5 ms·

Whatsapp is extremely dominant in my country, but I keep encouraging friends and acquaintances to install Telegram. As far as I know, there won't be anything pr

by mkl95 6y ago

Whatsapp is extremely dominant in my country, but I keep encouraging friends and acquaintances to install Telegram. As far as I know, there won't be anything preventing FB from geoblocking European users when the company eventually gets in some serious trouble, like it just did in the US.

jbverschoor 6y ago
Why telegram and not signal?
- tsjq 6y ago
  Coz , if a lot of people use Signal, govts would surely want to peek into the chats
  - bauerd 6y ago
    Applies to every messenger
- mkl95 6y ago
  Because Signal is virtually unknown here. Telegram has a small, but growing following. I'm aware that Telegram uses homegrown encryption which is not ideal.
  - tapoxi 6y ago
    Telegram doesn't use any encryption for groups. It uses encryption only in 1:1 chats when you specifically request it.
    - fullstop 6y ago
      The transfer to the server is certainly encrypted. You are referring to end-to-end encryption, I assume.
      - tapoxi 6y ago
        Correct, I'm referring to e2e. My personal trust model is not to trust the server.
        fullstop 6y ago
        Right, I understand. It's still encrypted, though, just not in a way that you like.
        driverdan 6y ago
        In the same way that FB, Whatsapp, and pretty much every other app works. I doubt there are any chat apps that don't encrypt between the client and server.
        donatzsky 6y ago
        To be fair, when Telegram launched WhatsApp was still unencrypted. It was a big part of Telegram's marketing at the time.
        _def 6y ago
        Exactly. Sadly they didn't hold their promises
        deepstack 6y ago
        IMHO, it is NOT encrypted, unless the service provider (also can't read your message). A promise from a Russian based company (the Facebook of Russia) doesn't put any assurances for me.
        fullstop 6y ago
        We can't just assign new definitions to encryption. It's encrypted in such a way that a person watching the wire can't see the contents of the message. If you don't want the message on the server, use a secret e2e chat. They are very up front and clear on this matter. For the vast majority of my messages, I'm fine with them living on their servers. If I need to send credentials to my family, I can use an e2e channel. For me, it's a step up from hangouts and definitely better than whatsapp or facebook messenger.
- fsflover 6y ago
  At least Telegram can be used on a desktop without installing it on a spyphone (though without e2e encryption). I would say "why not Matrix?".
- skyyler 6y ago
  They're totally different apps! Signal's focus is 1-to-1 encrypted chats. Telegram's focus is broadcasting messages and group chats. One of them is a secure messenger, the other is a social media network on top of a messaging app.
- another_kel 6y ago
  Because few people care about privacy but many care about UI, UX & features. Telegram is better there than any other chat app by a susbstantial margin.
  - Aachen 6y ago
    This, unfortunately. Matrix (Element) is ever so sloowly getting there, it's slightly better than Signal now in some areas and worse in others, but neither (nor whatsapp or any other messenger) come close to Telegram. Wire is also a good contender but they seem to have found that if you don't sell user data, there is little money to be made from personal accounts and are focusing more on business accounts. You can still register and use it as an individual, though (and I continue to do so). It has more features than Signal and isn't funded by Facebook so that's a plus, but the UX is slightly worse than Signal. Makes you wonder what Telegram is going to make money with though. It's a huge liability for me, just so damn convenient... Need to find a better alternative.
  - jbverschoor 6y ago
    I like the UX of whatsapp / messenger. Also, telegram isn’t private either afaik. In terms of contact info.. I kind of like knowing who I’m talking with
- deepstack 6y ago
  why Signal and not wire? (no sim card needed), No need to allow access to your address book to make group chat. Works in browser, ios, android, desktop app. Using signal protocol. And you can draw in it.
  - kawfey 6y ago
    why wire and not lockdown? why lockdown and not matrix? why matrix and not IRC on a self-hosted server? why IRC and not HF packet radio why HF packet radio and not OTP notes on flashpaper delivered by carrier pigeon? this is the current problem i have with chat. there are too many options.
  - Natales 6y ago
    I've been using Wire for a few years and the experience is solid. No need for phone numbers anymore, just @handle, and it does multi-device encryption and backup. Its search is very fast, even for large number of messages. Good support for attachments and superb audio and video. On the flip side, it's not very customizable and doesn't have a lot of the more "modern" UX goodies like emoji reactions or threads. But it's overall very good and I see no reason to change.
flak48 6y ago
When did FB geoblock users in the US?
- mkl95 6y ago
  Sorry if my wording was unclear. The US part only referred to getting in trouble. If you wonder why I think they may geoblock European users, it's mostly because that's how many American companies are dealing with GDPR (especially retail businesses, but also major media outlets).
  - flak48 6y ago
    My bad, sorry
langbot 6y ago
"geoblocking European users" is already happening. They recently announced some major API changes on the messenger platform that only affect user's from Europe or businesses based in Europe and gave developers about 2 weeks to make changes https://developers.facebook.com/docs/messenger-platform/europe-updates https://developers.facebook.com/docs/messenger-platform/euro...
jokoon 6y ago
isn't signal better?

by mkl95 6y ago

jbverschoor 6y ago

Why telegram and not signal?

tsjq 6y ago
Coz , if a lot of people use Signal, govts would surely want to peek into the chats
- bauerd 6y ago
  Applies to every messenger
mkl95 6y ago
Because Signal is virtually unknown here. Telegram has a small, but growing following. I'm aware that Telegram uses homegrown encryption which is not ideal.
- tapoxi 6y ago
  Telegram doesn't use any encryption for groups. It uses encryption only in 1:1 chats when you specifically request it.
  - fullstop 6y ago
    The transfer to the server is certainly encrypted. You are referring to end-to-end encryption, I assume.
    - tapoxi 6y ago
      Correct, I'm referring to e2e. My personal trust model is not to trust the server.
      - fullstop 6y ago
        Right, I understand. It's still encrypted, though, just not in a way that you like.
        driverdan 6y ago
        In the same way that FB, Whatsapp, and pretty much every other app works. I doubt there are any chat apps that don't encrypt between the client and server.
        donatzsky 6y ago
        To be fair, when Telegram launched WhatsApp was still unencrypted. It was a big part of Telegram's marketing at the time.
        _def 6y ago
        Exactly. Sadly they didn't hold their promises
        deepstack 6y ago
        IMHO, it is NOT encrypted, unless the service provider (also can't read your message). A promise from a Russian based company (the Facebook of Russia) doesn't put any assurances for me.
        fullstop 6y ago
        We can't just assign new definitions to encryption. It's encrypted in such a way that a person watching the wire can't see the contents of the message. If you don't want the message on the server, use a secret e2e chat. They are very up front and clear on this matter. For the vast majority of my messages, I'm fine with them living on their servers. If I need to send credentials to my family, I can use an e2e channel. For me, it's a step up from hangouts and definitely better than whatsapp or facebook messenger.
fsflover 6y ago
At least Telegram can be used on a desktop without installing it on a spyphone (though without e2e encryption). I would say "why not Matrix?".
skyyler 6y ago
They're totally different apps! Signal's focus is 1-to-1 encrypted chats. Telegram's focus is broadcasting messages and group chats. One of them is a secure messenger, the other is a social media network on top of a messaging app.
another_kel 6y ago
Because few people care about privacy but many care about UI, UX & features. Telegram is better there than any other chat app by a susbstantial margin.
- Aachen 6y ago
  This, unfortunately. Matrix (Element) is ever so sloowly getting there, it's slightly better than Signal now in some areas and worse in others, but neither (nor whatsapp or any other messenger) come close to Telegram. Wire is also a good contender but they seem to have found that if you don't sell user data, there is little money to be made from personal accounts and are focusing more on business accounts. You can still register and use it as an individual, though (and I continue to do so). It has more features than Signal and isn't funded by Facebook so that's a plus, but the UX is slightly worse than Signal. Makes you wonder what Telegram is going to make money with though. It's a huge liability for me, just so damn convenient... Need to find a better alternative.
- jbverschoor 6y ago
  I like the UX of whatsapp / messenger. Also, telegram isn’t private either afaik. In terms of contact info.. I kind of like knowing who I’m talking with
deepstack 6y ago
why Signal and not wire? (no sim card needed), No need to allow access to your address book to make group chat. Works in browser, ios, android, desktop app. Using signal protocol. And you can draw in it.
- kawfey 6y ago
  why wire and not lockdown? why lockdown and not matrix? why matrix and not IRC on a self-hosted server? why IRC and not HF packet radio why HF packet radio and not OTP notes on flashpaper delivered by carrier pigeon? this is the current problem i have with chat. there are too many options.
- Natales 6y ago
  I've been using Wire for a few years and the experience is solid. No need for phone numbers anymore, just @handle, and it does multi-device encryption and backup. Its search is very fast, even for large number of messages. Good support for attachments and superb audio and video. On the flip side, it's not very customizable and doesn't have a lot of the more "modern" UX goodies like emoji reactions or threads. But it's overall very good and I see no reason to change.

flak48 6y ago

When did FB geoblock users in the US?

mkl95 6y ago
Sorry if my wording was unclear. The US part only referred to getting in trouble. If you wonder why I think they may geoblock European users, it's mostly because that's how many American companies are dealing with GDPR (especially retail businesses, but also major media outlets).
- flak48 6y ago
  My bad, sorry

langbot 6y ago

"geoblocking European users" is already happening. They recently announced some major API changes on the messenger platform that only affect user's from Europe or businesses based in Europe and gave developers about 2 weeks to make changes https://developers.facebook.com/docs/messenger-platform/europe-updates https://developers.facebook.com/docs/messenger-platform/euro...

jokoon 6y ago

isn't signal better?