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This absolutely improves the situation for a lot of indie developers, but praising Apple for it is short-term thinking. It's a strategic move, and it's not cyni

by lux 6y ago

This absolutely improves the situation for a lot of indie developers, but praising Apple for it is short-term thinking. It's a strategic move, and it's not cynical to recognize that.

ogre_codes 6y ago
> praising Apple for it is short-term thinking. Praising Apple for doing the right thing for small developers is not "Short Term thinking". It's a good first step, It should be recognized as such. There is a lot of room for improvement, but whining about something that puts millions of dollars in the pockets of indie developers is just not cool.
- zamadatix 6y ago
  Something can be better than it was before and still not be good enough. There is no need to cast things in a single light.
- mchusma 6y ago
  The issue is they are trying to make 15% seem reasonable. 1.5% is unreasonable. They provide developers negative value, it's just a tax on all transactions.
  - imtringued 6y ago
    They only have to shut up whiny tech giants complaining about the cut. This thing started with greed and will end with greed. Small developers and users don't matter.
  - ogre_codes 6y ago
    Last I checked, 15% is closer to zero than 30% so it's objectively better. Nobody is saying it's perfect or that there isn't a lot of room for improvement.
    - bogwog 6y ago
      Yet the fact remains that what they’re doing is still not good. It’s a bad thing. Them taking a 15% cut for no reason other than they can is bad, and evil. The reason people shouldn’t be praising them for loosening their iron grip ever so slightly is because they are currently in the midst of the most antitrust scrutiny they’ve ever had to worry about. With that context, this 15% reduction is clearly nothing more than an underhanded deflection tactic. The legal system is the only thing that’s going to help “indie” developers. Apple themselves are not going to do it. They’ve shown nothing but more and more disdain towards competition over these past 10 years, and the only time that has started to change is when an actual legal threat appeared. I don’t even know why I bother writing this, since it’s all obvious. And even though it’s obvious, some people continue to ignore it and come up with excuses for this company for some reason. I don’t know what that reason is, but I doubt logical arguments are going to make a difference. Hopefully the courts aren't the same way.
      - ogre_codes 6y ago
        Can we at least agree that this is 50% less bad. Or perhaps 25% less bad? 10%? Ultimately the impression I get from posts like yours is some people just think whatever Apple does is bad regardless of how it affects others.
        bogwog 6y ago
        > Can we at least agree that this is 50% less bad. Or perhaps 25% less bad? 10%? No, because as has been said many times already, it's a deflection tactic. Focusing on whether 15% is less bad than 30% is a bad thing to do because it accomplishes exactly what Apple's underhanded deflection tactic seeks to accomplish. But if you really need that addressed, here's a response to your very important question: no, 15% is not less bad than 30% because it means Apple makes less money, and if Apple makes less money they might have to abandon their fancy new M1 chips, and the pace of technological progress will once again fall into stagnation. Sure, small devs will make some more money, but those small devs aren't giving the world shiny toys with rounded corners. > Ultimately the impression I get from posts like yours is some people just think whatever Apple does is bad regardless of how it affects others. So if Apple releases a cure for cancer, you get the impression that I'll think that's bad? What is even the point of you writing this, is it an argument? Are you trying to passive-aggressively call me something negative? How does this even relate to the discussion?
  - ghostwriter 6y ago
    start protesting and abolish VAT in your state, it's a major tax on all transactions that you have to pay even before entering the app store.
- hrktb 6y ago
  You have a point, but we can't ignore they are showing good will while being sued for abusive behaviour. Sure it's a step in the right direction, but it's much alike a kid giving his snack to one of his siblings when caught racketing their lunch money.

by lux 6y ago

This absolutely improves the situation for a lot of indie developers, but praising Apple for it is short-term thinking. It's a strategic move, and it's not cynical to recognize that.

ogre_codes 6y ago

> praising Apple for it is short-term thinking. Praising Apple for doing the right thing for small developers is not "Short Term thinking". It's a good first step, It should be recognized as such. There is a lot of room for improvement, but whining about something that puts millions of dollars in the pockets of indie developers is just not cool.

zamadatix 6y ago
Something can be better than it was before and still not be good enough. There is no need to cast things in a single light.
mchusma 6y ago
The issue is they are trying to make 15% seem reasonable. 1.5% is unreasonable. They provide developers negative value, it's just a tax on all transactions.
- imtringued 6y ago
  They only have to shut up whiny tech giants complaining about the cut. This thing started with greed and will end with greed. Small developers and users don't matter.
- ogre_codes 6y ago
  Last I checked, 15% is closer to zero than 30% so it's objectively better. Nobody is saying it's perfect or that there isn't a lot of room for improvement.
  - bogwog 6y ago
    Yet the fact remains that what they’re doing is still not good. It’s a bad thing. Them taking a 15% cut for no reason other than they can is bad, and evil. The reason people shouldn’t be praising them for loosening their iron grip ever so slightly is because they are currently in the midst of the most antitrust scrutiny they’ve ever had to worry about. With that context, this 15% reduction is clearly nothing more than an underhanded deflection tactic. The legal system is the only thing that’s going to help “indie” developers. Apple themselves are not going to do it. They’ve shown nothing but more and more disdain towards competition over these past 10 years, and the only time that has started to change is when an actual legal threat appeared. I don’t even know why I bother writing this, since it’s all obvious. And even though it’s obvious, some people continue to ignore it and come up with excuses for this company for some reason. I don’t know what that reason is, but I doubt logical arguments are going to make a difference. Hopefully the courts aren't the same way.
    - ogre_codes 6y ago
      Can we at least agree that this is 50% less bad. Or perhaps 25% less bad? 10%? Ultimately the impression I get from posts like yours is some people just think whatever Apple does is bad regardless of how it affects others.
      - bogwog 6y ago
        > Can we at least agree that this is 50% less bad. Or perhaps 25% less bad? 10%? No, because as has been said many times already, it's a deflection tactic. Focusing on whether 15% is less bad than 30% is a bad thing to do because it accomplishes exactly what Apple's underhanded deflection tactic seeks to accomplish. But if you really need that addressed, here's a response to your very important question: no, 15% is not less bad than 30% because it means Apple makes less money, and if Apple makes less money they might have to abandon their fancy new M1 chips, and the pace of technological progress will once again fall into stagnation. Sure, small devs will make some more money, but those small devs aren't giving the world shiny toys with rounded corners. > Ultimately the impression I get from posts like yours is some people just think whatever Apple does is bad regardless of how it affects others. So if Apple releases a cure for cancer, you get the impression that I'll think that's bad? What is even the point of you writing this, is it an argument? Are you trying to passive-aggressively call me something negative? How does this even relate to the discussion?
- ghostwriter 6y ago
  start protesting and abolish VAT in your state, it's a major tax on all transactions that you have to pay even before entering the app store.
hrktb 6y ago
You have a point, but we can't ignore they are showing good will while being sued for abusive behaviour. Sure it's a step in the right direction, but it's much alike a kid giving his snack to one of his siblings when caught racketing their lunch money.