9 ms·

was this presented in court? what were the courts' findings?

Vomzor 6y ago
So far it has not. The courts have shot down the the lawsuits on procedural grounds without looking at the evidence. Several states have held hearings were a lot of these allegations are discussed in detail. The hour long hearings are on youtube. Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkqFTUEvMoU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkqFTUEvMoU Wisconsin State Legislature Election Hearing is still live streaming when I post this. Second edit: Why is my first comment flagged?
- prucomaclu2 6y ago
  Generally speaking the affidavits that have been presented to the judges have been casually dismissed as wild conspiracy theories and never really been taken seriously. Vast majority of affidavits are not addressed at all in their findings. E.g. the PA lawsuits, I wouldn't really classify it as dismissing it on procedural grounds. It was moreso that the case was dismissed on overwhelmingly partisan bias grounds. I am happy to reference posts where I go into greater detail on the facts of these judgements on which my opinion is based, if anyone is legitimately interested.
  - DonHopkins 6y ago
    Did you just create the new accounts "prucomaclu2" and "prucomaclu3" because your original account "prucomaclu" had too much negative karma? https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu2 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu2 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu3 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu3 Are you trying to fraudulently overturn the results of the free and fair election that your comments should be downvoted because they don't contribute to the discussion and violate the guidelines? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html >Throwaway accounts are ok for sensitive information, but please don't create accounts routinely. HN is a community—users should have an identity that others can relate to. Are you going to keep creating new accounts every time you get so much negative karma you can't post any more, as many times as Trump and the GOP have lost lawsuits trying to overturn the election, until you're at "prucomaclu50"? https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2020/12/08/trump-and-the-gop-have-now-lost-50-post-election-lawsuits https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2020/12/08/trump-a... >Trump And The GOP Have Now Lost More Than 50 Post-Election Lawsuits >The Trump campaign and its Republican allies have officially lost or withdrawn more 50 post-election lawsuits, and emerged victorious in only one, according to a tally kept by Democratic Party attorney Marc Elias, underscoring the extent to which President Donald Trump and the GOP’s efforts to challenge President-elect Joe Biden’s win in the courts has overwhelmingly failed to affect the election results. >The 50-case milestone was reached Tuesday as a state court in Georgia dismissed a Republican-led lawsuit, and the count includes both cases that courts have struck down and that the GOP plaintiffs have chosen to withdraw, such as an Arizona lawsuit that the Trump campaign backed down from because it would not affect enough ballots to change the election outcome. >The Trump campaign and GOP’s only win struck down an extended deadline the Pennsylvania secretary of state set for voters to cure mail-in ballots that were missing proof of identification, and likely only affected a small number of mail-in ballots. >Among the Trump campaign’s more notable losses in court thus far are the campaign’s failed lawsuit attempting to overturn Pennsylvania’s election results, which a Trump-appointed appeals court judge said was “light on facts” and “[had] no merit,” and a Nevada court that found the campaign had “no credible or reliable evidence” proving voter fraud. >Courts have also repeatedly struck down the campaign’s allegations claiming their election observers were not able to properly observe the vote counting process, and while one Pennsylvania court did grant the campaign a win by ordering that poll watchers can move closer to election workers, the Pennsylvania Supreme Court later overturned the ruling. >In addition to the Trump campaign, GOP allies including state lawmakers, Republican Party officials and former Trump legal advisor Sidney Powell have also brought dozens of entirely unsuccessful lawsuits, and a lawsuit brought by Pennsylvania GOP lawmakers was rejected Tuesday by the U.S. Supreme Court. >The legal campaign is expected to continue until the Electoral College meets on Dec. 14—or potentially until January—but a “safe harbor” deadline midnight Tuesday, which ensures certified results submitted by that date can’t be challenged by Congress, will make it harder for outstanding cases to succeed.
- prucomaclu2 6y ago
  Your reply was probably flagged because it had only a link. Generally people expect some content to go with a link. I also doubt most people on HN have the patience to wait for that site to load. It took like a minute. And of course it's pro-Trump, but I'm sure that's only a small reason why it was flagged. (Odd thing, I posted a comment to you earlier and it's not visible except when I am logged in. Hopefully at least you saw it.)
  - Vomzor 6y ago
    I did see it but it was also flagged so I couldn't reply. The thing about those affidavits, multiple people said the same thing about different polling places which makes it more believable in my eyes than if it was just one person for each allegation. I do think there was fraud, I'm sure there is even some amount of fraud every election. The real question should be, was the fraud widespread and did it make a difference? I don't know but the fact that people can't even debate this is concerning to me.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
  - DonHopkins 6y ago
    Did you just create the new accounts "prucomaclu2" and "prucomaclu3" because your original account "prucomaclu" had too much negative karma? https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu2 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu2 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu3 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu3 Are you trying to fraudulently overturn the results of the free and fair election that your comments should be downvoted because they don't contribute to the discussion and violate the guidelines? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html >Throwaway accounts are ok for sensitive information, but please don't create accounts routinely. HN is a community—users should have an identity that others can relate to. Are you going to keep creating new accounts every time you get so much negative karma you can't post any more, as many times as Trump and the GOP have lost lawsuits trying to overturn the election, until you're at "prucomaclu50"? https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2020/12/08/trump-and-the-gop-have-now-lost-50-post-election-lawsuits https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2020/12/08/trump-a... >Trump And The GOP Have Now Lost More Than 50 Post-Election Lawsuits >The Trump campaign and its Republican allies have officially lost or withdrawn more 50 post-election lawsuits, and emerged victorious in only one, according to a tally kept by Democratic Party attorney Marc Elias, underscoring the extent to which President Donald Trump and the GOP’s efforts to challenge President-elect Joe Biden’s win in the courts has overwhelmingly failed to affect the election results. >The 50-case milestone was reached Tuesday as a state court in Georgia dismissed a Republican-led lawsuit, and the count includes both cases that courts have struck down and that the GOP plaintiffs have chosen to withdraw, such as an Arizona lawsuit that the Trump campaign backed down from because it would not affect enough ballots to change the election outcome. >The Trump campaign and GOP’s only win struck down an extended deadline the Pennsylvania secretary of state set for voters to cure mail-in ballots that were missing proof of identification, and likely only affected a small number of mail-in ballots. >Among the Trump campaign’s more notable losses in court thus far are the campaign’s failed lawsuit attempting to overturn Pennsylvania’s election results, which a Trump-appointed appeals court judge said was “light on facts” and “[had] no merit,” and a Nevada court that found the campaign had “no credible or reliable evidence” proving voter fraud. >Courts have also repeatedly struck down the campaign’s allegations claiming their election observers were not able to properly observe the vote counting process, and while one Pennsylvania court did grant the campaign a win by ordering that poll watchers can move closer to election workers, the Pennsylvania Supreme Court later overturned the ruling. >In addition to the Trump campaign, GOP allies including state lawmakers, Republican Party officials and former Trump legal advisor Sidney Powell have also brought dozens of entirely unsuccessful lawsuits, and a lawsuit brought by Pennsylvania GOP lawmakers was rejected Tuesday by the U.S. Supreme Court. >The legal campaign is expected to continue until the Electoral College meets on Dec. 14—or potentially until January—but a “safe harbor” deadline midnight Tuesday, which ensures certified results submitted by that date can’t be challenged by Congress, will make it harder for outstanding cases to succeed.
- metabagel 6y ago
  "The courts have shot down the the lawsuits on procedural grounds without looking at the evidence." This is basically not a true statement. You can see for yourself here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-election_lawsuits_related_to_the_2020_United_States_presidential_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-election_lawsuits_related... Here's one example. It clearly wasn't decided on procedural grounds. ========== Judge Matthew W. Brann dismissed the case with prejudice on November 21, citing "strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations," noting that "[i]n the United States of America, this cannot justify the disenfranchisement of a single voter, let alone all the voters of its sixth most populated state ... [o]ur people, laws and institutions demand more". He likened the Trump team argument to "Frankenstein's Monster", and characterized the requested remedy to disqualify nearly seven million votes as "unhinged from the underlying right being asserted."
  - Vomzor 6y ago
    Maybe procedural grounds was the wrong word but this is a good example of what I meant. "I don't want to see the evidence that may disqualify votes because it will disqualify other votes." is basically the logic. It seems weird to me but I'm not a lawyer so I could be wrong and this is perfectly normal ruling from a judge.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]

So far it has not. The courts have shot down the the lawsuits on procedural grounds without looking at the evidence. Several states have held hearings were a lot of these allegations are discussed in detail. The hour long hearings are on youtube. Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkqFTUEvMoU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkqFTUEvMoU Wisconsin State Legislature Election Hearing is still live streaming when I post this. Second edit: Why is my first comment flagged?

prucomaclu2 6y ago
Generally speaking the affidavits that have been presented to the judges have been casually dismissed as wild conspiracy theories and never really been taken seriously. Vast majority of affidavits are not addressed at all in their findings. E.g. the PA lawsuits, I wouldn't really classify it as dismissing it on procedural grounds. It was moreso that the case was dismissed on overwhelmingly partisan bias grounds. I am happy to reference posts where I go into greater detail on the facts of these judgements on which my opinion is based, if anyone is legitimately interested.
- DonHopkins 6y ago
  Did you just create the new accounts "prucomaclu2" and "prucomaclu3" because your original account "prucomaclu" had too much negative karma? https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu2 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu2 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu3 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu3 Are you trying to fraudulently overturn the results of the free and fair election that your comments should be downvoted because they don't contribute to the discussion and violate the guidelines? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html >Throwaway accounts are ok for sensitive information, but please don't create accounts routinely. HN is a community—users should have an identity that others can relate to. Are you going to keep creating new accounts every time you get so much negative karma you can't post any more, as many times as Trump and the GOP have lost lawsuits trying to overturn the election, until you're at "prucomaclu50"? https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2020/12/08/trump-and-the-gop-have-now-lost-50-post-election-lawsuits https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2020/12/08/trump-a... >Trump And The GOP Have Now Lost More Than 50 Post-Election Lawsuits >The Trump campaign and its Republican allies have officially lost or withdrawn more 50 post-election lawsuits, and emerged victorious in only one, according to a tally kept by Democratic Party attorney Marc Elias, underscoring the extent to which President Donald Trump and the GOP’s efforts to challenge President-elect Joe Biden’s win in the courts has overwhelmingly failed to affect the election results. >The 50-case milestone was reached Tuesday as a state court in Georgia dismissed a Republican-led lawsuit, and the count includes both cases that courts have struck down and that the GOP plaintiffs have chosen to withdraw, such as an Arizona lawsuit that the Trump campaign backed down from because it would not affect enough ballots to change the election outcome. >The Trump campaign and GOP’s only win struck down an extended deadline the Pennsylvania secretary of state set for voters to cure mail-in ballots that were missing proof of identification, and likely only affected a small number of mail-in ballots. >Among the Trump campaign’s more notable losses in court thus far are the campaign’s failed lawsuit attempting to overturn Pennsylvania’s election results, which a Trump-appointed appeals court judge said was “light on facts” and “[had] no merit,” and a Nevada court that found the campaign had “no credible or reliable evidence” proving voter fraud. >Courts have also repeatedly struck down the campaign’s allegations claiming their election observers were not able to properly observe the vote counting process, and while one Pennsylvania court did grant the campaign a win by ordering that poll watchers can move closer to election workers, the Pennsylvania Supreme Court later overturned the ruling. >In addition to the Trump campaign, GOP allies including state lawmakers, Republican Party officials and former Trump legal advisor Sidney Powell have also brought dozens of entirely unsuccessful lawsuits, and a lawsuit brought by Pennsylvania GOP lawmakers was rejected Tuesday by the U.S. Supreme Court. >The legal campaign is expected to continue until the Electoral College meets on Dec. 14—or potentially until January—but a “safe harbor” deadline midnight Tuesday, which ensures certified results submitted by that date can’t be challenged by Congress, will make it harder for outstanding cases to succeed.
prucomaclu2 6y ago
Your reply was probably flagged because it had only a link. Generally people expect some content to go with a link. I also doubt most people on HN have the patience to wait for that site to load. It took like a minute. And of course it's pro-Trump, but I'm sure that's only a small reason why it was flagged. (Odd thing, I posted a comment to you earlier and it's not visible except when I am logged in. Hopefully at least you saw it.)
- Vomzor 6y ago
  I did see it but it was also flagged so I couldn't reply. The thing about those affidavits, multiple people said the same thing about different polling places which makes it more believable in my eyes than if it was just one person for each allegation. I do think there was fraud, I'm sure there is even some amount of fraud every election. The real question should be, was the fraud widespread and did it make a difference? I don't know but the fact that people can't even debate this is concerning to me.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- DonHopkins 6y ago
  Did you just create the new accounts "prucomaclu2" and "prucomaclu3" because your original account "prucomaclu" had too much negative karma? https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu2 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu2 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu3 https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=prucomaclu3 Are you trying to fraudulently overturn the results of the free and fair election that your comments should be downvoted because they don't contribute to the discussion and violate the guidelines? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html >Throwaway accounts are ok for sensitive information, but please don't create accounts routinely. HN is a community—users should have an identity that others can relate to. Are you going to keep creating new accounts every time you get so much negative karma you can't post any more, as many times as Trump and the GOP have lost lawsuits trying to overturn the election, until you're at "prucomaclu50"? https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2020/12/08/trump-and-the-gop-have-now-lost-50-post-election-lawsuits https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2020/12/08/trump-a... >Trump And The GOP Have Now Lost More Than 50 Post-Election Lawsuits >The Trump campaign and its Republican allies have officially lost or withdrawn more 50 post-election lawsuits, and emerged victorious in only one, according to a tally kept by Democratic Party attorney Marc Elias, underscoring the extent to which President Donald Trump and the GOP’s efforts to challenge President-elect Joe Biden’s win in the courts has overwhelmingly failed to affect the election results. >The 50-case milestone was reached Tuesday as a state court in Georgia dismissed a Republican-led lawsuit, and the count includes both cases that courts have struck down and that the GOP plaintiffs have chosen to withdraw, such as an Arizona lawsuit that the Trump campaign backed down from because it would not affect enough ballots to change the election outcome. >The Trump campaign and GOP’s only win struck down an extended deadline the Pennsylvania secretary of state set for voters to cure mail-in ballots that were missing proof of identification, and likely only affected a small number of mail-in ballots. >Among the Trump campaign’s more notable losses in court thus far are the campaign’s failed lawsuit attempting to overturn Pennsylvania’s election results, which a Trump-appointed appeals court judge said was “light on facts” and “[had] no merit,” and a Nevada court that found the campaign had “no credible or reliable evidence” proving voter fraud. >Courts have also repeatedly struck down the campaign’s allegations claiming their election observers were not able to properly observe the vote counting process, and while one Pennsylvania court did grant the campaign a win by ordering that poll watchers can move closer to election workers, the Pennsylvania Supreme Court later overturned the ruling. >In addition to the Trump campaign, GOP allies including state lawmakers, Republican Party officials and former Trump legal advisor Sidney Powell have also brought dozens of entirely unsuccessful lawsuits, and a lawsuit brought by Pennsylvania GOP lawmakers was rejected Tuesday by the U.S. Supreme Court. >The legal campaign is expected to continue until the Electoral College meets on Dec. 14—or potentially until January—but a “safe harbor” deadline midnight Tuesday, which ensures certified results submitted by that date can’t be challenged by Congress, will make it harder for outstanding cases to succeed.
metabagel 6y ago
"The courts have shot down the the lawsuits on procedural grounds without looking at the evidence." This is basically not a true statement. You can see for yourself here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-election_lawsuits_related_to_the_2020_United_States_presidential_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-election_lawsuits_related... Here's one example. It clearly wasn't decided on procedural grounds. ========== Judge Matthew W. Brann dismissed the case with prejudice on November 21, citing "strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations," noting that "[i]n the United States of America, this cannot justify the disenfranchisement of a single voter, let alone all the voters of its sixth most populated state ... [o]ur people, laws and institutions demand more". He likened the Trump team argument to "Frankenstein's Monster", and characterized the requested remedy to disqualify nearly seven million votes as "unhinged from the underlying right being asserted."
- Vomzor 6y ago
  Maybe procedural grounds was the wrong word but this is a good example of what I meant. "I don't want to see the evidence that may disqualify votes because it will disqualify other votes." is basically the logic. It seems weird to me but I'm not a lawyer so I could be wrong and this is perfectly normal ruling from a judge.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]