4 ms·

How will Spain ensure the registry remains confidential? What identifiers will be shared with other EU countries?

by twistiti 6y ago

bassman9000 6y ago
They won't. We haven't learnt a bit. The only way to keep data confidential is not to gather it.
- pbhjpbhj 6y ago
  Not even that, data-mining reveals data that wasn't directly gathered. We need to gather data to operate government (in this case healthcare), so there has to be a more realistic approach than "don't gather any data".
pdyck 6y ago
You could use a differentially private mechanism like randomized response to gather the data. This would protect the individual through plausible deniability and still allow some kind of research about what factors correlate with anti-vaxxers. But I doubt that this is what the Spanish government is going to do. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randomized_response https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randomized_response
- toshk 6y ago
  I think you think to highly of Spanish government and culture. This is purely a pressure mechanism. They are a very young democracy and their authoritarian instincts are still very fresh. For instance their first lockdown was extremely rigid and enforced with heavy policing and also neighbors were eager to enforce it on each other. Experiencing the first days there and then going back to my home in the north of Europe, the difference was night and day.
  - torcete 6y ago
    Being from Spain and having lived in other EU countries, I must agree with you.
  - commonsenseplz 6y ago
    > For instance their first lockdown was extremely rigid and enforced with heavy policing You seem to think that's a bad thing? I had built a life in northern Europe over the past decade, then I decided to leave when I realised neither the government nor the people seemed actually inclined to lockdown. Now for the past 6 months I live in a country with single-digit local contagion cases and the street I used to live in Berlin is the hardest-hit in Germany... Go figure The country I now live reached its status by closing borders for non-essencial travel, extremely rigid fines for breaking quarantine on arrival, and heavy police enforcement of those fines.
    - yomly 6y ago
      I have been splitting my time between a covid-free country and a covid-ridden country and it is very VERY hard to get peers from the so-called "free" nations see how their individualistic obsession with personal rights and privacy are completely self-destructive under the current environment. They can't even fathom that living in a covid free nation isn't even that onerous in the day to day. Contact trace and socially distance. Wear a mask and actually DO quarantine. They're more ready to make up excuses: - China and Vietnam are faking their numbers - New Zealand is a low density remote island - Australia became an authoritarian state - Taiwan were already prepared - Singapore is a dictatorship Meanwhile these nations have only had to protect their entertainment industries (domestic tourism is clawing back some of the lost tourism income now) but all these other free countries like the UK have lived with restrictions most of 2020 now and have ALSO torpedoed their economy AND had the most casualties. At this point I'd almost rather go full cynic and just appreciate covid as an agent of natural selection rather than collectively ruin the prospects of the future generation, but of course that is also politically untenable. So given that dichotomy of choice I will gladly cede some human rights to empower my government actually do their job.
      - hef19898 6y ago
        The connection between open economies and harsh Covid measures is somehow lost on a lot of people. As a result, the se people are out and about for keeping everything open, Covid is spreading and the economy has to be closed down (at least parts of it anyway). Which prompts more "open up" activism, and the cycle starts again.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
pfortuny 6y ago
You will be amazed at the contradictions between Spanish databprotection laws and the way the Administration handles these data...

How will Spain ensure the registry remains confidential? What identifiers will be shared with other EU countries?

bassman9000 6y ago

They won't. We haven't learnt a bit. The only way to keep data confidential is not to gather it.

pbhjpbhj 6y ago
Not even that, data-mining reveals data that wasn't directly gathered. We need to gather data to operate government (in this case healthcare), so there has to be a more realistic approach than "don't gather any data".

pdyck 6y ago

You could use a differentially private mechanism like randomized response to gather the data. This would protect the individual through plausible deniability and still allow some kind of research about what factors correlate with anti-vaxxers. But I doubt that this is what the Spanish government is going to do. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randomized_response https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randomized_response

toshk 6y ago
I think you think to highly of Spanish government and culture. This is purely a pressure mechanism. They are a very young democracy and their authoritarian instincts are still very fresh. For instance their first lockdown was extremely rigid and enforced with heavy policing and also neighbors were eager to enforce it on each other. Experiencing the first days there and then going back to my home in the north of Europe, the difference was night and day.
- torcete 6y ago
  Being from Spain and having lived in other EU countries, I must agree with you.
- commonsenseplz 6y ago
  > For instance their first lockdown was extremely rigid and enforced with heavy policing You seem to think that's a bad thing? I had built a life in northern Europe over the past decade, then I decided to leave when I realised neither the government nor the people seemed actually inclined to lockdown. Now for the past 6 months I live in a country with single-digit local contagion cases and the street I used to live in Berlin is the hardest-hit in Germany... Go figure The country I now live reached its status by closing borders for non-essencial travel, extremely rigid fines for breaking quarantine on arrival, and heavy police enforcement of those fines.
  - yomly 6y ago
    I have been splitting my time between a covid-free country and a covid-ridden country and it is very VERY hard to get peers from the so-called "free" nations see how their individualistic obsession with personal rights and privacy are completely self-destructive under the current environment. They can't even fathom that living in a covid free nation isn't even that onerous in the day to day. Contact trace and socially distance. Wear a mask and actually DO quarantine. They're more ready to make up excuses: - China and Vietnam are faking their numbers - New Zealand is a low density remote island - Australia became an authoritarian state - Taiwan were already prepared - Singapore is a dictatorship Meanwhile these nations have only had to protect their entertainment industries (domestic tourism is clawing back some of the lost tourism income now) but all these other free countries like the UK have lived with restrictions most of 2020 now and have ALSO torpedoed their economy AND had the most casualties. At this point I'd almost rather go full cynic and just appreciate covid as an agent of natural selection rather than collectively ruin the prospects of the future generation, but of course that is also politically untenable. So given that dichotomy of choice I will gladly cede some human rights to empower my government actually do their job.
    - hef19898 6y ago
      The connection between open economies and harsh Covid measures is somehow lost on a lot of people. As a result, the se people are out and about for keeping everything open, Covid is spreading and the economy has to be closed down (at least parts of it anyway). Which prompts more "open up" activism, and the cycle starts again.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

pfortuny 6y ago

You will be amazed at the contradictions between Spanish databprotection laws and the way the Administration handles these data...