6 ms·

I truly believe that the argument for switching to Linux has never been stronger. Windows has embedded bloatware, and Apple allows no control over your hardware

by johnmaguire2013 6y ago

I truly believe that the argument for switching to Linux has never been stronger. Windows has embedded bloatware, and Apple allows no control over your hardware. There's really no other option if you care about these things. (Full disclosure - I do own a Macbook for photography work, and use Bootcamp for gaming.) Like you, my Linux installs have been incredibly stable for a long time, even with a rolling release distro which is often considered "unstable." I use Linux at work, and while I struggle with a few tools others do not as regularly (e.g. video teleconferencing software isn't always optimized for Linux, but overall it works fine), I also don't encounter tons of errors they do. From Apple updates bricking machines, to obscure Bluetooth/Wifi issues that you can't fix, or having to run Docker in a VM, I'm pretty convinced I've got it better.

iaw 6y ago
I have a 2014 Macbook Air that I'm about to replace the battery in. Once that thing goes I really think I'll have to head over to Linux. Mac quality has gone downhill.
- jdhawk 6y ago
  I run linux on a Macbook Air 4,2 (2011) and its pretty nice.
  - 1-6 6y ago
    When people start buying nice laptops just for Linux, the experience is a lot better. Most of the time, I've put Linux on scrap-heap computers which has always flavored my Ubuntu experience. Laptops with $300 Celerons with TN panels will always make Linux look subpar.
  - WanderPanda 6y ago
    I am going strong on a 2012 MBA, but I guess I will soon update to the M1 Air/Pro
- cgriswald 6y ago
  I replaced my MBP with a Dell XPS running Ubuntu. I had serious problems with the Killer wifi card but replaced it with an Intel one for $20. Otherwise everything worked perfectly. Around the same time my Mac Pro refused to upgrade to the latest version of macOS because I had a RAID. I installed Ubuntu on that as well. I was a little worried because it has multiple monitors but that was handled really well and worked fine out of the box. I did the same for the family iMac. Haven’t looked back.
rhinoceraptor 6y ago
I've been using Linux for many years, and it's definitely better, but definitely not what I'd want to use seriously. My gaming desktop has a 20.04 drive which I occasionally use, and yet I still find myself dropping to a TTY occasionally to reboot the machine or restart gdm because it waking from sleep, or just plain crashes. Also, I have 4k, 28" monitors which is just the size where 1x is comically small, and 2x is comically large. I've tried recent Gnome and KDE, and they just can't scale to look right, like what I can do in MacOS or even Windows. If I couldn't use MacOS for work, I would give Windows 10 a serious consideration. The new WSL and Windows Terminal are very good. I did use WSL 1 for a few years at a previous job, and it was awful.
- vlod 6y ago
  Doesn't Ubuntu support fractional scaling? That doesn't work for you?
  - input_sh 6y ago
    Yeah, but only since recently (version 20.04), and it's still considered to be experimental as far as I know.
    - singlow 6y ago
      I've been using 28" 4k screens since ubuntu 17.04. No scaling issues since 18.04
  - sz4kerto 6y ago
    It's really slow. Really interestingly I've been using a Windows, a Linux and a MacOS machine for many months, swapping them often. Well, Windows/Linux are on the same Ryzen 2700X with a Geforce 1080Ti, the Mac is a 2018 Mini with 32G RAM and 6 core i5. 4k 32" display in each case. What surprised me: - Windows UI is WAY the fastest. Linux is the slowest, and with fractional scaling turned off its hardly tolerable - the font rendering on Windows is perfect, while MacOS is a bit blurry. This is very surprising to me since all the hype around the good scaling of MacOS. Windows hidpi fonts are just perfectly sharp. - MacOS is absolutely consistent when it comes to rendering and scaling, the others aren't
fossuser 6y ago
Linux on a desktop is okay, linux on a laptop is bad. I think Linux is cool and grew up playing with different distributions (starting around Fedora Core 4). I spent most of my time on Ubuntu because it worked the best, but also used Yellow Dog Linux (my first laptop was a 12in Apple power pc powerbook g4), Arch, and some others. Things that often gave me issues: - Suspend rarely worked without hacks, even with hacks laptop would often wake and heat up to thermal shutdown in backpack. Hibernate was similarly bad. - 'Normal' apps often didn't work or worked poorly (Netflix, flash, Spotify, 1Password), things are a lot better on this front now. - Monitor support was typically bad and caused problems, connecting to monitor, multiple monitors, resolution issues on wake, etc. - WiFi was often a hassle and either wouldn't work without hacks or would stop working for an unknown reason. - Sound would stop working for unknown reasons. - Bad anti-aliasing/font support in general. - Personally I thought the UI (mostly gnome, then unity) felt slow and UI elements/chrome often took up a ton of visual space - in general things were uglier. I think a lot of this stuff is better now, but I recently went to install ubuntu on an SSD in my desktop and had to spend a few hours trying to figure out why ubuntu refused to see the SSD in the installer. I eventually had to unplug the HDD to force it to recognize it. The macOS vertical integration of hardware and software is really good. I think the touchbar is a mistake (and hopefully will go away like the butterfly keyboard did), but the OS works well, battery life is good, and the applications are nice. I don't think Linux can compete for personal use, for most people macOS or Windows with WSL is a better experience. This is definitely true on laptops. On desktops I think linux has fewer negatives, but I'd still miss macOS ecosystem stuff (imessage/texting from laptop, things like that).
- fsflover 6y ago
  All your problems seem to come from the unsupported hardware. Consider a laptop with preinstalled Linux.
  - _emacsomancer_ 6y ago
    Or a ThinkPad.
    - 6y ago
sleepydog 6y ago
I agree. I've been using Linux for almost 20 years now, and I remember all the gymnastics and research that was required to get things like audio and wifi working. In 2020, the only reason I dual boot windows and Linux is for video games, which are becoming less and less important to me, and less of an issue with the work Valve is doing. And, while Linux has gotten considerably more stable and hassle-free, at the same time, Windows, in my experience, has gotten _worse_. The start menu is slow, and makes network requests for some reason. The UI is so flat that I can't tell anything apart, and I'm frequently pestered to link my install with my Microsoft account or enable cortana. I wish I could have used Windows 7 forever :\
- Sunspark 6y ago
  Why can't you? I'm writing this from Windows 7 as we speak. I also have 10 installed on this PC. I prefer 7. I have SMB1 and RDP turned off, I'm not really worried it'll get owned through my router either. I don't use anti-virus either, but then again, I also don't run random exes that arrive in email or through an ad.
  - rovr138 6y ago
    They literally say why on their post.
    - Sunspark 6y ago
      No, what is listed are the concerns they have with W10 but they don't say what is preventing them from using W7 if they really want to.
      - rovr138 6y ago
        >I wish I could have used Windows 7 forever :\ Probably the fact it's an unsupported OS, https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-7-end-of-life-support-information https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-7-end-of-lif... As of January 14, 2020, your computer running Windows 7 will still function but Microsoft will no longer provide the following: Technical support for any issues Software updates Security updates or fixes

iaw 6y ago

I have a 2014 Macbook Air that I'm about to replace the battery in. Once that thing goes I really think I'll have to head over to Linux. Mac quality has gone downhill.

jdhawk 6y ago
I run linux on a Macbook Air 4,2 (2011) and its pretty nice.
- 1-6 6y ago
  When people start buying nice laptops just for Linux, the experience is a lot better. Most of the time, I've put Linux on scrap-heap computers which has always flavored my Ubuntu experience. Laptops with $300 Celerons with TN panels will always make Linux look subpar.
- WanderPanda 6y ago
  I am going strong on a 2012 MBA, but I guess I will soon update to the M1 Air/Pro
cgriswald 6y ago
I replaced my MBP with a Dell XPS running Ubuntu. I had serious problems with the Killer wifi card but replaced it with an Intel one for $20. Otherwise everything worked perfectly. Around the same time my Mac Pro refused to upgrade to the latest version of macOS because I had a RAID. I installed Ubuntu on that as well. I was a little worried because it has multiple monitors but that was handled really well and worked fine out of the box. I did the same for the family iMac. Haven’t looked back.

rhinoceraptor 6y ago

I've been using Linux for many years, and it's definitely better, but definitely not what I'd want to use seriously. My gaming desktop has a 20.04 drive which I occasionally use, and yet I still find myself dropping to a TTY occasionally to reboot the machine or restart gdm because it waking from sleep, or just plain crashes. Also, I have 4k, 28" monitors which is just the size where 1x is comically small, and 2x is comically large. I've tried recent Gnome and KDE, and they just can't scale to look right, like what I can do in MacOS or even Windows. If I couldn't use MacOS for work, I would give Windows 10 a serious consideration. The new WSL and Windows Terminal are very good. I did use WSL 1 for a few years at a previous job, and it was awful.

vlod 6y ago
Doesn't Ubuntu support fractional scaling? That doesn't work for you?
- input_sh 6y ago
  Yeah, but only since recently (version 20.04), and it's still considered to be experimental as far as I know.
  - singlow 6y ago
    I've been using 28" 4k screens since ubuntu 17.04. No scaling issues since 18.04
- sz4kerto 6y ago
  It's really slow. Really interestingly I've been using a Windows, a Linux and a MacOS machine for many months, swapping them often. Well, Windows/Linux are on the same Ryzen 2700X with a Geforce 1080Ti, the Mac is a 2018 Mini with 32G RAM and 6 core i5. 4k 32" display in each case. What surprised me: - Windows UI is WAY the fastest. Linux is the slowest, and with fractional scaling turned off its hardly tolerable - the font rendering on Windows is perfect, while MacOS is a bit blurry. This is very surprising to me since all the hype around the good scaling of MacOS. Windows hidpi fonts are just perfectly sharp. - MacOS is absolutely consistent when it comes to rendering and scaling, the others aren't

fossuser 6y ago

Linux on a desktop is okay, linux on a laptop is bad. I think Linux is cool and grew up playing with different distributions (starting around Fedora Core 4). I spent most of my time on Ubuntu because it worked the best, but also used Yellow Dog Linux (my first laptop was a 12in Apple power pc powerbook g4), Arch, and some others. Things that often gave me issues: - Suspend rarely worked without hacks, even with hacks laptop would often wake and heat up to thermal shutdown in backpack. Hibernate was similarly bad. - 'Normal' apps often didn't work or worked poorly (Netflix, flash, Spotify, 1Password), things are a lot better on this front now. - Monitor support was typically bad and caused problems, connecting to monitor, multiple monitors, resolution issues on wake, etc. - WiFi was often a hassle and either wouldn't work without hacks or would stop working for an unknown reason. - Sound would stop working for unknown reasons. - Bad anti-aliasing/font support in general. - Personally I thought the UI (mostly gnome, then unity) felt slow and UI elements/chrome often took up a ton of visual space - in general things were uglier. I think a lot of this stuff is better now, but I recently went to install ubuntu on an SSD in my desktop and had to spend a few hours trying to figure out why ubuntu refused to see the SSD in the installer. I eventually had to unplug the HDD to force it to recognize it. The macOS vertical integration of hardware and software is really good. I think the touchbar is a mistake (and hopefully will go away like the butterfly keyboard did), but the OS works well, battery life is good, and the applications are nice. I don't think Linux can compete for personal use, for most people macOS or Windows with WSL is a better experience. This is definitely true on laptops. On desktops I think linux has fewer negatives, but I'd still miss macOS ecosystem stuff (imessage/texting from laptop, things like that).

fsflover 6y ago
All your problems seem to come from the unsupported hardware. Consider a laptop with preinstalled Linux.
- _emacsomancer_ 6y ago
  Or a ThinkPad.
  - 6y ago

sleepydog 6y ago

I agree. I've been using Linux for almost 20 years now, and I remember all the gymnastics and research that was required to get things like audio and wifi working. In 2020, the only reason I dual boot windows and Linux is for video games, which are becoming less and less important to me, and less of an issue with the work Valve is doing. And, while Linux has gotten considerably more stable and hassle-free, at the same time, Windows, in my experience, has gotten _worse_. The start menu is slow, and makes network requests for some reason. The UI is so flat that I can't tell anything apart, and I'm frequently pestered to link my install with my Microsoft account or enable cortana. I wish I could have used Windows 7 forever :\

Sunspark 6y ago
Why can't you? I'm writing this from Windows 7 as we speak. I also have 10 installed on this PC. I prefer 7. I have SMB1 and RDP turned off, I'm not really worried it'll get owned through my router either. I don't use anti-virus either, but then again, I also don't run random exes that arrive in email or through an ad.
- rovr138 6y ago
  They literally say why on their post.
  - Sunspark 6y ago
    No, what is listed are the concerns they have with W10 but they don't say what is preventing them from using W7 if they really want to.
    - rovr138 6y ago
      >I wish I could have used Windows 7 forever :\ Probably the fact it's an unsupported OS, https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-7-end-of-life-support-information https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-7-end-of-lif... As of January 14, 2020, your computer running Windows 7 will still function but Microsoft will no longer provide the following: Technical support for any issues Software updates Security updates or fixes