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AMD rumored to have a prototype Apple M1 competitor in the works

47 points by WaxProlix 6y ago

syntaxing 6y ago
I would guess you’ll still have performance issues compared to the M1 without MS or Linux Foundation stepping up to the plate.
- singhrac 6y ago
  Really? Why would that be? Is there something fundamentally about mac OS?
  - alblue 6y ago
    The M1 is an Arm+ in the sense that it supports a stronger memory model option that plain Arm doesn’t, and it’s this feature that is used by Apple’s OS and the Rosetta translation engine that gives the performance boost for x86 translated programs. Of course the Rosetta isn’t needed by Linux and assuming that all software is recompiled for Arm natively then you probably wouldn’t need it, but I suspect that is what the GP was referring to.
ravedave5 6y ago
It may be a dud, it may be a stud. If they target end user machines on windows it will probably be a dud, but for AWS this might be a big step up from graviton. Actually has anyone tried to compare graviton vs m1?
- anfilt 6y ago
  AMD has been selling the (64 bit Arm) Opteron A1100 series for a while now. It honestly, needs updated as it's starting to get a little old. However, overall interest in these chips was not as high as hoped.
orionblastar 6y ago
Check Intel, your move. System on a chip is nothing new.
m463 6y ago
I think if they come up with an ARM-based threadripper-type chip (array of chiplets?) things might get pretty interesting. What AMD has going for it is software choices. Maybe microsoft plus linux.
skavi 6y ago
M1 has become such a buzzword. What does M1 competitor even mean? Just an ARM SoC?
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- Matthias247 6y ago
  That is what I wondered too. It could mean "any kind of ARM based SoC". Or "an ARM based SoC with x86_64 memory model emulation". It could however also mean "a tightly coupled package with CPU, GPU and RAM" - even if that's x86 based.
anfilt 6y ago
AMD has experimented with ARM in the past and is selling some ARM 64 chips. such as the Opteron A1100 series chips. However, purchase interest has seemed limited. So AMD definitely has been working on ARM. They may dedicate more resources now that it's a bit of buzz because Apple. Theses chips definitely could use an update. However, like I said in the past interest seemed limited, but these chips definitely could use an update.
lololl 6y ago
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barbacoa 6y ago
https://www.extremetech.com/computing/181867-amds-project-skybridge-new-arm-and-x86-chips-that-are-pin-compatible https://www.extremetech.com/computing/181867-amds-project-sk... Years and years ago they originally tried to release a ARM chip alongside ryzen that was supposed to be pin compatible to their x86 chips. They abandoned that effort so as to focus on ryzen. AMD please please make a ARM cpu that I can just drop into my desktop mobo.
theevilsharpie 6y ago
AMD's strategy has been to focus on a narrow set of initiatives that they can execute well, rather than extend themselves into a bunch of different well-defended markets (as Intel has done to their detriment). In that regard, AMD developing an "M1" competitor, when they already have class-leading x86 processors, doesn't make sense. Renoir -- AMD's current-generation mobile and desktop processors -- is already competitive with M1 (although integrated GPU performance is lackluster), and their next-generation Cezanne processors are right around the corner. On the server side (since that's mentioned elsewhere in this thread), AMD previously released ARM-based Opteron processors, but they were slow and unpopular, and further work on that lineup was cancelled in favor of EPYC. Given that EPYC has single-handedly killed the entire ARM server ecosystem practically overnight (with the survivors being relegated to custom processors for supercomputers and hyperscalers), it's highly unlikely that AMD would revive their ARM efforts for this market. The only situation where an ARM-based AMD processor would make sense, would be as a custom processor where someone else is footing the R&D and manufacturing bill. The only company that I could potentially see interested in such a thing (and would want an ARM-based processor specifically) is Apple themselves -- they need a high-performance ARM processor for the Mac Pro/iMac Pro, and a Threadripper variant with an ARM ISA might make more sense than developing their own in-house high-performance processor for a low-volume line. But even then, it would be an M1 complement, not a competitor. Overall, I wouldn't put too much stock in this particular rumor.
- tengbretson 6y ago
  Supplying the chips for the Xbox and playstation consoles has been pretty successful for amd. I suspect both Microsoft and Sony will be looking long and hard at an arm soc for their next generation consoles and it would be wise for AMD to have an answer to that when it comes.
  - Grazester 6y ago
    Why would they if AMD's x86-64bit offering remaining competitive, affordable, will offer easy backwards compatibility and easy PC game porting for developers? Sony and Microsoft are going nowhere but back to AMD/x86 if the next generation of console remain to same and the whole concept doesn't change drastically.

47 points by WaxProlix 6y ago

I would guess you’ll still have performance issues compared to the M1 without MS or Linux Foundation stepping up to the plate.

singhrac 6y ago
Really? Why would that be? Is there something fundamentally about mac OS?
- alblue 6y ago
  The M1 is an Arm+ in the sense that it supports a stronger memory model option that plain Arm doesn’t, and it’s this feature that is used by Apple’s OS and the Rosetta translation engine that gives the performance boost for x86 translated programs. Of course the Rosetta isn’t needed by Linux and assuming that all software is recompiled for Arm natively then you probably wouldn’t need it, but I suspect that is what the GP was referring to.

ravedave5 6y ago

It may be a dud, it may be a stud. If they target end user machines on windows it will probably be a dud, but for AWS this might be a big step up from graviton. Actually has anyone tried to compare graviton vs m1?

anfilt 6y ago
AMD has been selling the (64 bit Arm) Opteron A1100 series for a while now. It honestly, needs updated as it's starting to get a little old. However, overall interest in these chips was not as high as hoped.

orionblastar 6y ago

Check Intel, your move. System on a chip is nothing new.

m463 6y ago

I think if they come up with an ARM-based threadripper-type chip (array of chiplets?) things might get pretty interesting. What AMD has going for it is software choices. Maybe microsoft plus linux.

skavi 6y ago

M1 has become such a buzzword. What does M1 competitor even mean? Just an ARM SoC?

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
Matthias247 6y ago
That is what I wondered too. It could mean "any kind of ARM based SoC". Or "an ARM based SoC with x86_64 memory model emulation". It could however also mean "a tightly coupled package with CPU, GPU and RAM" - even if that's x86 based.

anfilt 6y ago

AMD has experimented with ARM in the past and is selling some ARM 64 chips. such as the Opteron A1100 series chips. However, purchase interest has seemed limited. So AMD definitely has been working on ARM. They may dedicate more resources now that it's a bit of buzz because Apple. Theses chips definitely could use an update. However, like I said in the past interest seemed limited, but these chips definitely could use an update.

lololl 6y ago

vhvjvvhhnb nbnvbhvjvghv

barbacoa 6y ago

https://www.extremetech.com/computing/181867-amds-project-skybridge-new-arm-and-x86-chips-that-are-pin-compatible https://www.extremetech.com/computing/181867-amds-project-sk... Years and years ago they originally tried to release a ARM chip alongside ryzen that was supposed to be pin compatible to their x86 chips. They abandoned that effort so as to focus on ryzen. AMD please please make a ARM cpu that I can just drop into my desktop mobo.

theevilsharpie 6y ago

AMD's strategy has been to focus on a narrow set of initiatives that they can execute well, rather than extend themselves into a bunch of different well-defended markets (as Intel has done to their detriment). In that regard, AMD developing an "M1" competitor, when they already have class-leading x86 processors, doesn't make sense. Renoir -- AMD's current-generation mobile and desktop processors -- is already competitive with M1 (although integrated GPU performance is lackluster), and their next-generation Cezanne processors are right around the corner. On the server side (since that's mentioned elsewhere in this thread), AMD previously released ARM-based Opteron processors, but they were slow and unpopular, and further work on that lineup was cancelled in favor of EPYC. Given that EPYC has single-handedly killed the entire ARM server ecosystem practically overnight (with the survivors being relegated to custom processors for supercomputers and hyperscalers), it's highly unlikely that AMD would revive their ARM efforts for this market. The only situation where an ARM-based AMD processor would make sense, would be as a custom processor where someone else is footing the R&D and manufacturing bill. The only company that I could potentially see interested in such a thing (and would want an ARM-based processor specifically) is Apple themselves -- they need a high-performance ARM processor for the Mac Pro/iMac Pro, and a Threadripper variant with an ARM ISA might make more sense than developing their own in-house high-performance processor for a low-volume line. But even then, it would be an M1 complement, not a competitor. Overall, I wouldn't put too much stock in this particular rumor.

tengbretson 6y ago
Supplying the chips for the Xbox and playstation consoles has been pretty successful for amd. I suspect both Microsoft and Sony will be looking long and hard at an arm soc for their next generation consoles and it would be wise for AMD to have an answer to that when it comes.
- Grazester 6y ago
  Why would they if AMD's x86-64bit offering remaining competitive, affordable, will offer easy backwards compatibility and easy PC game porting for developers? Sony and Microsoft are going nowhere but back to AMD/x86 if the next generation of console remain to same and the whole concept doesn't change drastically.