7 ms·

I can choose to drop Google any second. Dropping the EU government, on the other hand... Also, the EU has failed to produce any viable alternative to Google mo

by eznzt 6y ago

I can choose to drop Google any second. Dropping the EU government, on the other hand... Also, the EU has failed to produce any viable alternative to Google mostly because of our shitty laws. Let's not pretend the hegemony of Google is some kind of imperialism that was forced on us.

krzyk 6y ago
> I can choose to drop Google any second. Good luck with that, Google is everywhere (search, maps, mobile phones, and many more). You have to make a lot of effort to avoid it. It is far easier to drop EU government because elections happen every few years. In case of Google you don't have elections (or maybe you have, but it is shareholder voting, so more like plutocracy).
- emteycz 6y ago
  You don't have to make any effort to avoid it. Picking up your phone is effort you're making to meet it, simply stop doing that.
- zepto 6y ago
  You can switch to Bing or DDG in less than one second. Good luck doing that with the EU.
  - krzyk 6y ago
    Try searching in bing for movie trailers or for other videos (e. g. home workout) how many results will be for YouTube? And you still think there is no effort? I can move out of EU or vote to change it. I don't have that power with Google.
    - zepto 6y ago
      You are seriously saying it’s easier to move out of the EU or to replace the EU government, than it is not to use Google?
      - krzyk 6y ago
        Yes it is. Have you tried e.g. for a week to never use ANY service that is from Google? Normally people thing it is just search, but search is just the tip of the iceberg. In case of EU, you just need to wait max 5 years for next elections and you can have your input by voting (in case of Google you can send your input to /dev/null of their automated "customer service"). Would you be able to avoid (just for one week): - google analytics, - GCP (this one is hard), - youtube, - google dns servers, - android without any google services (or just iOS, this one might be easier if you already have iPhone, but for majority of people it is not easy), - adwords/adsense - fonts - translate - pay (again, easier of you are iPhone user) - photos - maps - charts (you can have link to those on web pages) - chrome - gmail (if you don't have account there then it is easy, if you have - it is almost impossible to change your email address everywhere) And also imagine a person that is an "average Joe", has cheap Android phone, uses Chrome without any ad blocking and has email account in gmail. Would it be easy for him? Or would it be easier to go voting? Or find a job in neighboring country that doesn't belong to EU (e.g. Switzerland or Norway, not sure if UK counts right now) ?
        zepto 6y ago
        Well if you are going to say he has to use a cheap Android phone and a gmail account, then obviously he can’t avoid Google, but that’s not much of an argument. Nobody is really restricted in that way. It’s obviously much easier to buy an iPhone and install an ad-blocker than it is to get a new job in Switzerland or Norway if you don’t already live there. Have you actually looked at at what it takes to emigrate to Switzerland? As for your list, of course you can’t stop other people from using Google. We’re talking about not using Google yourself.
        krzyk 6y ago
        The move to different country is one time deal. Avoiding Google for the rest of your life is a constant job. I didn't say that the "Joe" has to use cheap Android phone and gmail account. I just said that he has one already because one is cheap and the other is free. So imagine that he used both for several years. And now he can change that, but is it easy? Buying iPhone is easy (not cheap, but moving out is also not cheap), but changing your email address in zillion places is next to impossible.
mfer 6y ago
Most people can’t drop google at any time. They can’t afford buying a new phone, buying a new computer (all those chrome book users), and everything else. Being able to transition off google has become a privilege that’s especially difficult on low income folks.
- bluecalm 6y ago
  You're forgetting a privilege to have a cheap phone, free maps, free decent email provider, cheap usable computer etc. It's possible thanks to Google. Of course it's costly to transition the same way it would be costly to get those services if Google wasn't around.
  - josefx 6y ago
    > cheap phone Had one before android existed. > free decent email provider, Still use the same I used before gmail was a thing. > cheap usable computer etc I cannot comprehend from what kind of twisted alternate reality this claim hails. Or did you simply forget to mark your sarcasm with /s ?
    - bluecalm 6y ago
      Then you can use those options as Google didn't exist. The thing is the quality is so much better thanks to them people choose the products. The phone you had before Android wouldn't fulfill a purpose people buy phones these days. If you don't remember how much better Gmail was than email providers back in the day I don't know what to tell you.
- emteycz 6y ago
  A phone or a computer is not a basic human need. But even then, maybe let's use the EU to provide open phones instead of destroying the only thing available?
  - dredmorbius 6y ago
    "U.N. Report Declares Internet Access a Human Right" https://www.wired.com/2011/06/internet-a-human-right/ https://www.wired.com/2011/06/internet-a-human-right/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_Internet_access https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_Internet_access
rodion_89 6y ago
> I can choose to drop Google any second > failed to produce any viable alternative to Google These two statements seem to be in conflict
- eznzt 6y ago
  In what way? You can use duckduckgo, iOS, etc. The EU has failed to produce a good search engine and a good mobile operating system.
raverbashing 6y ago
Talk about hyperbolic comparisons and nonsense excuses In which country of the world can you "choose to drop your government any second"? Though feel free to drop Google, if you can
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
megous 6y ago
There are a ton of better/worse alternatives to various google products. Aside from networking effects, noone needs to use google at all, right now.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
prepend 6y ago
You cannot operate on the internet and drop google. This isn’t possible because you live in an interconnected world. Unless you’re a hermit who disconnects entirely from the web, you can’t drop them. You may cancel all your accounts, but you’ll still visit sites that use google analytics, interact with hosts that use Google’s registrars for their domain names, be profiled by google and included in targeted advertising by web sites that you don’t even know. You’ll also be impacted by the incentives google puts on content creators through their de facto standards of chrome, web video, drm, etc. I’d say it’s easier to drop the EU than Google. You can move to Britain or elsewhere and escape EU laws. You can’t go anywhere on the internet to escape Google’s laws.
whalabi 6y ago
> I can choose to drop Google any second This is true, bit misses the point. The point is that through whatever means, but including cheating, Google has become incredibly, obscenely powerful. And one of the many reasons that is undesirable is the aforementioned cheating.

by eznzt 6y ago

krzyk 6y ago

> I can choose to drop Google any second. Good luck with that, Google is everywhere (search, maps, mobile phones, and many more). You have to make a lot of effort to avoid it. It is far easier to drop EU government because elections happen every few years. In case of Google you don't have elections (or maybe you have, but it is shareholder voting, so more like plutocracy).

emteycz 6y ago
You don't have to make any effort to avoid it. Picking up your phone is effort you're making to meet it, simply stop doing that.
zepto 6y ago
You can switch to Bing or DDG in less than one second. Good luck doing that with the EU.
- krzyk 6y ago
  Try searching in bing for movie trailers or for other videos (e. g. home workout) how many results will be for YouTube? And you still think there is no effort? I can move out of EU or vote to change it. I don't have that power with Google.
  - zepto 6y ago
    You are seriously saying it’s easier to move out of the EU or to replace the EU government, than it is not to use Google?
    - krzyk 6y ago
      Yes it is. Have you tried e.g. for a week to never use ANY service that is from Google? Normally people thing it is just search, but search is just the tip of the iceberg. In case of EU, you just need to wait max 5 years for next elections and you can have your input by voting (in case of Google you can send your input to /dev/null of their automated "customer service"). Would you be able to avoid (just for one week): - google analytics, - GCP (this one is hard), - youtube, - google dns servers, - android without any google services (or just iOS, this one might be easier if you already have iPhone, but for majority of people it is not easy), - adwords/adsense - fonts - translate - pay (again, easier of you are iPhone user) - photos - maps - charts (you can have link to those on web pages) - chrome - gmail (if you don't have account there then it is easy, if you have - it is almost impossible to change your email address everywhere) And also imagine a person that is an "average Joe", has cheap Android phone, uses Chrome without any ad blocking and has email account in gmail. Would it be easy for him? Or would it be easier to go voting? Or find a job in neighboring country that doesn't belong to EU (e.g. Switzerland or Norway, not sure if UK counts right now) ?
      - zepto 6y ago
        Well if you are going to say he has to use a cheap Android phone and a gmail account, then obviously he can’t avoid Google, but that’s not much of an argument. Nobody is really restricted in that way. It’s obviously much easier to buy an iPhone and install an ad-blocker than it is to get a new job in Switzerland or Norway if you don’t already live there. Have you actually looked at at what it takes to emigrate to Switzerland? As for your list, of course you can’t stop other people from using Google. We’re talking about not using Google yourself.
        krzyk 6y ago
        The move to different country is one time deal. Avoiding Google for the rest of your life is a constant job. I didn't say that the "Joe" has to use cheap Android phone and gmail account. I just said that he has one already because one is cheap and the other is free. So imagine that he used both for several years. And now he can change that, but is it easy? Buying iPhone is easy (not cheap, but moving out is also not cheap), but changing your email address in zillion places is next to impossible.

mfer 6y ago

Most people can’t drop google at any time. They can’t afford buying a new phone, buying a new computer (all those chrome book users), and everything else. Being able to transition off google has become a privilege that’s especially difficult on low income folks.

bluecalm 6y ago
You're forgetting a privilege to have a cheap phone, free maps, free decent email provider, cheap usable computer etc. It's possible thanks to Google. Of course it's costly to transition the same way it would be costly to get those services if Google wasn't around.
- josefx 6y ago
  > cheap phone Had one before android existed. > free decent email provider, Still use the same I used before gmail was a thing. > cheap usable computer etc I cannot comprehend from what kind of twisted alternate reality this claim hails. Or did you simply forget to mark your sarcasm with /s ?
  - bluecalm 6y ago
    Then you can use those options as Google didn't exist. The thing is the quality is so much better thanks to them people choose the products. The phone you had before Android wouldn't fulfill a purpose people buy phones these days. If you don't remember how much better Gmail was than email providers back in the day I don't know what to tell you.
emteycz 6y ago
A phone or a computer is not a basic human need. But even then, maybe let's use the EU to provide open phones instead of destroying the only thing available?
- dredmorbius 6y ago
  "U.N. Report Declares Internet Access a Human Right" https://www.wired.com/2011/06/internet-a-human-right/ https://www.wired.com/2011/06/internet-a-human-right/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_Internet_access https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_Internet_access

rodion_89 6y ago

> I can choose to drop Google any second > failed to produce any viable alternative to Google These two statements seem to be in conflict

eznzt 6y ago
In what way? You can use duckduckgo, iOS, etc. The EU has failed to produce a good search engine and a good mobile operating system.

raverbashing 6y ago

Talk about hyperbolic comparisons and nonsense excuses In which country of the world can you "choose to drop your government any second"? Though feel free to drop Google, if you can

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

megous 6y ago

There are a ton of better/worse alternatives to various google products. Aside from networking effects, noone needs to use google at all, right now.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

prepend 6y ago

You cannot operate on the internet and drop google. This isn’t possible because you live in an interconnected world. Unless you’re a hermit who disconnects entirely from the web, you can’t drop them. You may cancel all your accounts, but you’ll still visit sites that use google analytics, interact with hosts that use Google’s registrars for their domain names, be profiled by google and included in targeted advertising by web sites that you don’t even know. You’ll also be impacted by the incentives google puts on content creators through their de facto standards of chrome, web video, drm, etc. I’d say it’s easier to drop the EU than Google. You can move to Britain or elsewhere and escape EU laws. You can’t go anywhere on the internet to escape Google’s laws.

whalabi 6y ago

> I can choose to drop Google any second This is true, bit misses the point. The point is that through whatever means, but including cheating, Google has become incredibly, obscenely powerful. And one of the many reasons that is undesirable is the aforementioned cheating.