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They are the biggest scam in India capitalizing on FOMO of Indian parents. They charge heaftily (more than $2000) to teach app development (using Scratch, Fireb

They are the biggest scam in India capitalizing on FOMO of Indian parents. They charge heaftily (more than $2000) to teach app development (using Scratch, Firebase etc.). Their staff is poorly paid and just reads off scripts. Their staff doesn't know even the basics of CS (as evidenced in this video: https://youtu.be/1Y21eSn_zSM?t=64 https://youtu.be/1Y21eSn_zSM?t=64, when the student asks how files are stored in Cloud Storage, she says the files are stored in real clouds. There's another where the teacher can't tell the difference between Java and Javascript) Their ads are highly misleading and straight up false with made up names of students who earned millions of dollars in salary while their fellow peers are playing Cricket. (https://in.news.yahoo.com/wolf-gupta-byju-whitehat-jr-090945630.html https://in.news.yahoo.com/wolf-gupta-byju-whitehat-jr-090945...). You can imagine the effect this will have parents (especially in India where parents are known be super competitive). This guy, Pradeep Poonia, has been actively campaigning against them. His youtube channels were taken down, Quora account was taken down, Twitter, even Reddit (if i'm not wrong). His current youtube (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdv4_YNXrIQtGHSVXnY-1mg https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdv4_YNXrIQtGHSVXnY-1mg) has lot of videos on this. He especially has a video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lN1DOE7GoYw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lN1DOE7GoYw) where he accessed their internal slack (shady I know, but even Whitehat Jr is also not playing fair) and showed their organized effort into suppressing online dissent by fake twitter accounts, trolling etc. WhiteHatJr was recently acquired by another firm Byju's (whose CEO is the plaintiff in this lawsuit) that also does the same thing, but for entire school curriculum. In a world, where there is Khan Academy, they sell their subpar product at a very high price, exploiting Indian parents' ignorance and willingness to do anything for their kids education.

timkam 6y ago
Interesting. This reminds me of the story of Siraj Raval, a formerly highly influential YouTuber on machine learning and blockchain topics: https://www.plagiarismtoday.com/2019/10/16/why-siraj-ravals-plagiarism-is-the-future-of-plagiarism/ https://www.plagiarismtoday.com/2019/10/16/why-siraj-ravals-... Some years ago, when I started getting into machine learning, I couldn't tell he is a fraud. Considering that just before he was broadly exposed as a fraudster, he was invited by the European Space Agency (ESA) to give a talk, I was in good company. I think the only reason he got exposed is because he started making stupidly bold claims, attributing high-profile original research to himself. If it weren't for this, he would probably still be accepted by the mainstream because the case a few experts could make against him wouldn't be strong enough. My point is: it is hard to see what is fraud and what isn't. If the ESA can't tell the difference, how can average parents?
- villgax 6y ago
  Not just the ESA, India's most prestigious college IIT-Bombay also fell for him. The roster usually includes folks like Stroustrup, Vint Cerf etc & then a couple years ago 'Siraj Raval' of all the people on earth.
  - avinassh 6y ago
    He also had a course on Udacity (which is now removed) on AI
- nhnews 6y ago
  He's nowadays riding the Covid wave: https://www.sage-health.org/ https://www.sage-health.org/ https://www.sage-health.org/about-us/ https://www.sage-health.org/about-us/
kowlo 6y ago
Sounds terrible. How are his accounts being taken down?
- villgax 6y ago
  Check the reviewer's twitter. He has shared slack threads where the marketing Execs ask the entire channel to brigade & report his tweets/linkedin posts/YouTube videos without any copyrighted content as well. https://twitter.com/whiteHatSnr/ https://twitter.com/whiteHatSnr/
  - kowlo 6y ago
    It's a shame YouTube can't moderate these claims using humans... (A quick sidenote: funny he took the handle "whiteHatSnr")
- ankit219 6y ago
  WhiteHat Jr. abuses the DMCA and copyright policies to take down accounts and content. There was this article [1] where they detailed it really well (its a long article and requires login) > It seems that fairly early on, WhiteHat Jr figured out that it can create temporary nuisance for everyone by reporting their video as a copyright or trademark infringement. Which is why after say, 15-30 days, several of Poonia’s videos were reinstated, after having been taken down. [1] https://themorningcontext.com/indias-whitehatjr-is-startup-hell/ https://themorningcontext.com/indias-whitehatjr-is-startup-h...
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - kkarakk 6y ago
    someone on reddit posted a screenshot of the complete article https://i.imgur.com/LBGtP4f.jpg https://i.imgur.com/LBGtP4f.jpg
    - aydwi 6y ago
      I'm in awe after reading that.
dilawar 6y ago
Primary education and public health us possibly the biggest scam but they would come pretty close. Do they have connections with ruling party?
- villgax 6y ago
  Doesn't seem so, it's just a PR/Legal team with a lot more money & head in the ground attitude towards people seeing through their lies & reporting it.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
chrismorgan 6y ago
> she says the files are stored in real clouds I have fond memories of a visit to a children’s hostel in Hyderabad, India in 2006, and a rote answer they were taught in their textbooks: “Why is a computer called a number cruncher?” “A computer is called a number cruncher because it crunches numbers with its teeth.” Dad took the children to the office where there was a computer and showed them that it had no teeth. I’m glad to say that the children don’t go to that school any more, and that I haven’t found such egregious errors in textbooks for any subject more recently (I’m over there again at present), and there is less rote in their education than there was, though still more than is ideal as it’s hard when the teachers and students are all used to that method.
- sn41 6y ago
  There are well designed, carefully planned and high quality textbooks by NCERT, which is part of the school board. But many students and parents don't prefer them. There is a proliferation of 'cut-to-the-chase' guidebooks (similar to Cliffnotes but much much worse) that they use to cram before the exam. What you describe is very likely one of these.
  - wyldfire 6y ago
    Why would they include content that is so obviously false in a guidebook? Certainly the book's author didn't believe it to be the case.
    - sn41 6y ago
      Guidebooks are written by ill-qualified peoplewho are just out for a buck. The questions are usually from recent question papers. So the guidebook author just makes stuff up for the answers. Ignorance is quite refreshing, if not actually bliss.
      - wolco2 6y ago
        Purchased by lazy students or meddling parents out to buy a product to give them/their kid an edge over other kids by breaking the rules. Scammmers get scammed.
johnx123-up 6y ago
FWIW. Since you've mentioned Byju's... my Indian friend here informed me that they have a nexus with the Google Playstore team too and bypassing all Playstore policies. For instance, they release a free app without any in-app purchase; but after some time, they'll lock the app and will call the parents to pay 50k rupees.
- robk 6y ago
  As in googlers are complicit??
  - kkarakk 6y ago
    yup, BYJU is getting CRAZY amounts of support in India and no major newspaper questions their claims. there are a lot of conspiracy theories about why it is so - some people say it is coz they have political support
    - fakedang 6y ago
      Isn't Shah Rukh Khan an investor too in Byju's? Edit: just a brand ambassador. He's still complicit in misleading millions of Indian kids. Edit2: the techcrunch article shows a picture of Karan Bajaj (WhiteHatJr founder) with Baba Ramdev, so it's very possible that they have political backing. I'll take the Chinese Baijiu over Byju's any day.
      - eunos 6y ago
        Pretty sure that Shah Rukh Khan doesn't really understand it beyond "it's an emerging edtech"
        fakedang 6y ago
        Yeah, and that kind of brand unawareness from ambassadors should not be tolerated.
      - aravindputrevu 6y ago
higerordermap 6y ago
Yeah I am from India. I think we could have guessed this is the ultimate stage of IIT JEE rat race that's getting more and more aggressive over some years. While I don't subscribe to all ideologies of socialism, I can only think of free high-quality education by government as a solution to this aggressive game-the-system and FOMO mentality so deep rooted here. For context I studied in Rural Governement schools till 10th and even after that I didn't have to pay 20% of what an average Urban "Middle class" peer pays for education. The education quality is not much different. Only when I had to study engineering I came across stupid expensive not-worth-the-cost education.
- sn41 6y ago
  A lot of the stress associated with IIT JEE stems from aggressive fear based propaganda by coaching classes. Things were much more laid back in the 90s, pre-Kota mania. Fear sells. They make it sound as though if you are not in an IIT, your life will be a flaming wreck. This is far from the case, even if you confine yourself to the tech sector.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- alex_smart 6y ago
  >I can only think of free high-quality education by government as a solution to this aggressive game-the-system and FOMO mentality so deep rooted here. I am also from India and I am really perplexed and pained by this. Why is it not possible to have a genuine business catering to the same market but with actually good content and trained teachers? If nothing else, WhiteHat Jr has demonstrated that there IS a market and people are willing to pay for educational content. A genuine company might take more time to succeed, but they will eventually win the war, right? Why are we perennially doomed to be stuck with either scammy companies like these or the mai-baap government doing everything under the sun? The free market seems to be able to solve these problems in other countries. What makes India so unique?
dfrtgaswiokhtbz 6y ago
hi
known 6y ago
https://www.quora.com/Which-caste-is-looting-India/answers/220938900 https://www.quora.com/Which-caste-is-looting-India/answers/2... has complete list of all scams in India

timkam 6y ago

Interesting. This reminds me of the story of Siraj Raval, a formerly highly influential YouTuber on machine learning and blockchain topics: https://www.plagiarismtoday.com/2019/10/16/why-siraj-ravals-plagiarism-is-the-future-of-plagiarism/ https://www.plagiarismtoday.com/2019/10/16/why-siraj-ravals-... Some years ago, when I started getting into machine learning, I couldn't tell he is a fraud. Considering that just before he was broadly exposed as a fraudster, he was invited by the European Space Agency (ESA) to give a talk, I was in good company. I think the only reason he got exposed is because he started making stupidly bold claims, attributing high-profile original research to himself. If it weren't for this, he would probably still be accepted by the mainstream because the case a few experts could make against him wouldn't be strong enough. My point is: it is hard to see what is fraud and what isn't. If the ESA can't tell the difference, how can average parents?

villgax 6y ago
Not just the ESA, India's most prestigious college IIT-Bombay also fell for him. The roster usually includes folks like Stroustrup, Vint Cerf etc & then a couple years ago 'Siraj Raval' of all the people on earth.
- avinassh 6y ago
  He also had a course on Udacity (which is now removed) on AI
nhnews 6y ago
He's nowadays riding the Covid wave: https://www.sage-health.org/ https://www.sage-health.org/ https://www.sage-health.org/about-us/ https://www.sage-health.org/about-us/

kowlo 6y ago

Sounds terrible. How are his accounts being taken down?

villgax 6y ago
Check the reviewer's twitter. He has shared slack threads where the marketing Execs ask the entire channel to brigade & report his tweets/linkedin posts/YouTube videos without any copyrighted content as well. https://twitter.com/whiteHatSnr/ https://twitter.com/whiteHatSnr/
- kowlo 6y ago
  It's a shame YouTube can't moderate these claims using humans... (A quick sidenote: funny he took the handle "whiteHatSnr")
ankit219 6y ago
WhiteHat Jr. abuses the DMCA and copyright policies to take down accounts and content. There was this article [1] where they detailed it really well (its a long article and requires login) > It seems that fairly early on, WhiteHat Jr figured out that it can create temporary nuisance for everyone by reporting their video as a copyright or trademark infringement. Which is why after say, 15-30 days, several of Poonia’s videos were reinstated, after having been taken down. [1] https://themorningcontext.com/indias-whitehatjr-is-startup-hell/ https://themorningcontext.com/indias-whitehatjr-is-startup-h...
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- kkarakk 6y ago
  someone on reddit posted a screenshot of the complete article https://i.imgur.com/LBGtP4f.jpg https://i.imgur.com/LBGtP4f.jpg
  - aydwi 6y ago
    I'm in awe after reading that.

dilawar 6y ago

Primary education and public health us possibly the biggest scam but they would come pretty close. Do they have connections with ruling party?

villgax 6y ago
Doesn't seem so, it's just a PR/Legal team with a lot more money & head in the ground attitude towards people seeing through their lies & reporting it.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

chrismorgan 6y ago

> she says the files are stored in real clouds I have fond memories of a visit to a children’s hostel in Hyderabad, India in 2006, and a rote answer they were taught in their textbooks: “Why is a computer called a number cruncher?” “A computer is called a number cruncher because it crunches numbers with its teeth.” Dad took the children to the office where there was a computer and showed them that it had no teeth. I’m glad to say that the children don’t go to that school any more, and that I haven’t found such egregious errors in textbooks for any subject more recently (I’m over there again at present), and there is less rote in their education than there was, though still more than is ideal as it’s hard when the teachers and students are all used to that method.

sn41 6y ago
There are well designed, carefully planned and high quality textbooks by NCERT, which is part of the school board. But many students and parents don't prefer them. There is a proliferation of 'cut-to-the-chase' guidebooks (similar to Cliffnotes but much much worse) that they use to cram before the exam. What you describe is very likely one of these.
- wyldfire 6y ago
  Why would they include content that is so obviously false in a guidebook? Certainly the book's author didn't believe it to be the case.
  - sn41 6y ago
    Guidebooks are written by ill-qualified peoplewho are just out for a buck. The questions are usually from recent question papers. So the guidebook author just makes stuff up for the answers. Ignorance is quite refreshing, if not actually bliss.
    - wolco2 6y ago
      Purchased by lazy students or meddling parents out to buy a product to give them/their kid an edge over other kids by breaking the rules. Scammmers get scammed.

johnx123-up 6y ago

FWIW. Since you've mentioned Byju's... my Indian friend here informed me that they have a nexus with the Google Playstore team too and bypassing all Playstore policies. For instance, they release a free app without any in-app purchase; but after some time, they'll lock the app and will call the parents to pay 50k rupees.

robk 6y ago
As in googlers are complicit??
- kkarakk 6y ago
  yup, BYJU is getting CRAZY amounts of support in India and no major newspaper questions their claims. there are a lot of conspiracy theories about why it is so - some people say it is coz they have political support
  - fakedang 6y ago
    Isn't Shah Rukh Khan an investor too in Byju's? Edit: just a brand ambassador. He's still complicit in misleading millions of Indian kids. Edit2: the techcrunch article shows a picture of Karan Bajaj (WhiteHatJr founder) with Baba Ramdev, so it's very possible that they have political backing. I'll take the Chinese Baijiu over Byju's any day.
    - eunos 6y ago
      Pretty sure that Shah Rukh Khan doesn't really understand it beyond "it's an emerging edtech"
      - fakedang 6y ago
        Yeah, and that kind of brand unawareness from ambassadors should not be tolerated.
    - aravindputrevu 6y ago

higerordermap 6y ago

Yeah I am from India. I think we could have guessed this is the ultimate stage of IIT JEE rat race that's getting more and more aggressive over some years. While I don't subscribe to all ideologies of socialism, I can only think of free high-quality education by government as a solution to this aggressive game-the-system and FOMO mentality so deep rooted here. For context I studied in Rural Governement schools till 10th and even after that I didn't have to pay 20% of what an average Urban "Middle class" peer pays for education. The education quality is not much different. Only when I had to study engineering I came across stupid expensive not-worth-the-cost education.

sn41 6y ago
A lot of the stress associated with IIT JEE stems from aggressive fear based propaganda by coaching classes. Things were much more laid back in the 90s, pre-Kota mania. Fear sells. They make it sound as though if you are not in an IIT, your life will be a flaming wreck. This is far from the case, even if you confine yourself to the tech sector.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
alex_smart 6y ago
>I can only think of free high-quality education by government as a solution to this aggressive game-the-system and FOMO mentality so deep rooted here. I am also from India and I am really perplexed and pained by this. Why is it not possible to have a genuine business catering to the same market but with actually good content and trained teachers? If nothing else, WhiteHat Jr has demonstrated that there IS a market and people are willing to pay for educational content. A genuine company might take more time to succeed, but they will eventually win the war, right? Why are we perennially doomed to be stuck with either scammy companies like these or the mai-baap government doing everything under the sun? The free market seems to be able to solve these problems in other countries. What makes India so unique?

dfrtgaswiokhtbz 6y ago

known 6y ago

https://www.quora.com/Which-caste-is-looting-India/answers/220938900 https://www.quora.com/Which-caste-is-looting-India/answers/2... has complete list of all scams in India