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If I have to pay a ton of money for a lawyer that strikes me as itself being a violation of my rights. A system where you are only protected if you pay isn't ju

If I have to pay a ton of money for a lawyer that strikes me as itself being a violation of my rights. A system where you are only protected if you pay isn't justice, it's a protection racket.

otterley 6y ago
It’s not a protection racket, because the person you’re paying isn’t the person who would otherwise threaten you. And an attorney cannot represent both sides. That’s like Professional Ethics rule number one. Besides, the government doesn’t have the time or resources to criminally prosecute most minor violations of the law. If you end up in a position where you need a criminal lawyer, it’s rather likely you did something really foolish to attract enforcement attention. And if you can’t afford an attorney, you can always take your chances with a public defender. But I wouldn’t recommend it.
- lumost 6y ago
  At least in the US, this view seems misinformed. The US holds 24% of the worlds prison population and imprisons .7% of its population. An unfortunate reality is that US law enforcement tends to be selective in its enforcement and prosecution based on geography and class. A college student may get a slap on the wrist(expulsion) for a drug offense while a street kid goes to jail.
  - otterley 6y ago
    These figures don’t change my advice at all. Punishment and procedure are two separate subjects. If you think the punishments the US imposes are severe, that’s an even greater incentive not to commit crimes you can’t afford to defend yourself against. And the vast majority of prisoners aren’t being convicted and sentenced due to parallel construction or other such trickery. In most cases, they’re the result of a garden-variety guilty plea, often to crimes of lesser severity or magnitude than the original charges.
    - Can_Not 6y ago
      >not to commit crimes you can’t afford to defend yourself against. I'm more worried about the cost of defending myself from crimes I didn't commit than the cost of defending myself from crimes I did commit...
      - otterley 6y ago
        Odds are you have nothing to worry about.
        willis936 6y ago
        As long as you don’t piss off a billionaire.
        Can_Not 6y ago
        A dude recently got kneeled to death by cops (not president authorized death squads or court authorized death squads, mind you, normal cops) for allegedly a fake $20 bill. I think there is plenty to worry about.
        otterley 6y ago
        Why, are you passing around counterfeit currency or doing anything else to attract police attention? And I’m not justifying the police’s behavior, mind you. Total miscarriage of justice and abuse of power.
        willis936 6y ago
        This is close to the “nothing to hide” argument, but even then it doesn’t work. People with nothing to hide, doing nothing wrong, are scared of being targeted. That is a completely unacceptable situation. That is definitively illegitimate governance that asks for violent retribution. Also, [0] 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optimism_bias https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optimism_bias
    - filoeleven 6y ago

If I have to pay a ton of money for a lawyer that strikes me as itself being a violation of my rights. A system where you are only protected if you pay isn't justice, it's a protection racket.

otterley 6y ago

It’s not a protection racket, because the person you’re paying isn’t the person who would otherwise threaten you. And an attorney cannot represent both sides. That’s like Professional Ethics rule number one. Besides, the government doesn’t have the time or resources to criminally prosecute most minor violations of the law. If you end up in a position where you need a criminal lawyer, it’s rather likely you did something really foolish to attract enforcement attention. And if you can’t afford an attorney, you can always take your chances with a public defender. But I wouldn’t recommend it.

lumost 6y ago
At least in the US, this view seems misinformed. The US holds 24% of the worlds prison population and imprisons .7% of its population. An unfortunate reality is that US law enforcement tends to be selective in its enforcement and prosecution based on geography and class. A college student may get a slap on the wrist(expulsion) for a drug offense while a street kid goes to jail.
- otterley 6y ago
  These figures don’t change my advice at all. Punishment and procedure are two separate subjects. If you think the punishments the US imposes are severe, that’s an even greater incentive not to commit crimes you can’t afford to defend yourself against. And the vast majority of prisoners aren’t being convicted and sentenced due to parallel construction or other such trickery. In most cases, they’re the result of a garden-variety guilty plea, often to crimes of lesser severity or magnitude than the original charges.
  - Can_Not 6y ago
    >not to commit crimes you can’t afford to defend yourself against. I'm more worried about the cost of defending myself from crimes I didn't commit than the cost of defending myself from crimes I did commit...
    - otterley 6y ago
      Odds are you have nothing to worry about.
      - willis936 6y ago
        As long as you don’t piss off a billionaire.
      - Can_Not 6y ago
        A dude recently got kneeled to death by cops (not president authorized death squads or court authorized death squads, mind you, normal cops) for allegedly a fake $20 bill. I think there is plenty to worry about.
        otterley 6y ago
        Why, are you passing around counterfeit currency or doing anything else to attract police attention? And I’m not justifying the police’s behavior, mind you. Total miscarriage of justice and abuse of power.
        willis936 6y ago
        This is close to the “nothing to hide” argument, but even then it doesn’t work. People with nothing to hide, doing nothing wrong, are scared of being targeted. That is a completely unacceptable situation. That is definitively illegitimate governance that asks for violent retribution. Also, [0] 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optimism_bias https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optimism_bias
  - filoeleven 6y ago