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Pay your taxes so that your military can keep an eye on the assholes who do this, and so that UN may offer some form of asylum to their victims. Vote for politi

by crocal 6y ago

Pay your taxes so that your military can keep an eye on the assholes who do this, and so that UN may offer some form of asylum to their victims. Vote for politicians that oppose this shit publicly. Explain to your kids why this is wrong.

skinkestek 6y ago
Have my upvote, but honestly don't expect too much from UN. They are the ones who turned a blind eye to Rwanda and gave the guy who sold the guns a top job, aren't they?
- runarberg 6y ago
  What people criticize about the Rwandan genocide isn’t the lack of military intervention. It is the lack of any response from the international community (think the first decade of HIV/AIDS). No condemnation, no UN response, no relief of asylums for victims, and hardly any news.
  - eitland 6y ago
    > What people criticize about the Rwandan genocide isn’t the lack of military intervention. On 11 January 1994, General Roméo Dallaire, commander of UNAMIR, sent his "Genocide Fax" to UN Headquarters.[108] The fax stated that Dallaire was in contact with "a top level trainer in the cadre of Interhamwe-armed [sic] militia of MRND." The informant—now known to be Mathieu Ngirumpatse's chauffeur, Kassim Turatsinze,[109] a.k.a. "Jean-Pierre"—claimed to have been ordered to register all Tutsi in Kigali. According to the memo, Turatsinze suspected that a genocide against the Tutsis was being planned, and he said that "in 20 minutes his personnel could kill up to 1000 Tutsis".[110] Dallaire's request to protect the informant and his family and to raid the weapons caches he revealed was denied.[110] From https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_genocide https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_genocide
- godelski 6y ago
  Btw, things still aren't all clear in Rwanda and from what I hear things are starting to go south again, including Paul Rusesabagina (the main character from the movie) accusing the Rwandan government of kidnapping him and forcing him into a rigged trial[0]. Speaking to a Rwandan friend all he could say is that things were certainty shady and things aren't going well in the country right now. Remembering one of the most powerful lines of the movie > You're black. You're not even a nier. You're an African. [0] https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN26Q268 https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN26Q268
- hajile 6y ago
  As a veto member of the UN security council, China will simply prevent any response. In addition, they pay massive amounts of money to African countries to vote their way. Look into Ethiopian-Chinese relations and the Ethiopian cholera outbreaks and you'll see why the WHO leader (not a doctor I'd add) did nothing but shill for China.
aleksjess 6y ago
Wow, this is a really poor proposal. Intervening in another's country internal affairs leads to a war. UN is a nice idea, though it doesn't work in reality. To apply for an asylum, you need to leave the country. Low likelyhood of happening. I explain why its wrong to my kids. What then? As sad as it is, we can't do much if anything.
- runarberg 6y ago
  Agree. Sure the UN could do more to both help the victims and condemn the actions. But military intervention seems like a very very very bad idea which might result in far worse travesties. Worse then even these concentration camps. Remember that 2.5% of every human on earth lost their lives because of World War 2.
- brink 6y ago
  The CCP has no intention of repenting of their ways and will always be seeking to increase it's influence abroad; encouraging this kind of behavior everywhere. Of course fighting is not ideal, as uncomfortable as it is; sometimes fighting is necessary. This isn't a problem that will just go away by wishful thinking or by being ignored.
  - runarberg 6y ago
    Nobody is saying that. However currently the Chinese ruling class is getting away with this horror without any repercussions. International condemnation from world leaders might be enough to stop this horror, but so far we are not even seeing that from the international community. More realistically it would take a lot more then only condemnation. We would probably need to see sanctions against the Chinese ruling class and Chinese state owned businesses, and probably we would need to see the Chinese excluded from international cultural and sports events (such as the Olympics).
- fsociety 6y ago
  Passing these values to kids is valuable. Right now the US is at a turning point for its democracy and now is an important time to teach the values of human rights and democracy.
mkolodny 6y ago
What country's politicians have publicly opposed this?
- cameronh90 6y ago
  UK did earlier this year, and threatened sanctions. China called it fake news. Not much has happened since.
  - spinny 6y ago
    Good thing that twitter pretends to be the arbiter of truth and fact check every world that comes out of a republican's mouth. meanwhile accusations from the ccp's minister of propaganda run rampant
- Baeocystin 6y ago
  Canada just did. https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/parliamentary-committee-uighur-genocide-1.5772757 https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/parliamentary-committee-uig...
peacefulhat 6y ago
The UN is not unified on the uighur camps, so it would have to be individual countries at the national level. The UN has voted on several resolutions regarding Chinese policy in Xinjiang. Many countries abstain from voting and of those that vote, more vote in support than vote to denounce.
- WarOnPrivacy 6y ago
  Was the UN ever unified against CIA torture policies? I don't recall. It may be that the UN is strongly reluctant to call out abominations by superpowers.
  - seppin 6y ago
    Did the CIA operate concentration camps for millions of people? No, it ran guantanamo bay which had at it's peak 140 prisoners. My kingdom for a little perspective.
    - WarOnPrivacy 6y ago
      Inventing your own question and then answering that was an interesting thing to do.
      - stale2002 6y ago
        The point bring that your original comparison is a bad analogy. It should be obvious to you that something that effects millions of people is much worse than the CIA thing that only effected a couple hundred.
        seppin 6y ago
        It should be obvious, but here we are.
        WarOnPrivacy 6y ago
        I didn't make an analogy. I asked a straightforward question. I'm unclear why you or anyone else might be creating analogies in your heads. It's even less clear why you want me to have made them.
bigbubba 6y ago
How would the UN giving people asylum work? AFAIK the only territories administered by the UN are in Syria, Kosovo and Cyprus. I don't think they'd send asylum seekers there..
WarOnPrivacy 6y ago
> Pay your taxes so that your military can keep an eye on the jackwads who do this My taxes have frequently paid for US Gov led torture. If we ever hold China accountable in a meaningful way, it won't be due to authentic moral outrage.
- hcurtiss 6y ago
  Certainly nothing like this, and our practices in war have always stood out as more humane than the other side. People sometimes point to Afghanistan, but I don’t remember out guys beheading anyone.
  - runarberg 6y ago
    This simply isn’t true. And even if it were, that is still no excuse. Terrible things happen in war. Innocent people die or get seriously scarred in war, often for decades to come after the war ends. Being “better then the opposing party” is no excuse and provides no comfort to the victims of war.
  - tremon 6y ago
    our practices in war have always stood out as more humane than the other side Ok, then convince your side to submit to the UN-appointed war crimes tribunal in The Hague. As long as the The Hague Invasion Act is still in force, that claim is hollow.
    - hcurtiss 6y ago
      Just as soon as China does.
      - mxmilkb 6y ago
        Do you know what 'whataboutism' is?
      - WarOnPrivacy 6y ago
        On the other hand, there are many Americans who don't wait for China to lead their way.
csomar 6y ago
I think this comment is under-rated. The US has been doing real work when it comes to China like this: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-southchinasea-philippines-carter-idUSKCN0XB0QY https://www.reuters.com/article/us-southchinasea-philippines... where most of the world is just watching. The US certainly doesn't have a stellar Human Rights record in wars or other; but it's mostly because of incompetence and not as an agenda to keep one race only.
- FpUser 6y ago
  >"...but it's mostly because of incompetence and not as an agenda to keep one race only..." I am curious what would happen should you face those countless victims of "incompetence" and explain it to them.

by crocal 6y ago

skinkestek 6y ago

Have my upvote, but honestly don't expect too much from UN. They are the ones who turned a blind eye to Rwanda and gave the guy who sold the guns a top job, aren't they?

runarberg 6y ago
What people criticize about the Rwandan genocide isn’t the lack of military intervention. It is the lack of any response from the international community (think the first decade of HIV/AIDS). No condemnation, no UN response, no relief of asylums for victims, and hardly any news.
- eitland 6y ago
  > What people criticize about the Rwandan genocide isn’t the lack of military intervention. On 11 January 1994, General Roméo Dallaire, commander of UNAMIR, sent his "Genocide Fax" to UN Headquarters.[108] The fax stated that Dallaire was in contact with "a top level trainer in the cadre of Interhamwe-armed [sic] militia of MRND." The informant—now known to be Mathieu Ngirumpatse's chauffeur, Kassim Turatsinze,[109] a.k.a. "Jean-Pierre"—claimed to have been ordered to register all Tutsi in Kigali. According to the memo, Turatsinze suspected that a genocide against the Tutsis was being planned, and he said that "in 20 minutes his personnel could kill up to 1000 Tutsis".[110] Dallaire's request to protect the informant and his family and to raid the weapons caches he revealed was denied.[110] From https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_genocide https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_genocide
godelski 6y ago
Btw, things still aren't all clear in Rwanda and from what I hear things are starting to go south again, including Paul Rusesabagina (the main character from the movie) accusing the Rwandan government of kidnapping him and forcing him into a rigged trial[0]. Speaking to a Rwandan friend all he could say is that things were certainty shady and things aren't going well in the country right now. Remembering one of the most powerful lines of the movie > You're black. You're not even a nier. You're an African. [0] https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN26Q268 https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN26Q268
hajile 6y ago
As a veto member of the UN security council, China will simply prevent any response. In addition, they pay massive amounts of money to African countries to vote their way. Look into Ethiopian-Chinese relations and the Ethiopian cholera outbreaks and you'll see why the WHO leader (not a doctor I'd add) did nothing but shill for China.

aleksjess 6y ago

Wow, this is a really poor proposal. Intervening in another's country internal affairs leads to a war. UN is a nice idea, though it doesn't work in reality. To apply for an asylum, you need to leave the country. Low likelyhood of happening. I explain why its wrong to my kids. What then? As sad as it is, we can't do much if anything.

runarberg 6y ago
Agree. Sure the UN could do more to both help the victims and condemn the actions. But military intervention seems like a very very very bad idea which might result in far worse travesties. Worse then even these concentration camps. Remember that 2.5% of every human on earth lost their lives because of World War 2.
brink 6y ago
The CCP has no intention of repenting of their ways and will always be seeking to increase it's influence abroad; encouraging this kind of behavior everywhere. Of course fighting is not ideal, as uncomfortable as it is; sometimes fighting is necessary. This isn't a problem that will just go away by wishful thinking or by being ignored.
- runarberg 6y ago
  Nobody is saying that. However currently the Chinese ruling class is getting away with this horror without any repercussions. International condemnation from world leaders might be enough to stop this horror, but so far we are not even seeing that from the international community. More realistically it would take a lot more then only condemnation. We would probably need to see sanctions against the Chinese ruling class and Chinese state owned businesses, and probably we would need to see the Chinese excluded from international cultural and sports events (such as the Olympics).
fsociety 6y ago
Passing these values to kids is valuable. Right now the US is at a turning point for its democracy and now is an important time to teach the values of human rights and democracy.

mkolodny 6y ago

What country's politicians have publicly opposed this?

cameronh90 6y ago
UK did earlier this year, and threatened sanctions. China called it fake news. Not much has happened since.
- spinny 6y ago
  Good thing that twitter pretends to be the arbiter of truth and fact check every world that comes out of a republican's mouth. meanwhile accusations from the ccp's minister of propaganda run rampant
Baeocystin 6y ago
Canada just did. https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/parliamentary-committee-uighur-genocide-1.5772757 https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/parliamentary-committee-uig...

peacefulhat 6y ago

The UN is not unified on the uighur camps, so it would have to be individual countries at the national level. The UN has voted on several resolutions regarding Chinese policy in Xinjiang. Many countries abstain from voting and of those that vote, more vote in support than vote to denounce.

WarOnPrivacy 6y ago
Was the UN ever unified against CIA torture policies? I don't recall. It may be that the UN is strongly reluctant to call out abominations by superpowers.
- seppin 6y ago
  Did the CIA operate concentration camps for millions of people? No, it ran guantanamo bay which had at it's peak 140 prisoners. My kingdom for a little perspective.
  - WarOnPrivacy 6y ago
    Inventing your own question and then answering that was an interesting thing to do.
    - stale2002 6y ago
      The point bring that your original comparison is a bad analogy. It should be obvious to you that something that effects millions of people is much worse than the CIA thing that only effected a couple hundred.
      - seppin 6y ago
        It should be obvious, but here we are.
      - WarOnPrivacy 6y ago
        I didn't make an analogy. I asked a straightforward question. I'm unclear why you or anyone else might be creating analogies in your heads. It's even less clear why you want me to have made them.

bigbubba 6y ago

How would the UN giving people asylum work? AFAIK the only territories administered by the UN are in Syria, Kosovo and Cyprus. I don't think they'd send asylum seekers there..

WarOnPrivacy 6y ago

> Pay your taxes so that your military can keep an eye on the jackwads who do this My taxes have frequently paid for US Gov led torture. If we ever hold China accountable in a meaningful way, it won't be due to authentic moral outrage.

hcurtiss 6y ago
Certainly nothing like this, and our practices in war have always stood out as more humane than the other side. People sometimes point to Afghanistan, but I don’t remember out guys beheading anyone.
- runarberg 6y ago
  This simply isn’t true. And even if it were, that is still no excuse. Terrible things happen in war. Innocent people die or get seriously scarred in war, often for decades to come after the war ends. Being “better then the opposing party” is no excuse and provides no comfort to the victims of war.
- tremon 6y ago
  our practices in war have always stood out as more humane than the other side Ok, then convince your side to submit to the UN-appointed war crimes tribunal in The Hague. As long as the The Hague Invasion Act is still in force, that claim is hollow.
  - hcurtiss 6y ago
    Just as soon as China does.
    - mxmilkb 6y ago
      Do you know what 'whataboutism' is?
    - WarOnPrivacy 6y ago
      On the other hand, there are many Americans who don't wait for China to lead their way.

csomar 6y ago

I think this comment is under-rated. The US has been doing real work when it comes to China like this: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-southchinasea-philippines-carter-idUSKCN0XB0QY https://www.reuters.com/article/us-southchinasea-philippines... where most of the world is just watching. The US certainly doesn't have a stellar Human Rights record in wars or other; but it's mostly because of incompetence and not as an agenda to keep one race only.

FpUser 6y ago
>"...but it's mostly because of incompetence and not as an agenda to keep one race only..." I am curious what would happen should you face those countless victims of "incompetence" and explain it to them.