can be tricky to know what is really needed/used). The reason I recommend starting with your own priorities, is that this (when done by enough people) adds what is really being used the most by everyone. Mind that the existence of data also creates purposes for it. Let's say that features for blind people are mapped very well in your area and there is a developer involved with that community, s/he could create software to make use of it. For this example, StreetComplete asks for things like tactile paving at bus stops and crossings and auditory signals at traffic lights. One thing I don't see the use of at all but that is a ton of work in most areas is the "building kind" and "number of levels for this building". One could color-code the building type or render an approximate height for each building on 3d maps, but really, most maps don't do either of this, and these two quests are far more work than the dozens of other quests combined.

matkoniecz 6y ago
+1 there is plenty of things that are tagged quite poorly in OSM, but are likely to be used if data quality is better (like say kosher status of some food places that can be usefully tagged - this quest just appeared in StreetComplete, disabled by default. You can enable it if you want to record such info in your area).

morsch 6y ago

Your comment made me take another look at StreetComplete, and there is now a lot more to do than when I last used it. So that's nice.