4 ms·

I empathize more with your right-leaning friends. The extremes of the right (racists, nazis, white supremacists, etc) are kept very much in check by taboo. The

I empathize more with your right-leaning friends. The extremes of the right (racists, nazis, white supremacists, etc) are kept very much in check by taboo. The extremes of the left (socialism, communism, collectivism, and the new Woke cult) are not. Anecdotally, I not only do not work with any of the former, but can't imagine a workplace that would suffer them. At the same time, I work with multiple people that are proud, self-proclaimed members of the latter group.

scrollaway 6y ago
If you think about why the former are taboo and the latter aren't (at least in your mind), something obvious should happen. And as a european, I can tell you with high degree of certainty that absolutely zero of your friends or workmates are actually socialists or communists. It's possible they embrace socialist ideals, as Sanders does, but Sanders is at best a moderate left-wing here in europe. You folks in the US developed a weird hatred of the word "socialism", equating it with the ridiculous dictatorial ideals of Stalin, Castro etc. But although socialism has a hard time working, that doesn't mean some of its ideas don't work in a democracy. Here in europe, "free health care" is not socialism. It's a human right. Human rights are fun, you should try them.
- tetrometal 6y ago
  I don't think something that requires others to labor can ever be a right. I would call that slavery.
  - scrollaway 6y ago
    What exactly is your impression of how socialized healthcare works, here in Europe? Are you under the hallucination that I'm required to offer my services to the government so others can receive their surgery? This is your problem, you have associated "socialism" with slavery, ergo you refuse to hear any arguments that has the word "social" in it because it's automatically bad by association. Maybe start to accept that your fellow Americans don't actually want slavery, but maybe are instead unhappy with the completely fucking absurd and insane private health insurance system? It is truly mind boggling, the mental jumps some of you folks are ready to make, to arrive at the conclusion that your life would be made worse were you to take example from countries that have it better than you. Because God forbid the US isn't number 1 in everything.
    - tetrometal 6y ago
      Take a free market society with no taxes. There is no slavery there. Now add 100% taxes. That's full-blown slavery. Now cut the taxes to 50%. That's 50% slavery.
      - scrollaway 6y ago
        A zero-percent tax, to my knowledge, does not make an effective society. Society functions because it is comprised of individuals overall working together. Like, seriously, you can't keep using public infrastructure and services and think taxes are slavery. The amount of shit you use daily that is funded by your taxes, hell, that is funded by my taxes as well from across the globe, is unreal. You would have to go find some virgin island and live off the land of you were to take this ridiculous argument to its logical conclusion. And you're probably paying for private insurance right now. Either because you have to, or because your employer makes you. A socialized healthcare system would be more efficient and fair on everyone, you included. How do I know? I had to have sinusoidal surgery two years ago and didn't have to run a fucking indigogo campaign to pay for it. Increasing taxes is not increasing slavery. Decreasing taxes is not reducing slavery. Socialized healthcare is not slavery.
lifeformed 6y ago
Why are you drawing an equivalence between "murder all non-white people" and "give power to the working class"?
- tetrometal 6y ago
  It's amazing to me that you frame it that way and probably think you're doing so in good faith. Anyway, I'm reasonably confident that if we tallied the deaths resulting from racism and collectivism, collectivism would win handily.
  - lifeformed 6y ago
    You framed it that way, look at the words you chose: racism, Nazism, white supremacy. The overarching ideal of all that can very simply be summarized as "non-white people shouldn't exist". The ideal of collectivism is "power to the people."
    - tetrometal 6y ago
      You took the worst possible interpretation of the former and the best possible interpretation of the latter. In what world do you think anyone believes this was done in good faith?
      - scrollaway 6y ago
        I already told you in the other thread that you have a different definition of socialism than the people you're talking to. It's not bad faith. You need to accept you are working off a different vocabulary. Your shitty media abuses this to stoke the divide. Neither definition is more correct, but it stands to reason that people arguing in favour of "socialism in politics" aren't Stalinists, for fucks sake. If anyone tells you that, they are trying to rile you up. And if you believe them, you're a fool.
      - lifeformed 6y ago
        What's the best possible interpretation of Nazism, white supremacy, and racism?

scrollaway 6y ago

If you think about why the former are taboo and the latter aren't (at least in your mind), something obvious should happen. And as a european, I can tell you with high degree of certainty that absolutely zero of your friends or workmates are actually socialists or communists. It's possible they embrace socialist ideals, as Sanders does, but Sanders is at best a moderate left-wing here in europe. You folks in the US developed a weird hatred of the word "socialism", equating it with the ridiculous dictatorial ideals of Stalin, Castro etc. But although socialism has a hard time working, that doesn't mean some of its ideas don't work in a democracy. Here in europe, "free health care" is not socialism. It's a human right. Human rights are fun, you should try them.

tetrometal 6y ago
I don't think something that requires others to labor can ever be a right. I would call that slavery.
- scrollaway 6y ago
  What exactly is your impression of how socialized healthcare works, here in Europe? Are you under the hallucination that I'm required to offer my services to the government so others can receive their surgery? This is your problem, you have associated "socialism" with slavery, ergo you refuse to hear any arguments that has the word "social" in it because it's automatically bad by association. Maybe start to accept that your fellow Americans don't actually want slavery, but maybe are instead unhappy with the completely fucking absurd and insane private health insurance system? It is truly mind boggling, the mental jumps some of you folks are ready to make, to arrive at the conclusion that your life would be made worse were you to take example from countries that have it better than you. Because God forbid the US isn't number 1 in everything.
  - tetrometal 6y ago
    Take a free market society with no taxes. There is no slavery there. Now add 100% taxes. That's full-blown slavery. Now cut the taxes to 50%. That's 50% slavery.
    - scrollaway 6y ago
      A zero-percent tax, to my knowledge, does not make an effective society. Society functions because it is comprised of individuals overall working together. Like, seriously, you can't keep using public infrastructure and services and think taxes are slavery. The amount of shit you use daily that is funded by your taxes, hell, that is funded by my taxes as well from across the globe, is unreal. You would have to go find some virgin island and live off the land of you were to take this ridiculous argument to its logical conclusion. And you're probably paying for private insurance right now. Either because you have to, or because your employer makes you. A socialized healthcare system would be more efficient and fair on everyone, you included. How do I know? I had to have sinusoidal surgery two years ago and didn't have to run a fucking indigogo campaign to pay for it. Increasing taxes is not increasing slavery. Decreasing taxes is not reducing slavery. Socialized healthcare is not slavery.

lifeformed 6y ago

Why are you drawing an equivalence between "murder all non-white people" and "give power to the working class"?

tetrometal 6y ago
It's amazing to me that you frame it that way and probably think you're doing so in good faith. Anyway, I'm reasonably confident that if we tallied the deaths resulting from racism and collectivism, collectivism would win handily.
- lifeformed 6y ago
  You framed it that way, look at the words you chose: racism, Nazism, white supremacy. The overarching ideal of all that can very simply be summarized as "non-white people shouldn't exist". The ideal of collectivism is "power to the people."
  - tetrometal 6y ago
    You took the worst possible interpretation of the former and the best possible interpretation of the latter. In what world do you think anyone believes this was done in good faith?
    - scrollaway 6y ago
      I already told you in the other thread that you have a different definition of socialism than the people you're talking to. It's not bad faith. You need to accept you are working off a different vocabulary. Your shitty media abuses this to stoke the divide. Neither definition is more correct, but it stands to reason that people arguing in favour of "socialism in politics" aren't Stalinists, for fucks sake. If anyone tells you that, they are trying to rile you up. And if you believe them, you're a fool.
    - lifeformed 6y ago
      What's the best possible interpretation of Nazism, white supremacy, and racism?