5 ms·

How are you getting shafted if your individual dataset isn't worth that much?

LatteLazy 6y ago
The only reason I'll pay you a dollar for your data is that I'll make 2 dollars selling you shit you wouldn't have bought otherwise using it. And for me to make 2 dollars, you need to buy 20 dollars worth of shit. Shit you didn't actually want or need.
- jfoster 6y ago
  If I sell my data for a dollar and subsequently ensure I only buy what I need, am I ahead?
  - LatteLazy 6y ago
    That's a fine question. I don't know you. You might well be impervious to advertising. And if so, you'll gain a dollar. But I know the average person is NOT impervious to advertising. Quite the opposite, since ww2 billion dollar companies have risen based entirely on the fact most people are very susceptible to advertising. And every year, advertising gets smarter, more specific, more common, more aggressive, more tailored etc. So you'll have to ask yourself: are you smarter than the average bear? Or rather, are you smarter than Googles billion dollar bear hunting machine designed to catch bears that are too smart to be caught by any other bear catching machine? And are you smarter than it is, even though you gave it all your data for a dollar? And instead of a dollar, you settled for free email and tailored autoprediction to save you typing... Sometimes the smartest thing to do is admit you're not THAT smart. I know I'm not.
  - titzer 6y ago
    The entire reason advertising exists is to subvert your conscious assessment of what you need, and when you do buy something you "need", you buy the right brand. It's just stochastic brainwashing.
  - AshWolfy 6y ago
    what makes you think you are special and able to resist manipulation?
    - jfoster 6y ago
      Not asserting that I am. It was a hypothetical.
- asciident 6y ago
  Very cynical take assuming retail is zero-sum. It could also be helping you find the products you need at an opportune time, increasing the value for all parties. Or based on purchase patterns, they're able to stock inventory more accurately based on predicted purchases, and save on storage and transport.
  - LatteLazy 6y ago
    That's fair. But how much of advertising actually informs you of a new and useful product? Vs how much just tries to upsell you, convince you you want something you didn't want 5 minutes ago, or push brands that add nothing substancice? I know I'm a cynical uni bomber type, I don't expect anyone to 100% agree or for adverts to disappear. But dwhen was the last time an advert actually informed you of a product you didn't know about and would have been interested in buying if it weren't advertised to make it so? Most modern advertising is a less than zero sum game for the consumer.
    - pochamago 6y ago
      I would say yesterday, potentially. Saw an ad for totally watertight running shoes, which was not something I thought existed. Haven't looked into the product enough to buy them, but it's a good bet I will, and they would be of great utility to me.
      - crpatino 6y ago
        How did you keep your feet dry one year ago? How often did you go out running in the rain in the last five years? How much more often would you run in the rain if you had those shoes? If you end up paying $20 extra for the watertight shoes but only end up running 2 or 3 extra hours in the rain and wear the shoes out the normal way... sorry to tell you, but they scammed you plain and simple. If you use the expensive shoes only when raining and keep another pair for regular use... you may get the worth of your money back after several years, but then you have to consider if the opportunity cost of those $100. Did buying that offer was [one of] the best thing you could have done?
      - 6y ago
- bryanrasmussen 6y ago
  It seems highly unlikely you will make your money on selling people things they don't want OR need, I mean you can certainly make money selling things people don't need but that is because they want it. I guess I have at times bought something I did not want or need, but that was because my wife or kids wanted or needed it.
wmf 6y ago
It's an externality. The harm to you and society from being tracked and data-mined is worse than the profit that companies make from that data. Even if they paid you all their profit it's still bad. And in reality they would find a way to pay even less than that.

The only reason I'll pay you a dollar for your data is that I'll make 2 dollars selling you shit you wouldn't have bought otherwise using it. And for me to make 2 dollars, you need to buy 20 dollars worth of shit. Shit you didn't actually want or need.

jfoster 6y ago
If I sell my data for a dollar and subsequently ensure I only buy what I need, am I ahead?
- LatteLazy 6y ago
  That's a fine question. I don't know you. You might well be impervious to advertising. And if so, you'll gain a dollar. But I know the average person is NOT impervious to advertising. Quite the opposite, since ww2 billion dollar companies have risen based entirely on the fact most people are very susceptible to advertising. And every year, advertising gets smarter, more specific, more common, more aggressive, more tailored etc. So you'll have to ask yourself: are you smarter than the average bear? Or rather, are you smarter than Googles billion dollar bear hunting machine designed to catch bears that are too smart to be caught by any other bear catching machine? And are you smarter than it is, even though you gave it all your data for a dollar? And instead of a dollar, you settled for free email and tailored autoprediction to save you typing... Sometimes the smartest thing to do is admit you're not THAT smart. I know I'm not.
- titzer 6y ago
  The entire reason advertising exists is to subvert your conscious assessment of what you need, and when you do buy something you "need", you buy the right brand. It's just stochastic brainwashing.
- AshWolfy 6y ago
  what makes you think you are special and able to resist manipulation?
  - jfoster 6y ago
    Not asserting that I am. It was a hypothetical.
asciident 6y ago
Very cynical take assuming retail is zero-sum. It could also be helping you find the products you need at an opportune time, increasing the value for all parties. Or based on purchase patterns, they're able to stock inventory more accurately based on predicted purchases, and save on storage and transport.
- LatteLazy 6y ago
  That's fair. But how much of advertising actually informs you of a new and useful product? Vs how much just tries to upsell you, convince you you want something you didn't want 5 minutes ago, or push brands that add nothing substancice? I know I'm a cynical uni bomber type, I don't expect anyone to 100% agree or for adverts to disappear. But dwhen was the last time an advert actually informed you of a product you didn't know about and would have been interested in buying if it weren't advertised to make it so? Most modern advertising is a less than zero sum game for the consumer.
  - pochamago 6y ago
    I would say yesterday, potentially. Saw an ad for totally watertight running shoes, which was not something I thought existed. Haven't looked into the product enough to buy them, but it's a good bet I will, and they would be of great utility to me.
    - crpatino 6y ago
      How did you keep your feet dry one year ago? How often did you go out running in the rain in the last five years? How much more often would you run in the rain if you had those shoes? If you end up paying $20 extra for the watertight shoes but only end up running 2 or 3 extra hours in the rain and wear the shoes out the normal way... sorry to tell you, but they scammed you plain and simple. If you use the expensive shoes only when raining and keep another pair for regular use... you may get the worth of your money back after several years, but then you have to consider if the opportunity cost of those $100. Did buying that offer was [one of] the best thing you could have done?
    - 6y ago
bryanrasmussen 6y ago
It seems highly unlikely you will make your money on selling people things they don't want OR need, I mean you can certainly make money selling things people don't need but that is because they want it. I guess I have at times bought something I did not want or need, but that was because my wife or kids wanted or needed it.

wmf 6y ago

It's an externality. The harm to you and society from being tracked and data-mined is worse than the profit that companies make from that data. Even if they paid you all their profit it's still bad. And in reality they would find a way to pay even less than that.