4 ms·

I dislike a lot of "smart" devices, but off-brand or no-brand IoT and "smart" things are a hard no. I assume these to basically be spies or malware vectors. Eve

by api 6y ago

I dislike a lot of "smart" devices, but off-brand or no-brand IoT and "smart" things are a hard no. I assume these to basically be spies or malware vectors. Even if they're not deliberately malicious I figure there's a good chance they are insecure as hell. I tend to go with US-based companies because they would legally be liable for damages, which would in theory mean they'd be less likely to knowingly ship malware and security disasters.

lostcolony 6y ago
Even then, IoT devices are going on their own 'guest' network that none of my own devices are on.
- mulmen 6y ago
  That's a good idea but it still doesn't protect you from spying. And you'd have to put each device on a different network to prevent them from infecting eachother. That probably also has the side effect of making them basically useless. How do you segregate your smart speaker and your smart lightbulb and your smart TV and still control them from your cell phone?
  - lostcolony 6y ago
    I think you missed something there - Either your devices and hub don't need to be exposed to the net (so why are you even using a router connected to the web?), or they do. If they do, it's because that's how you control them, via the web. If that's the case, it doesn't matter what network your phone is on; command and control is done via the web. Now, in terms of infecting each other, sure. But the point is to keep my data devices and such separate from my IoT devices. Yes, the whole IoT infrastructure may get infected and need a purge, but my goal is to keep infection of those from getting, say, my banking information. And yes, it assumes that the command and control app is reasonably secure, but that's a whole different issue (and one reason why I would rely on Amazon or Alexa as a hub, and not some random no name company).
    - mulmen 6y ago
      Sure, this is why I have almost no IoT things. The only thing I can think of is my scale. I'm curious if you have suggestions for a hackable home automation/IoT hub that I can use without giving it access to the internet. I'm happy to DIY anything that doesn't deal with mains voltage.
      - ixwt 6y ago
        A friend pointed me to Home Assistant[0] after I said I was going to look into Hubitat[1]. [0]: https://www.home-assistant.io/ https://www.home-assistant.io/ [1]: https://hubitat.com/ https://hubitat.com/
        jeanofthedead 6y ago
        There's also Homebridge/HOOBS, if you want to link 3rd-party IoT devices to Apple Homekit. Many of the plugins run locally. Homebridge: https://homebridge.io https://homebridge.io HOOBS: https://hoobs.org https://hoobs.org
  - syshum 6y ago
    I have plently of home automation, none of it is controlled with my cell phone. IMO That defeats the purpose of AUTOMATION it should be automated, you have controls in the house that trigger actions, ie a door opens, or a light switch is triggers. If I have to use my phone to control it, I have failed at automation
    - mulmen 6y ago
      For true automation sure but I can think of "IoT" applications where using the phone would be nice. Lighting most of all. I have a small arcade in my basement and the ability to control the lights from my phone would be way better than using the wall switch, mostly because of outlet placement and the fact the switch has to stay on. My living room only has one switched outlet and it is the one closest to the switch. The lights across the room have to be manually controlled. I've done some research into wifi controlled outlets and I have some very old radio controlled ones but I need more. Do you have any suggestions for hackable wifi plugs that do not connect to the internet? Maybe something that connects to a hub? My dream would be something where I can make my own sensors and talk over wifi to outlets that are UL listed, without involving the internet. I'm happy to DIY anything that doesn't interact with mains voltage.
      - syshum 6y ago
        Most of my home automation is Zigbee or Zwave not WiFi, Outlets for the most part are SYLVANIA SMART+ Zigbee/Zwave is controlled via Nortek USB interface connected to a rPI Though I do have a couple of Shelly Devices, and some custom ESP8266 things
        mulmen 6y ago
        Thanks, I’ll check that out. With Black Friday/Cyber Monday coming up I’m trying to compile a shopping list of good gear.
syshum 6y ago
>>I tend to go with US-based companies because they would legally be liable for damages I am not sure under what legal basis you draw this conclusion given the EULA's and other laws explicitly shield them from said liability you would have to prove intentional malicious intent not simply negligence One of the big problems I have with more US Companies is they are a network of vendor Lock-in proprietary ecosystems that often do not work well together at all. I prefer Open protocols, which sadly seem to be only adopted by non-US Companies.

by api 6y ago

lostcolony 6y ago

Even then, IoT devices are going on their own 'guest' network that none of my own devices are on.

mulmen 6y ago
That's a good idea but it still doesn't protect you from spying. And you'd have to put each device on a different network to prevent them from infecting eachother. That probably also has the side effect of making them basically useless. How do you segregate your smart speaker and your smart lightbulb and your smart TV and still control them from your cell phone?
- lostcolony 6y ago
  I think you missed something there - Either your devices and hub don't need to be exposed to the net (so why are you even using a router connected to the web?), or they do. If they do, it's because that's how you control them, via the web. If that's the case, it doesn't matter what network your phone is on; command and control is done via the web. Now, in terms of infecting each other, sure. But the point is to keep my data devices and such separate from my IoT devices. Yes, the whole IoT infrastructure may get infected and need a purge, but my goal is to keep infection of those from getting, say, my banking information. And yes, it assumes that the command and control app is reasonably secure, but that's a whole different issue (and one reason why I would rely on Amazon or Alexa as a hub, and not some random no name company).
  - mulmen 6y ago
    Sure, this is why I have almost no IoT things. The only thing I can think of is my scale. I'm curious if you have suggestions for a hackable home automation/IoT hub that I can use without giving it access to the internet. I'm happy to DIY anything that doesn't deal with mains voltage.
    - ixwt 6y ago
      A friend pointed me to Home Assistant[0] after I said I was going to look into Hubitat[1]. [0]: https://www.home-assistant.io/ https://www.home-assistant.io/ [1]: https://hubitat.com/ https://hubitat.com/
      - jeanofthedead 6y ago
        There's also Homebridge/HOOBS, if you want to link 3rd-party IoT devices to Apple Homekit. Many of the plugins run locally. Homebridge: https://homebridge.io https://homebridge.io HOOBS: https://hoobs.org https://hoobs.org
- syshum 6y ago
  I have plently of home automation, none of it is controlled with my cell phone. IMO That defeats the purpose of AUTOMATION it should be automated, you have controls in the house that trigger actions, ie a door opens, or a light switch is triggers. If I have to use my phone to control it, I have failed at automation
  - mulmen 6y ago
    For true automation sure but I can think of "IoT" applications where using the phone would be nice. Lighting most of all. I have a small arcade in my basement and the ability to control the lights from my phone would be way better than using the wall switch, mostly because of outlet placement and the fact the switch has to stay on. My living room only has one switched outlet and it is the one closest to the switch. The lights across the room have to be manually controlled. I've done some research into wifi controlled outlets and I have some very old radio controlled ones but I need more. Do you have any suggestions for hackable wifi plugs that do not connect to the internet? Maybe something that connects to a hub? My dream would be something where I can make my own sensors and talk over wifi to outlets that are UL listed, without involving the internet. I'm happy to DIY anything that doesn't interact with mains voltage.
    - syshum 6y ago
      Most of my home automation is Zigbee or Zwave not WiFi, Outlets for the most part are SYLVANIA SMART+ Zigbee/Zwave is controlled via Nortek USB interface connected to a rPI Though I do have a couple of Shelly Devices, and some custom ESP8266 things
      - mulmen 6y ago
        Thanks, I’ll check that out. With Black Friday/Cyber Monday coming up I’m trying to compile a shopping list of good gear.

syshum 6y ago

>>I tend to go with US-based companies because they would legally be liable for damages I am not sure under what legal basis you draw this conclusion given the EULA's and other laws explicitly shield them from said liability you would have to prove intentional malicious intent not simply negligence One of the big problems I have with more US Companies is they are a network of vendor Lock-in proprietary ecosystems that often do not work well together at all. I prefer Open protocols, which sadly seem to be only adopted by non-US Companies.