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"People seem to forgive anything if they can get things little cheaper" - the problem is way deeper now. There are some products that does not have non-Chinese

"People seem to forgive anything if they can get things little cheaper" - the problem is way deeper now. There are some products that does not have non-Chinese equivalents now (even more expensive), some products are not produced in China in their most expensive version (many smartphones). In addition China does majority of rare earth elements processing, needed for electronics. And the list goes on. So it is increasingly difficult to buy something 100% not produced in China.

lotu 6y ago
Rare earths aren't the big deal everyone thinks they are. Rare earths are more or less evenly distributed across the planet but do not form ores so you can't mine them efficiently. There is nothing about it that only China can do, they just do it the cheapest, in part because they do it an a more polluting fashion. Yes there would be massive supply socks if we lost access to the Chinese market but they would stabilize (at a higher price) in time. This is different than something like a modern CPU which China cannot produce at any price.
- kps 6y ago
  Consider what happens if China takes Taiwan and TSMC.
  - ohazi 6y ago
    There have been rumors for years that Taiwan has arrangements to quickly destroy critical TSMC technology/equipment in the event of a mainland invasion. No doubt these whispers are spread deliberately to serve as a disincentive for attack, just like the ghost stories about automated retaliation ("Dead Hand," etc) during the Cold War / MAD era. In this case: "If you attempt to do X in order to acquire Y, a robotic, dispationate, automatic force will see to it that Y is destroyed before you can get to it. Therefore acquisition of Y is no longer a good incentive for X."
    - amelius 6y ago
      Yeah, but taking down TSMC will hit the US more than China, I suppose.
      - a1369209993 6y ago
        Sure, but China can destroy TSMC regardless (it's cost-prohibitive to harden something the size of a semiconductor fab against even conventional, dumped-out-the-back-of-a-aircraft bombing). The point of a scuttling system is not to prevent it from being destroyed, but to prevent the enemy from gaining any benefit from capturing it.
  - birdyrooster 6y ago
    WW3 and we live in huts. The US would implode before giving up military dominance in asia pacific.
- AniseAbyss 6y ago
  Capitalism's whole ideological point is about producing things as cheaply and efficiently as possible. I find it amusing that everyone suddenly hates capitalism now that the Chinese are good at it.
  - randomopining 6y ago
    Most people don't hate pure capitalism. It's just that China is doing every single thing they can whether it's legal, grey area, or illegal... to get ahead. And their aims aren't just to be efficient. They are to use that efficiency to achieve their authoritarian government's goals. So when you look at all of that together, it really is something that the "free world" should be worried about. Most of the tech that China profits off of was developed in the west. Efficiency needs discovery for progress.
    - kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
      Just like when America flaunted copyright and patent law 200 years ago.

lotu 6y ago

Rare earths aren't the big deal everyone thinks they are. Rare earths are more or less evenly distributed across the planet but do not form ores so you can't mine them efficiently. There is nothing about it that only China can do, they just do it the cheapest, in part because they do it an a more polluting fashion. Yes there would be massive supply socks if we lost access to the Chinese market but they would stabilize (at a higher price) in time. This is different than something like a modern CPU which China cannot produce at any price.

kps 6y ago
Consider what happens if China takes Taiwan and TSMC.
- ohazi 6y ago
  There have been rumors for years that Taiwan has arrangements to quickly destroy critical TSMC technology/equipment in the event of a mainland invasion. No doubt these whispers are spread deliberately to serve as a disincentive for attack, just like the ghost stories about automated retaliation ("Dead Hand," etc) during the Cold War / MAD era. In this case: "If you attempt to do X in order to acquire Y, a robotic, dispationate, automatic force will see to it that Y is destroyed before you can get to it. Therefore acquisition of Y is no longer a good incentive for X."
  - amelius 6y ago
    Yeah, but taking down TSMC will hit the US more than China, I suppose.
    - a1369209993 6y ago
      Sure, but China can destroy TSMC regardless (it's cost-prohibitive to harden something the size of a semiconductor fab against even conventional, dumped-out-the-back-of-a-aircraft bombing). The point of a scuttling system is not to prevent it from being destroyed, but to prevent the enemy from gaining any benefit from capturing it.
- birdyrooster 6y ago
  WW3 and we live in huts. The US would implode before giving up military dominance in asia pacific.
AniseAbyss 6y ago
Capitalism's whole ideological point is about producing things as cheaply and efficiently as possible. I find it amusing that everyone suddenly hates capitalism now that the Chinese are good at it.
- randomopining 6y ago
  Most people don't hate pure capitalism. It's just that China is doing every single thing they can whether it's legal, grey area, or illegal... to get ahead. And their aims aren't just to be efficient. They are to use that efficiency to achieve their authoritarian government's goals. So when you look at all of that together, it really is something that the "free world" should be worried about. Most of the tech that China profits off of was developed in the west. Efficiency needs discovery for progress.
  - kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
    Just like when America flaunted copyright and patent law 200 years ago.