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It does raise the question of why don’t we have QR payments. And why not have a line of credit behind it.
by sjg007 6y ago
It does raise the question of why don’t we have QR payments. And why not have a line of credit behind it.
- gruez 6y agoBecause compared to swipe/NFC payments, it's a downgrade or a sidegrade. Advantages: * cheap, no need for a dedicated terminal Disadvantages: * requires internet connection for both parties (credit cards only require the merchant to be connected) * cellphone is a single failure point (eg. losing it, battery running out, dropping it), whereas you can carry spare credit cards * scanning is worse ux than tapping
- _-___________-_ 6y ago> requires internet connection for both parties (credit cards only require the merchant to be connected) In China it's quite common for the merchant to have a static printed-out QR code for receiving payment. This requires a connection only for the payer (and merchants will often have WiFi available, so you're likely to be able to connect one way or another). These merchants tend to just trust you when you pay and then show them the "paid" screen on your phone. You could fake it, but I guess in general people don't, and the "paid" screen does include the merchant's chosen profile image, so you would have to have done your homework to fake it. > scanning is worse ux than tapping This is really true. When I lived in Shanghai it was pretty common to be stuck behind someone at the metro turnstile who was trying to use the stupid QR scanning thing to get in. Contactless is much smoother, but at one time QR code was the only way to use your mobile device to get into Shanghai's metro. Now Apple Pay supports the Shanghai transit card.
- gruez 6y ago>In China it's quite common for the merchant to have a static printed-out QR code for receiving payment "for the same amount of security" should be implied. If we're talking about what's possible, credit cards can also be processed fully offline by using an imprinter (eg. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Credit_card_imprinter.JPG https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Credit_card_imprinter.JPG).
- franklampard 6y agoI think you are misunderstanding, which part of a print-out receiving QR code is insecure?
- gruez 6y agoFrom the GP: >These merchants tend to just trust you when you pay and then show them the "paid" screen on your phone. You could fake it, but I guess in general people don't, and the "paid" screen does include the merchant's chosen profile image, so you would have to have done your homework to fake it.
- sudosysgen 6y agoBut that's only if they don't want to verify themselves. Which is not an issue, really. Or, if they do not have internet, in which case with NFC they couldn't do the transaction at all. I feel like it's a case of abuse being so rare that they don't care.
- angio 6y agoIsn't this classic innovator's dilemma? On one hand we have the incumbent that provides a good, polished solution to the problem (credit card companies), on the other we have the innovator that can focus on markets that are too small for the incumbent (micro transactions, small shops etc).
- franklampard 6y agoYou are right about the advantage, which doesn’t not make it an downgrade. It literally takes $0 and seconds to setup cashless payments
- sjg007 6y agoDunno. I could carry around a card with a QR code on it or embedded on the chip to solve that problem.
- Jommi 6y agoDoesn't require active internrt connection. There is an SMS and credit based fallback for when connectivity is low. Scanning is better than tapping as it can be done from range.
- gruez 6y ago> Doesn't require active internrt connection. There is an SMS and credit based fallback for when connectivity is low. How does this work? Do you manually compose a text message to alipay with the payment information? >Scanning is better than tapping as it can be done from range. In what context would this be advantageous? If you're at a supermarket checkout, you're already standing close enough to the cashier that you can easily tap/swipe. The same applies to most other situations I can think of.
- alisonatwork 6y agoThe way "passive" payments work is that your phone generates a new QR code every few seconds, same way that those one-time password authenticator apps work. The vendor scans your code and charges an amount, then you get an SMS receipt (or confirmation request, for larger amounts). The other way around - the internet-lacking vendor has a static QR printout (or one-time code) which the buyer scans, keys in the amount, then pays with their internet connection. Vendor gets SMS receipt. Either way, I do think one of the two parties needs to have internet for a payment to successfully go through.
- Jommi 6y agoTap/swipe requires you to be able to extend hand to a specific terminal. QR tags can be: - Printed all around the store/restaurant - Zoomed in from distance and still scanned
- scarmig 6y ago> In what context would this be advantageous? Plenty of corner cases which collectively add up to a majority of cases. Pandemic: you don't want to get too close to the checkout, so you can do it from a six foot distance. Retail locations with limited space: all you need is a flat wall to put a QR code on, and you can put it up in multiple areas. You could even put it on the floor or hang it from the ceiling. Forced serialization: multiple people can scan a QR code simultaneously, while the NFC nearness requirement means that only one person can tap at once. Restaurant table: put a QR code on the menu, scan. Websites on your desktop or laptop: can't tap, but can scan as usual That's all just talking about payer UX, not even considering seller UX. QR codes are cheaper and more flexible than NFC. And, most of all, the fact that QR codes work in such a wide range of scenarios enables the biggest advantage: ubiquity. When they're ubiquitous, they become a single payment interface that you can assume will be available no matter where you go, which is game changing.
- scarmig 6y agoOne consequent advantage of cheap that you leave off: Ubiquity. I can't assume that every place, even in the most sophisticated cities in the US, will support NFC payments. Most don't, actually. So I still have to carry around a credit card and use it, with all the inconvenience and security issues associated with it. Also, that cheapness allows for user experiences that are prohibitively expensive for NFC. E.g., paying at your table after eating.
- seanmcdirmid 6y agoQR is really awkward compared to NFC. It might make sense for person to person transactions, but otherwise I really prefer tap and go.
- whoevercares 6y agoWell in China people also scan QR stick on the wall when exiting the parking lot, which seems handy. Also in some places You could start paying while you are in the line by scanning the QR. Anyway it has seen vast success in China
- _-___________-_ 6y ago> You could start paying while you are in the line by scanning the QR You can save them in the app and not have to scan every time too. It's pretty common at people's regular lunch places for them to pay while they wait in line. There's no deep technical reason this couldn't be implemented with the card system either, of course.
- luckylion 6y agoHow does the shop know who paid? Do they then check your phone screen for the correct verification code that matches their transaction?
- _-___________-_ 6y agoAt the kind of shops I'm thinking of, they just look at the amount you paid and make sure it matches what you're ordering.
- seanmcdirmid 6y agoI pay for Starbucks on my phone while ordering also. No QR code scanning involved.
- The_Founder 6y agoSeems normal on HN for a person to get downvoted for stating a simple fact. I wish I could understand this weird HN bias.
- tokai 6y agoI paid for my diner earlier by scanning a QR code. It's only something I do when I have forgotten my card, as it is much more of a bother than contactless.
- sct202 6y agoPayPal's app has a Pay in Store QR code but I don't think I've seen anywhere that actually uses it.