5 ms·

Unfortunately, with today's standards of critical thinking and speaking, you get fired for speaking independently, this is more likely to spawn a new movement r

by loopz 6y ago

Unfortunately, with today's standards of critical thinking and speaking, you get fired for speaking independently, this is more likely to spawn a new movement rather than provoke thoughtful responses.

rusk 6y ago
> today’s standards “Today’s”? There has never been a better time for freedom of speech. You can pretty much say whatever you want and nobody is going to put you in jail or burn you at the stake. Indeed you have tools like never before with which to promulgate your message. Even if your remarks are racist, xenophobic, misogynistic or some other kind of bigoted you can still pretty say much whatever you like and there’s even guys out there that will give you a platform. You might think that these rights extend to the workplace but you would be wrong. Leave religion and politics at the door and just do your job. I blame the culture of overwork that exists in the industry for many people not being able to know the difference between personal and professional.
- foxhop 6y ago
  The workplace has become hostile against certain thought and has fully adopted another. You will get fired for speaking against the entrenched thought. This is exactly what was said in the above comment. If I said leave your politics and religion at the door and just do your job in a "safe space zoom call" or at a diversity committee, or at lunch, I'd be fired. The silent ones just want to do our jobs but increasingly the ones with political power inside institutions of work have the control to setup the stage for only one type of thought. I just want to do my job without going into these topics which occupy the majority of the companies all hands time and corporate communications.
  - rusk 6y ago
    Fair point. I’ve heard of this kind of thing but have never experienced it firsthand really in any of the places I’ve worked so surely there must be alternative places to work if you’re not ideologically aligned? But if you go to work for someone you generally have to accept their outlook quietly or move on.
  - amalcon 6y ago
    That's not new, though. It's just adopted a different school of thought than it used to (and not even universally). It wasn't that long ago that you could be fired for mentioning that you are not christian at the office christmas party.
    - jimbokun 6y ago
      > It wasn't that long ago that you could be fired for mentioning that you are not christian at the office christmas party. Citation needed. ACLU would be all over that, religion is a protected class.
      - amalcon 6y ago
        I would cite the exact law that made religion a protected class in the american workplace: the Civil Rights Act of 1964. 56 years ago, this was happening often enough that Congress felt the need to act. This isn't a citation, but if you have a discussion with a jewish american over fifty years old, they likely have stories about this sort of thing.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- jimbokun 6y ago
  > There has never been a better time for freedom of speech. In the West, or at least the USA, I would say the 1990s and 2000s were better for free speech, and very recently there has been a relative curbing of free speech. In surveys, a majority of Americans say they are afraid to share some of their political views. Still better than almost all of human history before that, but I would say we are no longer at the peak of freedom of speech.
  - mcphage 6y ago
    > I would say the 1990s and 2000s were better for free speech Not really. There was no easy way to get your voice out there that people could listen to you.
    - falcolas 6y ago
      The internet has existed for me as a boring citizen in the boonies since at least ‘95. This doesn’t even count Ham radio, BBS, and various other local and global methods of sharing speech.
      - mcphage 6y ago
        Well then, look at it this way: those things still all exist, but there are also new ways of sharing your speech now that didn't exist before.
      - rusk 6y ago
        > that people could listen to you Back in those days you had a very limited audience and I’d go so far as to say that it’s only in the last 10 years or so we’ve seen the public at large go online.
secretsatan 6y ago
We live in an era when anyone can setup a multinational company. If you want to limit your market, setup your own company and alienate your customers and limit your recruitment to a narrow field of people who think like you, don't be suprised when you don't attract the best talent

by loopz 6y ago

rusk 6y ago

> today’s standards “Today’s”? There has never been a better time for freedom of speech. You can pretty much say whatever you want and nobody is going to put you in jail or burn you at the stake. Indeed you have tools like never before with which to promulgate your message. Even if your remarks are racist, xenophobic, misogynistic or some other kind of bigoted you can still pretty say much whatever you like and there’s even guys out there that will give you a platform. You might think that these rights extend to the workplace but you would be wrong. Leave religion and politics at the door and just do your job. I blame the culture of overwork that exists in the industry for many people not being able to know the difference between personal and professional.

foxhop 6y ago
The workplace has become hostile against certain thought and has fully adopted another. You will get fired for speaking against the entrenched thought. This is exactly what was said in the above comment. If I said leave your politics and religion at the door and just do your job in a "safe space zoom call" or at a diversity committee, or at lunch, I'd be fired. The silent ones just want to do our jobs but increasingly the ones with political power inside institutions of work have the control to setup the stage for only one type of thought. I just want to do my job without going into these topics which occupy the majority of the companies all hands time and corporate communications.
- rusk 6y ago
  Fair point. I’ve heard of this kind of thing but have never experienced it firsthand really in any of the places I’ve worked so surely there must be alternative places to work if you’re not ideologically aligned? But if you go to work for someone you generally have to accept their outlook quietly or move on.
- amalcon 6y ago
  That's not new, though. It's just adopted a different school of thought than it used to (and not even universally). It wasn't that long ago that you could be fired for mentioning that you are not christian at the office christmas party.
  - jimbokun 6y ago
    > It wasn't that long ago that you could be fired for mentioning that you are not christian at the office christmas party. Citation needed. ACLU would be all over that, religion is a protected class.
    - amalcon 6y ago
      I would cite the exact law that made religion a protected class in the american workplace: the Civil Rights Act of 1964. 56 years ago, this was happening often enough that Congress felt the need to act. This isn't a citation, but if you have a discussion with a jewish american over fifty years old, they likely have stories about this sort of thing.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
jimbokun 6y ago
> There has never been a better time for freedom of speech. In the West, or at least the USA, I would say the 1990s and 2000s were better for free speech, and very recently there has been a relative curbing of free speech. In surveys, a majority of Americans say they are afraid to share some of their political views. Still better than almost all of human history before that, but I would say we are no longer at the peak of freedom of speech.
- mcphage 6y ago
  > I would say the 1990s and 2000s were better for free speech Not really. There was no easy way to get your voice out there that people could listen to you.
  - falcolas 6y ago
    The internet has existed for me as a boring citizen in the boonies since at least ‘95. This doesn’t even count Ham radio, BBS, and various other local and global methods of sharing speech.
    - mcphage 6y ago
      Well then, look at it this way: those things still all exist, but there are also new ways of sharing your speech now that didn't exist before.
    - rusk 6y ago
      > that people could listen to you Back in those days you had a very limited audience and I’d go so far as to say that it’s only in the last 10 years or so we’ve seen the public at large go online.

secretsatan 6y ago

We live in an era when anyone can setup a multinational company. If you want to limit your market, setup your own company and alienate your customers and limit your recruitment to a narrow field of people who think like you, don't be suprised when you don't attract the best talent