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There are limits to diet. In Eastern Europe people just eat potatoes with tons of fat and occasional piece of chicken, arguably the worst diet, and obesity is f

There are limits to diet. In Eastern Europe people just eat potatoes with tons of fat and occasional piece of chicken, arguably the worst diet, and obesity is far lower than in the US.

apcragg 6y ago
Diet isn't just types of food consumed but also the amount. Also fat isn't 'unhealthy' but that's a different misconception.
- etangent 6y ago
  Fat is indeed quite healthy as long as its calorie count does not exceed daily recommended, which is extremely easy to do with fat as its energy rich.
  - tpush 6y ago
    I don't think being rich in energy has anything to do with how easy it is not to over-indulge in it. Plenty of fatty foods that people overeat very very easily.
    - etangent 6y ago
      I was saying exactly the opposite of what you thought I was saying! We agree!
sagolikasoppor 6y ago
Have you tried eating only potatoes for a longer period? Its basically impossible to eat too much.
- etangent 6y ago
  Have you tried subsisting on potatoes? I literally grew up in EE and that was my food for breakfast, dinner, and supper. It's insane how many people in these comments are chiming in "OH ACTUALLY they are great food if consumed properly."
  - tpush 6y ago
    > It's insane how many people in these comments are chiming in "OH ACTUALLY they are great food if consumed properly." Because maybe they have a different opinion than you? I grew up on potatoes (plain, cooked), too, but I like them a lot. You have some weird unhealthy vendetta against potatoes going on here, judging by your other comments in this thread.
    - etangent 6y ago
      > You have some weird unhealthy vendetta against potatoes going on here This is the funniest thing---I absolutely don't! I love mashed potatoes. I am just pointing out they are not the healthiest food. It's okay to like foods that are not healthy. I love cake for example. It's just weird to me how lots of people here seemingly convinced themselves that potatoes are super-healthy while the are actually carb bombs.
slothtrop 6y ago
The worst diet is one abundant in ultra-refined packaged foods. At least chicken and potatoes have nutritional value, even if it's not complete. But you have a point, there was a study revealing that the red meat and fat consumption in Hong Kong was relatively high, and yet longevity ranks among the top of the world. It is a very walkable city.
thatguy0900 6y ago
It's all about quantity and calorie density. You'd have to eat 27 potatoes a day to get to 3k calories, which is on the low end for obese people. Unless they're eating every potatoe baked with heaps of cheese, sour cream and bacon bits then it's not that bad for your weight, at least
- kobalsky 6y ago
  > which is on the low end for obese people do obese people burn more calories just by being fat or are you assuming that they are still getting fatter?
  - thatguy0900 6y ago
    Obese people do need higher calories to maintain their weight. Given that severity of obesity rates in increasing its also true that most fat people are only getting fatter though.
- Scoundreller 6y ago
  Thank you. Potatoes get such a bad reputation as a staple. I think it has to do with the fact that there’s zero marketing budget for a food sold for $1/kg and, like anything else, can be prepared in a healthy way or horribly unhealthy way.
  - cogman10 6y ago
    Well, I'd say it comes down to the fact that most potato preparations are horribly unhealthy. Not the potato's fault, just the meals that surround it. Probably the only tradition potato prep that has a chance of being sort of healthy is mashed potatoes. Even then, those often get loaded up with milk, butter, and gravy. Take rice on the opposite end. Just as unhealthy as potatoes yet a ton of traditional rice meals are super healthy.
    - Scoundreller 6y ago
      I cube them, boil them, and eat them with mustard or hot sauce. Even with ketchup isn’t that bad. Or I toss them into a soup or stir fry. Mash potatoes involve peeling them. That’s a waste of time and nutrients.
AgloeDreams 6y ago
Quantity. In the US, many actually eat meat with every dinner and much of fast food is way outside of safe quantities with ease. Once you get used to the large amounts it gets really easy to feel underfed at safe quantities.
hogFeast 6y ago
What is up with potatoes? Within somewhat recent history, humans ate diets composed almost entirely of potatoes...it did not kill people in large numbers. Obesity in the case of countries like the US is largely due to an excess of calories...maybe other stuff is bad for you but the evidence for that is kind of hard to demonstrate when there is so much obesity. I feel like this is kind of why there are problems with obesity. People lose their mind over stuff like bread and soda, and not overall calories.
- polskibus 6y ago
  In the US, many popular ingredients or basic food like canned tomatoes etc have lots of sugar added. Eliminate the additives and you'll quickly shed the excess weight. For example it's fairly hard in PL to find canned tomatoes with added sugar or passata. If one really needs to sweeten them, he can can add sugar by himself.
  - hogFeast 6y ago
    I am in the UK and Heinz puts a ton of sugar in the national staple: baked beans. I incline against blaming companies but additives is definitely an exception because those ingredients often aren't evident to consumers. We know soda has a ton of sugar but baked beans...most consumers don't know. But it is also true that if you tried to sell those products in PL, consumers wouldn't have it. Eastern Europeans tend to be very knowledgeable about the origins of food in a way that UK or US consumers aren't. The difference between bread in PL and the West being the example I hear most about.
wisty 6y ago
Potatoes have a decent amount of water and fibre (almost as much as apples). There's some dumb internet idea that the type of macros are what really matter, so potatoes are bad because they're all carbs (not protein). Really, if you want to lose weight than less quantity and less energy density (which means replacing macros with water and fibre) is going to matter a bit more than whether the macros are carbs or protein. That said, yes they'll lack some nutrients if that's what you were getting at. Some mixed veg would be a good idea.
- etangent 6y ago
  Ever done starch extraction experiment in middle school? Potatoes are almost pure starch.
  - slothtrop 6y ago
    They're high in starch, that's not necessarily a bad thing. Potatoes are a satiating food, and its starches can improve microbiota. However they're often consumed with excess fat which, on top of adding more calories quickly, can yield a higher insulin response. Potatoes themselves aren't low-GI foods either. Leptin resistance is often associated with weight gain. In general high fiber foods avoid those pitfalls.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - etangent 6y ago
      Potatoes contain 60-80% starch. They are generally low in other nutrients, especially protein. Then you say "however they're often consumed with excess fat" --- yes that's the only way they can be reasonably consumed because they taste like powdered chalk.
      - slothtrop 6y ago
        They're quite high in potassium, vitamin C, B6, niacin, folate, not to mention various minerals. To say it's low in other nutrients is just plain wrong.
tpush 6y ago
Nothing wrong with potatoes, or chicken for that matter. And yeah, tons of fat would be bad, but as you say yourself they are not terribly obese, so by definition the amount of fat (and anything else) can't be that huge.
- etangent 6y ago
  You are inches away from grasping my point, which is that almost anything is a good diet as long as it is consumed in moderation and combined with regular exercise.
  - hackeraccount 6y ago
    Stop talking sense.
GhostVII 6y ago
For sure, I include how much you eat as a part of your diet. The vast majority of people could eat mcdonald's every day and be a healthy weight by just controlling quantity.
Mediterraneo10 6y ago
As Eastern European doctors will tell you, the traditional Eastern Europe diet is unhealthy. Yes, obesity is low, but heart disease is a problem. That the urban middle class now has access to new dining habits inspired from other cuisines or vegan fads, is considered a good thing.
scythe 6y ago
Yes, but are they eating dried foods covered in salt out of foil-lined bags as an anxiety reflex, or are they eating at mealtimes when they're hungry? Ultimately all causes of obesity must be mediated by changes in food consumption behavior or metabolic rate. Very few things alter the metabolic rate; it's relevant to many medical conditions and widely studied. So we're left with foods that affect food consumption patterns. Really, when we talk about foods that cause obesity, we're talking about foods that undermine the normal psychological function of hunger, either by not making you full, making you eat when you're not hungry, or making you continue to eat beyond fullness. Many processed foods are specifically tested, re-tested and optimized to increase these kinds of effects because it generates profits and there's no law against it (yet). There are no traditional diets that can make people fat as effectively as Doritos, for basically the same reason that there are no traditional medicines that treat myelogenous leukemia as well as imatinib.
e7r6eydhd 6y ago
Potatoes+Meat/Dairy is one of the most well rounded diets you can get for only two components. Once you add animal products nutrition becomes incredibly simple.

There are limits to diet. In Eastern Europe people just eat potatoes with tons of fat and occasional piece of chicken, arguably the worst diet, and obesity is far lower than in the US.

apcragg 6y ago

Diet isn't just types of food consumed but also the amount. Also fat isn't 'unhealthy' but that's a different misconception.

etangent 6y ago
Fat is indeed quite healthy as long as its calorie count does not exceed daily recommended, which is extremely easy to do with fat as its energy rich.
- tpush 6y ago
  I don't think being rich in energy has anything to do with how easy it is not to over-indulge in it. Plenty of fatty foods that people overeat very very easily.
  - etangent 6y ago
    I was saying exactly the opposite of what you thought I was saying! We agree!

sagolikasoppor 6y ago

Have you tried eating only potatoes for a longer period? Its basically impossible to eat too much.

etangent 6y ago
Have you tried subsisting on potatoes? I literally grew up in EE and that was my food for breakfast, dinner, and supper. It's insane how many people in these comments are chiming in "OH ACTUALLY they are great food if consumed properly."
- tpush 6y ago
  > It's insane how many people in these comments are chiming in "OH ACTUALLY they are great food if consumed properly." Because maybe they have a different opinion than you? I grew up on potatoes (plain, cooked), too, but I like them a lot. You have some weird unhealthy vendetta against potatoes going on here, judging by your other comments in this thread.
  - etangent 6y ago
    > You have some weird unhealthy vendetta against potatoes going on here This is the funniest thing---I absolutely don't! I love mashed potatoes. I am just pointing out they are not the healthiest food. It's okay to like foods that are not healthy. I love cake for example. It's just weird to me how lots of people here seemingly convinced themselves that potatoes are super-healthy while the are actually carb bombs.

slothtrop 6y ago

The worst diet is one abundant in ultra-refined packaged foods. At least chicken and potatoes have nutritional value, even if it's not complete. But you have a point, there was a study revealing that the red meat and fat consumption in Hong Kong was relatively high, and yet longevity ranks among the top of the world. It is a very walkable city.

thatguy0900 6y ago

It's all about quantity and calorie density. You'd have to eat 27 potatoes a day to get to 3k calories, which is on the low end for obese people. Unless they're eating every potatoe baked with heaps of cheese, sour cream and bacon bits then it's not that bad for your weight, at least

kobalsky 6y ago
> which is on the low end for obese people do obese people burn more calories just by being fat or are you assuming that they are still getting fatter?
- thatguy0900 6y ago
  Obese people do need higher calories to maintain their weight. Given that severity of obesity rates in increasing its also true that most fat people are only getting fatter though.
Scoundreller 6y ago
Thank you. Potatoes get such a bad reputation as a staple. I think it has to do with the fact that there’s zero marketing budget for a food sold for $1/kg and, like anything else, can be prepared in a healthy way or horribly unhealthy way.
- cogman10 6y ago
  Well, I'd say it comes down to the fact that most potato preparations are horribly unhealthy. Not the potato's fault, just the meals that surround it. Probably the only tradition potato prep that has a chance of being sort of healthy is mashed potatoes. Even then, those often get loaded up with milk, butter, and gravy. Take rice on the opposite end. Just as unhealthy as potatoes yet a ton of traditional rice meals are super healthy.
  - Scoundreller 6y ago
    I cube them, boil them, and eat them with mustard or hot sauce. Even with ketchup isn’t that bad. Or I toss them into a soup or stir fry. Mash potatoes involve peeling them. That’s a waste of time and nutrients.

AgloeDreams 6y ago

Quantity. In the US, many actually eat meat with every dinner and much of fast food is way outside of safe quantities with ease. Once you get used to the large amounts it gets really easy to feel underfed at safe quantities.

hogFeast 6y ago

What is up with potatoes? Within somewhat recent history, humans ate diets composed almost entirely of potatoes...it did not kill people in large numbers. Obesity in the case of countries like the US is largely due to an excess of calories...maybe other stuff is bad for you but the evidence for that is kind of hard to demonstrate when there is so much obesity. I feel like this is kind of why there are problems with obesity. People lose their mind over stuff like bread and soda, and not overall calories.

polskibus 6y ago
In the US, many popular ingredients or basic food like canned tomatoes etc have lots of sugar added. Eliminate the additives and you'll quickly shed the excess weight. For example it's fairly hard in PL to find canned tomatoes with added sugar or passata. If one really needs to sweeten them, he can can add sugar by himself.
- hogFeast 6y ago
  I am in the UK and Heinz puts a ton of sugar in the national staple: baked beans. I incline against blaming companies but additives is definitely an exception because those ingredients often aren't evident to consumers. We know soda has a ton of sugar but baked beans...most consumers don't know. But it is also true that if you tried to sell those products in PL, consumers wouldn't have it. Eastern Europeans tend to be very knowledgeable about the origins of food in a way that UK or US consumers aren't. The difference between bread in PL and the West being the example I hear most about.

wisty 6y ago

Potatoes have a decent amount of water and fibre (almost as much as apples). There's some dumb internet idea that the type of macros are what really matter, so potatoes are bad because they're all carbs (not protein). Really, if you want to lose weight than less quantity and less energy density (which means replacing macros with water and fibre) is going to matter a bit more than whether the macros are carbs or protein. That said, yes they'll lack some nutrients if that's what you were getting at. Some mixed veg would be a good idea.

etangent 6y ago
Ever done starch extraction experiment in middle school? Potatoes are almost pure starch.
- slothtrop 6y ago
  They're high in starch, that's not necessarily a bad thing. Potatoes are a satiating food, and its starches can improve microbiota. However they're often consumed with excess fat which, on top of adding more calories quickly, can yield a higher insulin response. Potatoes themselves aren't low-GI foods either. Leptin resistance is often associated with weight gain. In general high fiber foods avoid those pitfalls.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - etangent 6y ago
    Potatoes contain 60-80% starch. They are generally low in other nutrients, especially protein. Then you say "however they're often consumed with excess fat" --- yes that's the only way they can be reasonably consumed because they taste like powdered chalk.
    - slothtrop 6y ago
      They're quite high in potassium, vitamin C, B6, niacin, folate, not to mention various minerals. To say it's low in other nutrients is just plain wrong.

tpush 6y ago

Nothing wrong with potatoes, or chicken for that matter. And yeah, tons of fat would be bad, but as you say yourself they are not terribly obese, so by definition the amount of fat (and anything else) can't be that huge.

etangent 6y ago
You are inches away from grasping my point, which is that almost anything is a good diet as long as it is consumed in moderation and combined with regular exercise.
- hackeraccount 6y ago
  Stop talking sense.

GhostVII 6y ago

For sure, I include how much you eat as a part of your diet. The vast majority of people could eat mcdonald's every day and be a healthy weight by just controlling quantity.

Mediterraneo10 6y ago

As Eastern European doctors will tell you, the traditional Eastern Europe diet is unhealthy. Yes, obesity is low, but heart disease is a problem. That the urban middle class now has access to new dining habits inspired from other cuisines or vegan fads, is considered a good thing.

scythe 6y ago

Yes, but are they eating dried foods covered in salt out of foil-lined bags as an anxiety reflex, or are they eating at mealtimes when they're hungry? Ultimately all causes of obesity must be mediated by changes in food consumption behavior or metabolic rate. Very few things alter the metabolic rate; it's relevant to many medical conditions and widely studied. So we're left with foods that affect food consumption patterns. Really, when we talk about foods that cause obesity, we're talking about foods that undermine the normal psychological function of hunger, either by not making you full, making you eat when you're not hungry, or making you continue to eat beyond fullness. Many processed foods are specifically tested, re-tested and optimized to increase these kinds of effects because it generates profits and there's no law against it (yet). There are no traditional diets that can make people fat as effectively as Doritos, for basically the same reason that there are no traditional medicines that treat myelogenous leukemia as well as imatinib.

e7r6eydhd 6y ago

Potatoes+Meat/Dairy is one of the most well rounded diets you can get for only two components. Once you add animal products nutrition becomes incredibly simple.