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It is political. It glorifies war and being the aggressor in war. I my country, it's mainly used to represent the time we tried to invade what is now Turkey and

It is political. It glorifies war and being the aggressor in war. I my country, it's mainly used to represent the time we tried to invade what is now Turkey and killed a bunch of the locals defending their territory. Anti-war people don't like it.

criddell 6y ago
That's not at all what the poppy campaign or the Canadian Legion is all about.
- monkeycantype 6y ago
  I believe lompotor is from Australia, and is referring in particular to the landing at Gallipoli, in which the British empire was attempting to land in what is now Turkey with support of forces from Commonwealth countries, this certainly included people from Newfoundland. Over the last 25 years, conservative politicians in Australia have have politicised the remembrance of this battle.
reaperducer 6y ago
It glorifies war. So putting a photo of my dead wife on my desk at work glorifies car crashes? Got it.
- pueblito 6y ago
  I am sorry for your loss
- DubiousPusher 6y ago
  That analogy doesn't map by my logic. It would be more like putting up a plaque that says, "I'm proud of my brother for engaging in risk taking behavior until it caused him to crash his car and die." Also, victims of car crashes aren't generally used in national pageantry aimed at causing more car crashes.
  - chrisseaton 6y ago
    > It would be more like putting up a plaque that says, "I'm proud of my brother for engaging in risk taking behavior until it caused him to crash his car and die." Are you comparing people fighting desperately for national survival, some of whom were conscripts and had no choice, to 'engaging in risk taking behavior' such as driving your car irresponsibly?
    - DubiousPusher 6y ago
      Conscripts no. Volunteers sort of. People in WWII less so than WWI less so than most recent conflicts. But this is exactly my problem with veterans rarara. It's totallizing where we should have razor sharp nuance.
      - chrisseaton 6y ago
        > we should have razor sharp nuance How about on this day we just say 'it's sad anyone had to die, no matter which side they were on or how they ended up in that situation'? That's what a poppy is.
        DubiousPusher 6y ago
        That begs the question that people "had" to die. That is exactly my problem.
        chrisseaton 6y ago
        I don't think that's what 'had' means in this context if you read it more charitably. You can rephrase as 'it's sad anyone died, no matter which side they were on or how they ended up in that situation' if you find it confusing otherwise.
        DubiousPusher 6y ago
        This context is very weird. I don't really have a problem with this tradition. But I do see how it can be political. In the U.S. there is memorial day and veterans day and they are very political. My main issue is I do not get the analogy. Those two things are very different to me.
chrisseaton 6y ago
> It glorifies war and being the aggressor in war. How were Canadians aggressors in WW1 and WW2? I think you're ignorant.
monkeycantype 6y ago
I think lopmotr is from my country, and here people have attempted to politicise the poppy in exactly this way, transforming the meaning from a remembrance of the stupidity of war to a glorification. In small numbers Canadians were present at Gallipoli, the battle at the centre of the politicisation to which I believe lopmotr is correctly referrring

criddell 6y ago

That's not at all what the poppy campaign or the Canadian Legion is all about.

monkeycantype 6y ago
I believe lompotor is from Australia, and is referring in particular to the landing at Gallipoli, in which the British empire was attempting to land in what is now Turkey with support of forces from Commonwealth countries, this certainly included people from Newfoundland. Over the last 25 years, conservative politicians in Australia have have politicised the remembrance of this battle.

reaperducer 6y ago

It glorifies war. So putting a photo of my dead wife on my desk at work glorifies car crashes? Got it.

pueblito 6y ago
I am sorry for your loss
DubiousPusher 6y ago
That analogy doesn't map by my logic. It would be more like putting up a plaque that says, "I'm proud of my brother for engaging in risk taking behavior until it caused him to crash his car and die." Also, victims of car crashes aren't generally used in national pageantry aimed at causing more car crashes.
- chrisseaton 6y ago
  > It would be more like putting up a plaque that says, "I'm proud of my brother for engaging in risk taking behavior until it caused him to crash his car and die." Are you comparing people fighting desperately for national survival, some of whom were conscripts and had no choice, to 'engaging in risk taking behavior' such as driving your car irresponsibly?
  - DubiousPusher 6y ago
    Conscripts no. Volunteers sort of. People in WWII less so than WWI less so than most recent conflicts. But this is exactly my problem with veterans rarara. It's totallizing where we should have razor sharp nuance.
    - chrisseaton 6y ago
      > we should have razor sharp nuance How about on this day we just say 'it's sad anyone had to die, no matter which side they were on or how they ended up in that situation'? That's what a poppy is.
      - DubiousPusher 6y ago
        That begs the question that people "had" to die. That is exactly my problem.
        chrisseaton 6y ago
        I don't think that's what 'had' means in this context if you read it more charitably. You can rephrase as 'it's sad anyone died, no matter which side they were on or how they ended up in that situation' if you find it confusing otherwise.
        DubiousPusher 6y ago
        This context is very weird. I don't really have a problem with this tradition. But I do see how it can be political. In the U.S. there is memorial day and veterans day and they are very political. My main issue is I do not get the analogy. Those two things are very different to me.

chrisseaton 6y ago

> It glorifies war and being the aggressor in war. How were Canadians aggressors in WW1 and WW2? I think you're ignorant.

monkeycantype 6y ago

I think lopmotr is from my country, and here people have attempted to politicise the poppy in exactly this way, transforming the meaning from a remembrance of the stupidity of war to a glorification. In small numbers Canadians were present at Gallipoli, the battle at the centre of the politicisation to which I believe lopmotr is correctly referrring