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The war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color by Nixon. Before then, MJ was around and used, it is a plant and good pain killer that you can g

The war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color by Nixon. Before then, MJ was around and used, it is a plant and good pain killer that you can grow yourself. And Nixon stated that is why he was doing it in the White House tapes. For 50 years the WoD was used to justify invading other countries and setting up coups and all that has lead to our current issue with powerful militarized Narco gangs and all the people trying to get asylum in the US. So the GOP created a war to go after people of color and now are using terrible results of their actions to further justify why the GOP should stay in power. And the ignorant voters who don't study any history eat that up. What has happened is that enough people have seen through the rhetoric and failed policies and see that the laws have to change to support the evidence.

freedomben 6y ago
I completely agree with you. But, some advice, if you want to have a chance at changing somebody's mind, leave out the attack on the GOP. You trigger emotional thinking and defensiveness when you do that.
- d2v 6y ago
  Yeah. Worth noting that the Democrats helped make things significantly worse with the crime bill as well. Nixon and Regan got the ball rolling, but the Clinton admin doubled down on all of it.
  - x86_64Ubuntu 6y ago
    That's because the Overton window was being dragged rightward in the wake of Reagan.
zdragnar 6y ago
> The war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color by Nixon So was Planned Parenthood. Instead of endlessly prosecuting the past, which can never change, let's look at today and tomorrow instead. Or, if you prefer, we could look at the exact opposite approach- the Opium wars were fought to force China to allow the sale and consumption of opium, the extensive use of which was practically epidemic. As such, it could also be argued that legalizing drugs is an attack in minorities who are disproportionately poor and thus prone to consumption- a return to the days when inner cities were ravaged by crack. Things are way more complex than just pointing at simplified versions of history and banging on the race drum.
- viraptor 6y ago
  > could also be argued that legalizing drugs is an attack in minorities who are disproportionately poor and thus prone to consumption Legalising the production and sale - yes, that would be possible. But legalising use and possession is very far from that. It opens the doors for better social approach to the problems and helps keep families together.
  - dantheman 6y ago
    If you legalize consumption but not production and sale - you make the black market thrive and basically sponsor organized crime. Full legalization is the only moral and practical approach.
    - viraptor 6y ago
      There's some threshold you probably don't want to legalise. With less addictive alternatives being available, do you really think that heroin production should ever be legalised? Otherwise what's to stop someone from creating a custom highly addictive drug purely for maximising profit? There are labs ready to do that. In Poland the drug laws targeted specific listed substances for a while which created a market for completely untested substances which were technically-not-drugs and the stock changed immediately after the drug list was updated.
      - pessimizer 6y ago
        > do you really think that heroin production should ever be legalised? Yes. The actual cost of producing heroin is about a nickel a dose. Junkies who get their heroin are productive members of society, and aside from the criminal element they're forced to associate with, the crime they commit to get the cash to not get sick, the inconsistency of product, and the aggression of the state, we have no reason to think they wouldn't live long happy lives other than ideological ones. Every junkie death is by statute.
        viraptor 6y ago
cbozeman 6y ago
No it didn't... the War on Drugs started with Harry J. Anslinger. He was going after drugs as early as 1917. He was a raging racist, but Nixon did not the start the "War on Drugs".
fishtockos 6y ago
Do you have a source for your claims that "[t]he war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color by Nixon", and especially that Nixon admitted it on the WH tapes? As far as I'm aware the latter is completely false, and the former is generally thought to be mostly false as well (though Nixon was certainly racist). This myth seems to have started with the alleged John Ehrlichman quote from '94 - it's not generally given much credence. I look forward to your reply
throwaway201103 6y ago
And it was stepped up by Clinton/Biden in the 1990s with the crime bill. There is plenty of blame to pass around for the situation we are in today. Arguing about who started it decades ago is not very helpful.
- xnx 6y ago
  Similar to the Chesterton Fence example, knowing the history of something helps me understand if there was any good thinking behind it. For marijuana prohibition, it doesn't seem like there was.
- brodo 6y ago
  Politics always exists in a context and one can't make rational decisions in politics without that context. I think our society suffers greatly because people don't know history.
  - Supermancho 6y ago
    > Politics always exists in a context and one can't make rational decisions in politics without that context. You can act outside of political historical context and I would go so far as to recommend it wholly. This kind of "context" (which is human ascribed) has no bearing on acting rationally. Pay attention to consequence borne by data, not past intent. > I think our society suffers greatly because people don't know history. I'm not sure how that applies to something that has circumstantial relevance, like past political conditions.
opo 6y ago
>...The war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color by Nixon. Before then, MJ was around and used, it is a plant and good pain killer that you can grow yourself. And Nixon stated that is why he was doing it in the White House tapes. Where in the tapes does Nixon say the war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color? Usually when I've seen people make the claim that Nixon used the rhetoric of a 'war on drugs' to target people of color, it is the Baum quote where he is allegedly quoting Ehrlichman. That quote is brought up often but it should be taken with some skepticism. As user GatorD42 pointed out when this was brought up before: >...Baum claims Ehrlichman said that to him in 1994 while he was researching for a book he published in 1996 about the drug war. He didn't include the quote in that book, but instead published it in 2012 and again in 2016, after Ehrlichman had died (in 1999). This is a very explosive quote - if Baum had included it in his book in 1996 I am sure it would have garnered a huge amount of attention for the book. Instead Baum did not include it in his book, but instead would wait for decades later when Ehrlichman was no longer around to dispute the quote. The surviving members of his family also don't believe he made the quote: >...Multiple family members of Ehrlichman (who died in 1999) challenge the veracity of the quote: The 1994 alleged 'quote' we saw repeated in social media for the first time today does not square with what we know of our father...We do not subscribe to the alleged racist point of view that this writer now implies 22 years following the so-called interview of John and 16 years following our father's death, when dad can no longer respond.[22] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ehrlichman https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ehrlichman At any rate, if the quote was actually said by Ehrlichman, it isn't a very accurate description of the overall drug polices of the Nixon administration. While Nixon is remembered for "war on drugs" rhetoric, the actual substance of his policies seem to be different than what people think it was: >...I have been fortunate over the years to discuss the distorted memory of Nixon's drug policies with almost all of his key advisors as well as with historians. Their consensus is that because he was dramatically expanding the U.S. treatment system (by 350% in just 18 months!) and cutting criminal penalties, he had to reassure his right wing that he hadn’t gone soft. So he laid on some of the toughest anti-drug rhetoric in history, including making a White House speech declaring a “war on drugs” and calling drugs “public enemy number one”. It worked so well as cover that many people remember that “tough” press event and forget that what Nixon did at it was introduce not a general or a cop or a preacher to be his drug policy chief but…a medical doctor (Jerry Jaffe, a sweet, bookish man who had longish hair and sideburns and often wore the Mickey Mouse tie his kids had given him). https://www.samefacts.com/who-started-the-war-on-drugs/ https://www.samefacts.com/who-started-the-war-on-drugs/ >..."Enforcement must be coupled with a rational approach to the reclamation of the drug user himself," Nixon told Congress in 1971. "We must rehabilitate the drug user if we are to eliminate drug abuse and all the antisocial activities that flow from drug abuse." >The numbers back this up. According to the federal government's budget numbers for anti-drug programs, the "demand" side of the war on drugs (treatment, education, and prevention) consistently got more funding during Nixon's time in office (1969 to 1974) than the "supply" side (law enforcement and interdiction). https://www.vox.com/2016/3/29/11325750/nixon-war-on-drugs https://www.vox.com/2016/3/29/11325750/nixon-war-on-drugs

freedomben 6y ago

I completely agree with you. But, some advice, if you want to have a chance at changing somebody's mind, leave out the attack on the GOP. You trigger emotional thinking and defensiveness when you do that.

d2v 6y ago
Yeah. Worth noting that the Democrats helped make things significantly worse with the crime bill as well. Nixon and Regan got the ball rolling, but the Clinton admin doubled down on all of it.
- x86_64Ubuntu 6y ago
  That's because the Overton window was being dragged rightward in the wake of Reagan.

zdragnar 6y ago

> The war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color by Nixon So was Planned Parenthood. Instead of endlessly prosecuting the past, which can never change, let's look at today and tomorrow instead. Or, if you prefer, we could look at the exact opposite approach- the Opium wars were fought to force China to allow the sale and consumption of opium, the extensive use of which was practically epidemic. As such, it could also be argued that legalizing drugs is an attack in minorities who are disproportionately poor and thus prone to consumption- a return to the days when inner cities were ravaged by crack. Things are way more complex than just pointing at simplified versions of history and banging on the race drum.

viraptor 6y ago
> could also be argued that legalizing drugs is an attack in minorities who are disproportionately poor and thus prone to consumption Legalising the production and sale - yes, that would be possible. But legalising use and possession is very far from that. It opens the doors for better social approach to the problems and helps keep families together.
- dantheman 6y ago
  If you legalize consumption but not production and sale - you make the black market thrive and basically sponsor organized crime. Full legalization is the only moral and practical approach.
  - viraptor 6y ago
    There's some threshold you probably don't want to legalise. With less addictive alternatives being available, do you really think that heroin production should ever be legalised? Otherwise what's to stop someone from creating a custom highly addictive drug purely for maximising profit? There are labs ready to do that. In Poland the drug laws targeted specific listed substances for a while which created a market for completely untested substances which were technically-not-drugs and the stock changed immediately after the drug list was updated.
    - pessimizer 6y ago
      > do you really think that heroin production should ever be legalised? Yes. The actual cost of producing heroin is about a nickel a dose. Junkies who get their heroin are productive members of society, and aside from the criminal element they're forced to associate with, the crime they commit to get the cash to not get sick, the inconsistency of product, and the aggression of the state, we have no reason to think they wouldn't live long happy lives other than ideological ones. Every junkie death is by statute.
      - viraptor 6y ago

cbozeman 6y ago

No it didn't... the War on Drugs started with Harry J. Anslinger. He was going after drugs as early as 1917. He was a raging racist, but Nixon did not the start the "War on Drugs".

fishtockos 6y ago

Do you have a source for your claims that "[t]he war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color by Nixon", and especially that Nixon admitted it on the WH tapes? As far as I'm aware the latter is completely false, and the former is generally thought to be mostly false as well (though Nixon was certainly racist). This myth seems to have started with the alleged John Ehrlichman quote from '94 - it's not generally given much credence. I look forward to your reply

throwaway201103 6y ago

And it was stepped up by Clinton/Biden in the 1990s with the crime bill. There is plenty of blame to pass around for the situation we are in today. Arguing about who started it decades ago is not very helpful.

xnx 6y ago
Similar to the Chesterton Fence example, knowing the history of something helps me understand if there was any good thinking behind it. For marijuana prohibition, it doesn't seem like there was.
brodo 6y ago
Politics always exists in a context and one can't make rational decisions in politics without that context. I think our society suffers greatly because people don't know history.
- Supermancho 6y ago
  > Politics always exists in a context and one can't make rational decisions in politics without that context. You can act outside of political historical context and I would go so far as to recommend it wholly. This kind of "context" (which is human ascribed) has no bearing on acting rationally. Pay attention to consequence borne by data, not past intent. > I think our society suffers greatly because people don't know history. I'm not sure how that applies to something that has circumstantial relevance, like past political conditions.

opo 6y ago

>...The war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color by Nixon. Before then, MJ was around and used, it is a plant and good pain killer that you can grow yourself. And Nixon stated that is why he was doing it in the White House tapes. Where in the tapes does Nixon say the war on drugs was started as a way to target people of color? Usually when I've seen people make the claim that Nixon used the rhetoric of a 'war on drugs' to target people of color, it is the Baum quote where he is allegedly quoting Ehrlichman. That quote is brought up often but it should be taken with some skepticism. As user GatorD42 pointed out when this was brought up before: >...Baum claims Ehrlichman said that to him in 1994 while he was researching for a book he published in 1996 about the drug war. He didn't include the quote in that book, but instead published it in 2012 and again in 2016, after Ehrlichman had died (in 1999). This is a very explosive quote - if Baum had included it in his book in 1996 I am sure it would have garnered a huge amount of attention for the book. Instead Baum did not include it in his book, but instead would wait for decades later when Ehrlichman was no longer around to dispute the quote. The surviving members of his family also don't believe he made the quote: >...Multiple family members of Ehrlichman (who died in 1999) challenge the veracity of the quote: The 1994 alleged 'quote' we saw repeated in social media for the first time today does not square with what we know of our father...We do not subscribe to the alleged racist point of view that this writer now implies 22 years following the so-called interview of John and 16 years following our father's death, when dad can no longer respond.[22] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ehrlichman https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ehrlichman At any rate, if the quote was actually said by Ehrlichman, it isn't a very accurate description of the overall drug polices of the Nixon administration. While Nixon is remembered for "war on drugs" rhetoric, the actual substance of his policies seem to be different than what people think it was: >...I have been fortunate over the years to discuss the distorted memory of Nixon's drug policies with almost all of his key advisors as well as with historians. Their consensus is that because he was dramatically expanding the U.S. treatment system (by 350% in just 18 months!) and cutting criminal penalties, he had to reassure his right wing that he hadn’t gone soft. So he laid on some of the toughest anti-drug rhetoric in history, including making a White House speech declaring a “war on drugs” and calling drugs “public enemy number one”. It worked so well as cover that many people remember that “tough” press event and forget that what Nixon did at it was introduce not a general or a cop or a preacher to be his drug policy chief but…a medical doctor (Jerry Jaffe, a sweet, bookish man who had longish hair and sideburns and often wore the Mickey Mouse tie his kids had given him). https://www.samefacts.com/who-started-the-war-on-drugs/ https://www.samefacts.com/who-started-the-war-on-drugs/ >..."Enforcement must be coupled with a rational approach to the reclamation of the drug user himself," Nixon told Congress in 1971. "We must rehabilitate the drug user if we are to eliminate drug abuse and all the antisocial activities that flow from drug abuse." >The numbers back this up. According to the federal government's budget numbers for anti-drug programs, the "demand" side of the war on drugs (treatment, education, and prevention) consistently got more funding during Nixon's time in office (1969 to 1974) than the "supply" side (law enforcement and interdiction). https://www.vox.com/2016/3/29/11325750/nixon-war-on-drugs https://www.vox.com/2016/3/29/11325750/nixon-war-on-drugs