14 ms·

iSH Shell

263 points by tech234a 6y ago

dizzy3gg 6y ago
how do i quit vi in this app? no jokes, seriously?
- saagarjha 6y ago
  ⇥ is tab ⌃ is control ⎋ is escape the arrow keys thing can be dragged to move the cursor around
- banana_giraffe 6y ago
  Ctrl-[ :q! Knowing Ctrl-[ for escape has saved me enough times.
snazz 6y ago
I am very surprised that Apple allowed this on the actual App Store (and not just TestFlight), but I'm also pleased! Hopefully it will be accessible to more people now.
- simonh 6y ago
  There are a number of command line shells available on iOS, right up to full blown programming environments in Python, Lua, C# and others. Pythonista is pretty mature, comes with a command line interpreter and you can get a very capable user created enhanced shell environment for it.
  - kstrauser 6y ago
    In the context of Python, don't forget Pyto! I use it lots for scripting tricky bits in the Shortcuts app in a real programming language. It has nice Shortcuts actions for "run this Python code" and "get the results of that code you ran earlier".
    - simonh 6y ago
      Pyto is really interesting, it's not as polished at Pythonista but I appreciate the very frequent updates. It's come a long way pretty quickly.
      - kstrauser 6y ago
        Same. It's way rougher around the edges than Pythonista is, but it's moving fast and adding nice support for new iOS features. For one example, from what I can tell x-callback-url is the only way to get stuff into Pythonista (and I haven't found a way to get stuff back out of it), but Pyto natively supports Shortcuts actions. There are lots of other things like that. Pythonista is much more pleasant today for actually writing code in, though.
- Macha 6y ago
  The fact that uname -a reports "Linux" and not iOS or BSD implies it's not some sort of contained userland, it likely has no access to anything outside it's sandbox, and can't run GUI apps means Apple are unlikely to care too much.
  - saagarjha 6y ago
    uname reports what we tell it to report ;) https://github.com/ish-app/ish/blob/master/kernel/uname.c https://github.com/ish-app/ish/blob/master/kernel/uname.c. iSH is sandboxed as any other app on the store would be, but some have had success running GUI apps and connecting to them via VNC.
    - yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
      > strcpy(uts->release, "4.20.69-ish"); Nice:) got a chuckle out of me...
- woadwarrior01 6y ago
  A similar app, a-Shell[1] has been up on the App Store for a almost a year now. [1]: https://holzschu.github.io/a-Shell_iOS/ https://holzschu.github.io/a-Shell_iOS/
  - coder543 6y ago
    What’s the comparison between a-Shell and iSH? I’ve somehow never heard of the former, but I have repeatedly heard about the latter and used it.
    - least 6y ago
      a-Shell doesn't try to run a full linux environment; it just gives you access to a lot of common utilities, which presumably was an easier sell to get on the app store. The fact that iSH Shell allows you to download and run arbitrary code from alpine's repos is what made many think that it'd never leave TestFlight.
  - quaa55 6y ago
    a-shell uses ios_system https://github.com/holzschu/ios_system/ https://github.com/holzschu/ios_system/ and can install WASM packages (if they exist?) iSH emulates 32-bit alpine x86 and can install things from apk
- waterhouse 6y ago
  "A project to get a Linux shell running on iOS, using usermode x86 emulation and syscall translation." https://github.com/ish-app/ish/ https://github.com/ish-app/ish/ So theoretically it could be like an isolated computer game and have no access to anything from the underlying iOS environment. (Maybe it does let you access iOS's filesystem—it's not clear to me at a first glance.) I have the jaded feeling that this has to do with how it got approved. https://github.com/ish-app/ish/wiki/Mounting-other-file-providers https://github.com/ish-app/ish/wiki/Mounting-other-file-prov... says: "Additionally, if jailbroken or using the psychic paper exploit (not available through TestFlight nor will we help you do it), you can also mount using real, absolute paths. To do so run "mount -t real <src> <dst>", where <src> is the absolute path from the root of iOS and <dst> is the location in iSH to mount the file." Which suggests that you can only touch the underlying iOS if you've done an exploit.
  - saagarjha 6y ago
    As mentioned on that page, you can essentially mount whatever shows up in the Files app, but you don't have full filesystem access–iSH is a normal App Store app and is sandboxed as such.
  - kelnos 6y ago
    Interesting, I wonder why they used x86 emulation and didn't just run ARM binaries on it.
    - Zee2 6y ago
      That, amusingly, would probably not be allowed on the App Store.
    - als0 6y ago
      I thought running any kind of loadable code or JIT on the App Store was banned. I'm very glad to have this app.
- chadlavi 6y ago
  Amen
chrisweekly 6y ago
Cool! Installed it and played around a bit; everything worked as it should. Here's hoping it sticks around!
tomalpha 6y ago
> Location This app may use your location even when it isn't open, which can decrease battery life. I love the idea of a shell on iOS but why does it need to know my location?
- terrorbilly 6y ago
  https://github.com/ish-app/ish/issues/249 https://github.com/ish-app/ish/issues/249 This seems like a workaround so that the app can continue running in the background.
  - tomalpha 6y ago
    That's a much better reason than I feared. Thank you.
    - saagarjha 6y ago
      Your location doesn't leave the device, if that's what you were wondering. And the GPS doesn't turn on until you access /dev/location–actually, you won't even get a prompt until then. It is very much possible to use iSH without using the location file.
  - drchiu 6y ago
    Termius and several other SSH apps use this workaround as well.
borishn 6y ago
They will shut it down as soon as someone implements apt-get like feature.
- ZekeSulastin 6y ago
  It actually did in TestFlight, but they removed `apk` from the included filesystem as part of the app review process. It's pretty easy to go onto Alpine's website and get a different filesystem to import, though ...
  - tl 6y ago
    Apple's restrictions resulted in a pretty severe reduction in functionality of the app. Many of their how-tos still contain apk commands which no longer function. For example: https://github.com/ish-app/ish/wiki/Running-a-Python-Web-Server https://github.com/ish-app/ish/wiki/Running-a-Python-Web-Ser....
  - Poiesis 6y ago
    apk works for me, but maybe it's because I had the old ("tester removed") TestFlight version hanging around?
  - gouggoug 6y ago
    For people like me unfamiliar with this. Simply go to the [0]download page, look for "mini root filesystem" and download x86, or simply click this [1]link Upload this to your iPhone. Then in the iSH settings find the "filesystems" section and click "import". [0]: https://alpinelinux.org/downloads/ https://alpinelinux.org/downloads/ [1]: http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/v3.12/releases/x86/alpine-minirootfs-3.12.1-x86.tar.gz http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/v3.12/releases/x86/alpi...
sgt 6y ago
I installed it but apk doesn't work as a command.
- snazz 6y ago
  Go to the Alpine Linux downloads page, get the mini root FS image, and boot from that instead of the default filesystem.
- saagarjha 6y ago
  The version of iSH on the App Store has had package management functionality removed. The ability to run Linux programs, as well as import files, has not been changed.
connor-brooks 6y ago
Really happy to see Apple has finally allowed this on the App Store!
- swiley 6y ago
  They really have to. Android wasn't a serious competitor with the iphone but the phones running Linux are pretty rapidly improving. At this point they're actually usable and since the users themselves are able to fix core problems with the OS it won't be long before Apple will be forced by the market to actually behave.
varbhat 6y ago
> using a usermode x86 emulator So, iSH does this amazing stuff by x86 emulation. Aren't iOS devices arm based devices ? Why should they emulate x86 ? Isn't it easier to emulate arm64 linux instead ? (I mean that arm64 binaries can run on arm64 devices. For example, consider wine which runs windows programs on linux/macos. Only x64 windows apps can run on x64 wine and only arm64 windows apps can run on arm64 devices. To run x64 windows apps on arm64 devices,you need qemu/other virtualization software)
- saagarjha 6y ago
  Executing unsigned code on iOS is generally not feasible, which means that this would limit the set of programs you could run to a small prespecified (and signed) set of programs. (These apps exist already on the App Store; here's one: https://blink.sh https://blink.sh). iSH can run user-created programs by emulating them. (Plus, with emulation we can run programs without modifying them because we can trap syscalls and such.) It would be nice if we could JIT compile code (since the interpreter is a bit slow compared to native code) or utilize hypervisor facilities, but that doesn't appear to be an option for now.
- comex 6y ago
  The App Store doesn’t allow dynamically generated code to be marked executable (i.e. JIT compilation), so you’re stuck using a pure interpreter, at which point there’s no real benefit to emulating the same architecture you’re running on.
  - saagarjha 6y ago
    There may be with regards to maintaining memory ordering guarantees, we're looking into a couple of strange hangs that only reproduce on ARM. But yes, in general the choice of architecture does not matter much when interpreting.
    - FullyFunctional 6y ago
      Not quite true; some ISA are simpler to decode than other and/or have simpler semantics to implement (eg. not x87). I can pretty much guarantee that you could have gotten [slightly] better performance with an iSH-like approach targeting RISC-V or ARM64. EDIT: added slightly. For all the OS calls which are 100% native, it wouldn’t matter.
samatman 6y ago
oh lovely, I played around with the TestFlight, will definitely add this. Now it's time to complain: The search string "ish" (just like that) on the App Store doesn't even turn iSH up, at all. It might have been somewhere after the first ten results, I guess. App Store search is the absolute worst, and regularly turns up garbage ripoff apps that Apple should never have allowed on the store in the first place. It's the worst part of the ecosystem, and I despair of them ever doing something about it. You'd think a company with a few hundred billion dollars of cash just sitting around could handle something like this...
- saagarjha 6y ago
  App Store search sucks, but I should note that the app has only been live for about 12 hours and it takes a while for this to propagate through the system. Perhaps we'll see this change as iSH becomes popular and the backend updates its rankings. (FWIW, "iSH shell" returns relevant results.)
  - samatman 6y ago
    That's fair. If this wasn't a case of something which routinely happens to me, I wouldn't have said anything. I wouldn't be surprised if iSH becomes the top result for that search string. But I wouldn't be surprised if it's number 2, after some obvious ripoff, either.
makkaky 6y ago
iSH is brilliant and with addition of custom environments it's even better!
varbhat 6y ago
Those who are on Android , can use https://termux.com/ https://termux.com/ .
- nultxt 6y ago
  Termux is great, i second this recommendation
  - dheera 6y ago
    Looks fantastic but it seems pretty limited. Checked it out but "pkg install openssh" results in an error ... is it being maintained, or is just today an unlikely day?
    - varbhat 6y ago
      I think that the problem is from your end . I tried installing it and ended up installing without any problem.
albertop 6y ago
Why the shell app needs to use the location services? The App Store description indicates that “This app may use your location even when the app is not open”
- kingnight 6y ago
  It is likely the only way to stay active as much as possible in the background so the process doesn't get killed.
  - nolok 6y ago
    Apple doesn't allow the user to set an app as "don't kill even if not focused for a while" ? Android user here On Android it's not automatic or automated and the user has to do it by hand himself (for obvious reasons); but for a few specific apps it allows them to work the way they should without needing weird permissions to emulate
    - 20after4 6y ago
      Unfortunately, there is no way to do that on ios as far as I know.
      - scarface74 6y ago
        Well technically there is. It may run afoul of Apple’s guidelines. An app can play a silent sound in the background.
    - wlesieutre 6y ago
      On Android it varies a lot by manufacturer, you can find some comparisons, detailed information, and instructions to circumvent when possible here: https://dontkillmyapp.com/ https://dontkillmyapp.com/ > UPDATE: We record significantly increased number of app killing on Samsung's Android Pie flavor. The hints show adaptive battery being much more eager than in stock Android. > After 3 days any unused app will not be able to start from background (e.g. alarms will not work anymore). Imagine, you won't use your alarm clock for a the weekend +1 day and bang! no alarms any more and you miss work! We strongly suggest to turn off Adaptive battery and Put apps to sleep options per instructions below.
evantahler 6y ago
I’ve been a beta user for a while, and it’s been awesome - I’ve been hosting node.js sites on my phone! But... the version that made it into the App Store had ‘apk’ removed.... it’s going to be harder now to install stuff
- pletnes 6y ago
  As long as you can curl | bash ..! I guess you might be able to bootstrap homebrew, nix or something like that?
- banana_giraffe 6y ago
  Just in case you haven't seen it, you can follow my comment to bootstrap apk. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24862764 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24862764
- wildrhythms 6y ago
  Do you know if it’s possible to install node? I’m eager to try this out on my ipad :)
  - evantahler 6y ago
    Yeah! Follow the steps above to install `apk` and then `apk add node`
frou_dh 6y ago
Can any iSH aficionado provide a step-by-step on how to augment this release version of the app with an additional binary executable? For example the nano text editor. EDIT: Managed it like this: 1. Download this file and put it on iCloud Drive: http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/v3.12/releases/x86/alpine-minirootfs-3.12.1-x86.tar.gz http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/v3.12/releases/x86/alpi... 2. Back in the app, tap the Cog icon above the keyboard > Filesystems > Import > select that file. 3. (The app crashed?) Start the app again and go back to the Cog > Filesystems > alpine-minirootfs-.... > Boot from This Filesystem 4. $ apk add nano 5. $ nano EDIT2: And now git installs fine too. Gonna have some fun with this!
- glhaynes 6y ago
  iSH also acts as a File Provider so you can go to the Files app, tap “...” > “Edit Sidebar” and turn on “iSH” to “mount” your iSH filesystem and drag stuff in and out of it.
  - fprog 6y ago
    Thank you for sharing this. I just dragged a download from Safari into the file system via the Files app. What a clever feature.
- paultopia 6y ago
  !!!! I need to go see if I can have Vim on my iPad now...
  - banana_giraffe 6y ago
    You can, I've got git, vim, and python on my iPad now. It's by no means perfect .. python is really slow .. but it works for my basic workflow for smaller projects.
    - paultopia 6y ago
      This is actually really great for me. I have functioning vim and emacs on my desktop, but I don't know anything about .vimrc and use spacemacs... but now I have a platform I can safely experiment on without blowing anything up! Sweet!
tech234a 6y ago
The original title for this post was “iSH Shell Launches on the App Store” which is significant since the project had previously spent several years on TestFlight.
- dang 6y ago
  Since the domain is apps.apple.com, that part is implied. (From the HN guidelines: "If the title includes the name of the site, please take it out, because the site name will be displayed after the link.") The bit about TestFlight is certainly interesting but the best way to communicate it is not via the title but via a comment in the thread...like you just did!
banana_giraffe 6y ago
For those that just want to play: cd wget http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/latest-stable/main/x86/apk-tools-static-2.10.5-r1.apk cd / tar xvzf ~/apk-tools-static-2.10.5-r1.apk ln -s /sbin/apk.static /sbin/apk cd apk
- datfrojo 6y ago
  What are you trying to achieve here? What’s wrong with apk 2.10.4 that ships with iSH?
  - banana_giraffe 6y ago
    The version in the app store linked here does not ship with a binary of apk.
    - datfrojo 6y ago
      Ahhhh I installed the version from the App Store and it just kept the app data from the version installed via Xcode. Didn’t realise that the App Store version was missing apk
- userbinator 6y ago
  It took me longer than it should to realise that you weren't referring to an Android version.
- teruakohatu 6y ago
  Thank you very much. Copy n pasting that, followed by # apk add R And I finally have R on my iPad!
- mdolahBI 6y ago
  Just tried this but it seems to have failed on the `wget` command iPhone:~# wget http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/latest-stable/main/x86/apk-tools-static-2.10.5-r1.apk wget: bad address 'dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org'
walterbell 6y ago
Would this enable CLI rsync against iOS Files?
- banana_giraffe 6y ago
  Yes. Kinda. I mean, if it shows up in the Files app, you can mount it and run normal things against that folder. The thing I want to see, though, is a folder for the photos app. That doesn't exist, since the Photos app doesn't expose it's data as a folder.
- swiley 6y ago
  Your crontab won't run though so you'll always have to trigger it manually. Because it's the iphone and periodic background tasks are always malware.
thecybernerd 6y ago
Can I use a console cable with this and my iPad Pro?!
mattkevan 6y ago
Amazing that iSH has been allowed on the App Store. Never thought that day would come. Maybe this, or similar methods, is how Apple begins to enable development on iOS, through full app-based systems that are completely isolated from the underlying OS. Now they just need to allow UTM in the App Store.
- striking 6y ago
  UTM no longer works on iOS 14 without a jailbreak. It used shenanigans[0] to cause the process to be entitled to JIT, and the shenanigans no longer work. 0: https://github.com/utmapp/UTM/blob/1feb721a9474255bd112f9e42bcfd8f623b59822/Platform/UTMJailbreak.m#L182-L189 https://github.com/utmapp/UTM/blob/1feb721a9474255bd112f9e42...
  - saagarjha 6y ago
    There are reports that this has started working again in some developer betas. Still, it's not something that could go on the App Store.
    - davv 6y ago
      Interesting. I’m going to have to try this. This GitHub issue has more info: https://github.com/utmapp/UTM/issues/397 https://github.com/utmapp/UTM/issues/397
      - saagarjha 6y ago
        You may find the reporter of that issue amusing.
anuila 6y ago
An iOS app under 4MB, what is this witchcraft?
trashburger 6y ago
Wait... the repository states that the source code is under the GPLv3. Doesn't the App Store disallow apps that are under the GPL, or is that a myth?
- spicybright 6y ago
  I'm curious about that as well...
- saagarjha 6y ago
  iSH is distributed under a custom EULA rather than Apple's standard Licensed Application End User License Agreement: > The iSH app ("iSH") is made available to you by the developers of the application (collectively, the "iSH developers") under the terms available at https://github.com/ish-app/ish/blob/master/LICENSE.md https://github.com/ish-app/ish/blob/master/LICENSE.md (the "License"). These license terms are an agreement (the "Agreement") between you and the iSH developers, not Apple, which disclaims responsibility of the licensed application and its contents thereof, and replaces the terms of the standard Licensed Application End User License Agreement available at https://www.apple.com/legal/internet-services/itunes/dev/stdeula/ https://www.apple.com/legal/internet-services/itunes/dev/std.... The iSH developers own the intellectual property of iSH and provide it to you under the License without warranty to the fullest extent permitted by law. Apple and Apple's subsidiaries are not legally liable for product claims, including claims for maintenance and support, but may at their discretion choose to enforce this agreement against you as third party beneficiaries of iSH. In cases where certain provisions laid out in this Agreement are in conflict with local laws and cannot go into effect, the remaining provisions will continue to apply in full force. Questions or any other requests about this Agreement may be directed at Theodore Dubois, available at tbodt@ish.app.
  - swiley 6y ago
    So is it actually possible to put GPL code on the app store then?
    - saagarjha 6y ago
johnghanks 6y ago
???
dfabulich 6y ago
From the Github page: > Unfortunately, I made the decision to write nearly all of the gadgets in assembly language. This was probably a good decision with regards to performance (though I'll never know for sure), but a horrible decision with regards to readability, maintainability, and my sanity. The amount of bullshit I've had to put up with from the compiler/assembler/linker is insane. It's like there's a demon in there that makes sure my code is sufficiently deformed, and if not, makes up stupid reasons why it shouldn't compile. In order to stay sane while writing this code, I've had to ignore best practices in code structure and naming. You'll find macros and variables with such descriptive names as ss and s and a. Assembler macros nested beyond belief. And to top it off, there are almost no comments. > So a warning: Long-term exposure to this code may cause loss of sanity, nightmares about GAS macros and linker errors, or any number of other debilitating side effects. This code is known to the State of California to cause cancer, birth defects, and reproductive harm. M…maybe I'll hold off on that PR.
- Waterluvian 6y ago
  Does this mean some person at Apple had to review the app... In assembly?
  - snazz 6y ago
    I don't think that Apple usually reads an app's code as part of their review process. They might check out certain parts to see how pieces are implemented, but that's about it, as far as I understand.
  - rhinoceraptor 6y ago
    For any app, you give apple effectively a binary (really it's a sort of IR), not the source code.
  - djxfade 6y ago
    No, Apple don't have access to your sources, only the compiled binaries / ir, and symbols
- userbinator 6y ago
ogre_codes 6y ago
Whoa, I was wondering if this would ever come out beta. So cool.
RRRA 6y ago
Good old 17+ shells? :P What's wrong with Apple and self imposed censorship?
- banana_giraffe 6y ago
  Pretty much anything that can pull down random URLs gets that, and this comes with curl and wget. There's logic in the madness. Barely.
- csande17 6y ago
  Might as well have called it xxxterm.
rcarmo 6y ago
I’ve been using this to play with Janet and other LISPs for a while. Great to see it finally on the App Store, although I do wish it was running native ARM binaries for a little more speed :)
- terminalcommand 6y ago
  I’ve been trying to learn Janet for a couple of days. Janet is a Lisp-like language but in no way a lisp. Janet’s site now delibarely states that Janet is a Lisp-like language not a Lisp. Janet can be parsed using a PEG parser, so I think that causes it to lose some expressivity of Lisp. Janet is a cool language though, I like it. I wish there was a decent tutorial instead of just language reference docs. And the Core API documentation is a bit poor in my opinion. I’m trying to submit examples to Core API documentation, I’m hopeful it will get better in time.
siraben 6y ago
I've been using iSH for more than 2 years now, and I'm glad to see that it's made it to the app store. Here are some good use cases I've used iSH for: - youtube-dl videos to Files app - SSH into remote servers - performing network pings or scans discretely There's even a device at /dev/location which when catted can keep the app active in the background, due to background app refresh. The only real issue I've had (especially with Python programs) is that it runs orders of magnitude slower than native.
- anuila 6y ago
  How did you get YouTube-dl? That was the second thing I tried but I get SSL issues with both wget and curl. I also tried installing some npm packages but ran into permission issues.
  - Siira 6y ago
    You can disable SSL checks, though I don't think I had them. Youtube-dl is very slow though, you're better off using a Telegram bot to give you the videos. The app also can't run for long in the background, which is essential for downloading.
  - siraben 6y ago
    Curiously at some point I also had SSL errors with youtube-dl, I installed mine via pip3, and I think updating it fixed the problem. Re: permission errors, might be due to the fact that you are root by default and should add a new non-root user (via useradd).
- jeromenerf 6y ago
  I want to use it, but it’s too slow and non root users face all kind of weird permission errors I can’t find a workaround for, with go get for instance. I use git or ssh clients as an alternative. Some commands seem to hang forever, until the app is killed ‘ reset. My experience with termux on an old nexus 7 was much better than iSH on a 2017 iPad Pro.
  - siraben 6y ago
qzio 6y ago
This is awesome, but nmap doesn't seem to work, or am I doing it wrong? downloaded apk-tools-static and installed apk using that, and then nmap.
tomduncalf 6y ago
Could this be used to e.g. run a local http server which you can then access from Safari? (Thinking web development workflows). I tried running http-server from npm but it failed with an "Unknown error 22" so I guess maybe the sandbox prevents this
- saagarjha 6y ago
  Yes, local web servers should work (Python certainly does, I just checked on my iPhone). Can you file a bug at https://github.com/ish-app/ish/issues https://github.com/ish-app/ish/issues with more details?
  - tomduncalf 6y ago
    Oh wow, it does! Super cool. This is potentially massive for doing work on the go on an iPad! I'll look more into my issue and will file on Github :) Thanks
aeivy 6y ago
Can anyone help me? I have a problem with -ash: permission denied whenever I attempt to type in something that requires this clearance. I even asked the dev on GitHub but to no avail
miga 6y ago
Why does it need unrestricted location access?

iSH Shell

263 points by tech234a 6y ago

dizzy3gg 6y ago

how do i quit vi in this app? no jokes, seriously?

saagarjha 6y ago
⇥ is tab ⌃ is control ⎋ is escape the arrow keys thing can be dragged to move the cursor around
banana_giraffe 6y ago
Ctrl-[ :q! Knowing Ctrl-[ for escape has saved me enough times.

snazz 6y ago

I am very surprised that Apple allowed this on the actual App Store (and not just TestFlight), but I'm also pleased! Hopefully it will be accessible to more people now.

simonh 6y ago
There are a number of command line shells available on iOS, right up to full blown programming environments in Python, Lua, C# and others. Pythonista is pretty mature, comes with a command line interpreter and you can get a very capable user created enhanced shell environment for it.
- kstrauser 6y ago
  In the context of Python, don't forget Pyto! I use it lots for scripting tricky bits in the Shortcuts app in a real programming language. It has nice Shortcuts actions for "run this Python code" and "get the results of that code you ran earlier".
  - simonh 6y ago
    Pyto is really interesting, it's not as polished at Pythonista but I appreciate the very frequent updates. It's come a long way pretty quickly.
    - kstrauser 6y ago
      Same. It's way rougher around the edges than Pythonista is, but it's moving fast and adding nice support for new iOS features. For one example, from what I can tell x-callback-url is the only way to get stuff into Pythonista (and I haven't found a way to get stuff back out of it), but Pyto natively supports Shortcuts actions. There are lots of other things like that. Pythonista is much more pleasant today for actually writing code in, though.
Macha 6y ago
The fact that uname -a reports "Linux" and not iOS or BSD implies it's not some sort of contained userland, it likely has no access to anything outside it's sandbox, and can't run GUI apps means Apple are unlikely to care too much.
- saagarjha 6y ago
  uname reports what we tell it to report ;) https://github.com/ish-app/ish/blob/master/kernel/uname.c https://github.com/ish-app/ish/blob/master/kernel/uname.c. iSH is sandboxed as any other app on the store would be, but some have had success running GUI apps and connecting to them via VNC.
  - yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
    > strcpy(uts->release, "4.20.69-ish"); Nice:) got a chuckle out of me...
woadwarrior01 6y ago
A similar app, a-Shell[1] has been up on the App Store for a almost a year now. [1]: https://holzschu.github.io/a-Shell_iOS/ https://holzschu.github.io/a-Shell_iOS/
- coder543 6y ago
  What’s the comparison between a-Shell and iSH? I’ve somehow never heard of the former, but I have repeatedly heard about the latter and used it.
  - least 6y ago
    a-Shell doesn't try to run a full linux environment; it just gives you access to a lot of common utilities, which presumably was an easier sell to get on the app store. The fact that iSH Shell allows you to download and run arbitrary code from alpine's repos is what made many think that it'd never leave TestFlight.
- quaa55 6y ago
  a-shell uses ios_system https://github.com/holzschu/ios_system/ https://github.com/holzschu/ios_system/ and can install WASM packages (if they exist?) iSH emulates 32-bit alpine x86 and can install things from apk
waterhouse 6y ago
"A project to get a Linux shell running on iOS, using usermode x86 emulation and syscall translation." https://github.com/ish-app/ish/ https://github.com/ish-app/ish/ So theoretically it could be like an isolated computer game and have no access to anything from the underlying iOS environment. (Maybe it does let you access iOS's filesystem—it's not clear to me at a first glance.) I have the jaded feeling that this has to do with how it got approved. https://github.com/ish-app/ish/wiki/Mounting-other-file-providers https://github.com/ish-app/ish/wiki/Mounting-other-file-prov... says: "Additionally, if jailbroken or using the psychic paper exploit (not available through TestFlight nor will we help you do it), you can also mount using real, absolute paths. To do so run "mount -t real <src> <dst>", where <src> is the absolute path from the root of iOS and <dst> is the location in iSH to mount the file." Which suggests that you can only touch the underlying iOS if you've done an exploit.
- saagarjha 6y ago
  As mentioned on that page, you can essentially mount whatever shows up in the Files app, but you don't have full filesystem access–iSH is a normal App Store app and is sandboxed as such.
- kelnos 6y ago
  Interesting, I wonder why they used x86 emulation and didn't just run ARM binaries on it.
  - Zee2 6y ago
    That, amusingly, would probably not be allowed on the App Store.
  - als0 6y ago
    I thought running any kind of loadable code or JIT on the App Store was banned. I'm very glad to have this app.
chadlavi 6y ago
Amen

chrisweekly 6y ago

Cool! Installed it and played around a bit; everything worked as it should. Here's hoping it sticks around!

tomalpha 6y ago

> Location This app may use your location even when it isn't open, which can decrease battery life. I love the idea of a shell on iOS but why does it need to know my location?

terrorbilly 6y ago
https://github.com/ish-app/ish/issues/249 https://github.com/ish-app/ish/issues/249 This seems like a workaround so that the app can continue running in the background.
- tomalpha 6y ago
  That's a much better reason than I feared. Thank you.
  - saagarjha 6y ago
    Your location doesn't leave the device, if that's what you were wondering. And the GPS doesn't turn on until you access /dev/location–actually, you won't even get a prompt until then. It is very much possible to use iSH without using the location file.
- drchiu 6y ago
  Termius and several other SSH apps use this workaround as well.

borishn 6y ago

They will shut it down as soon as someone implements apt-get like feature.

ZekeSulastin 6y ago
It actually did in TestFlight, but they removed `apk` from the included filesystem as part of the app review process. It's pretty easy to go onto Alpine's website and get a different filesystem to import, though ...
- tl 6y ago
  Apple's restrictions resulted in a pretty severe reduction in functionality of the app. Many of their how-tos still contain apk commands which no longer function. For example: https://github.com/ish-app/ish/wiki/Running-a-Python-Web-Server https://github.com/ish-app/ish/wiki/Running-a-Python-Web-Ser....
- Poiesis 6y ago
  apk works for me, but maybe it's because I had the old ("tester removed") TestFlight version hanging around?
- gouggoug 6y ago
  For people like me unfamiliar with this. Simply go to the [0]download page, look for "mini root filesystem" and download x86, or simply click this [1]link Upload this to your iPhone. Then in the iSH settings find the "filesystems" section and click "import". [0]: https://alpinelinux.org/downloads/ https://alpinelinux.org/downloads/ [1]: http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/v3.12/releases/x86/alpine-minirootfs-3.12.1-x86.tar.gz http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/v3.12/releases/x86/alpi...

sgt 6y ago

I installed it but apk doesn't work as a command.

snazz 6y ago
Go to the Alpine Linux downloads page, get the mini root FS image, and boot from that instead of the default filesystem.
saagarjha 6y ago
The version of iSH on the App Store has had package management functionality removed. The ability to run Linux programs, as well as import files, has not been changed.

connor-brooks 6y ago

Really happy to see Apple has finally allowed this on the App Store!

swiley 6y ago
They really have to. Android wasn't a serious competitor with the iphone but the phones running Linux are pretty rapidly improving. At this point they're actually usable and since the users themselves are able to fix core problems with the OS it won't be long before Apple will be forced by the market to actually behave.

varbhat 6y ago

> using a usermode x86 emulator So, iSH does this amazing stuff by x86 emulation. Aren't iOS devices arm based devices ? Why should they emulate x86 ? Isn't it easier to emulate arm64 linux instead ? (I mean that arm64 binaries can run on arm64 devices. For example, consider wine which runs windows programs on linux/macos. Only x64 windows apps can run on x64 wine and only arm64 windows apps can run on arm64 devices. To run x64 windows apps on arm64 devices,you need qemu/other virtualization software)

saagarjha 6y ago
Executing unsigned code on iOS is generally not feasible, which means that this would limit the set of programs you could run to a small prespecified (and signed) set of programs. (These apps exist already on the App Store; here's one: https://blink.sh https://blink.sh). iSH can run user-created programs by emulating them. (Plus, with emulation we can run programs without modifying them because we can trap syscalls and such.) It would be nice if we could JIT compile code (since the interpreter is a bit slow compared to native code) or utilize hypervisor facilities, but that doesn't appear to be an option for now.
comex 6y ago
The App Store doesn’t allow dynamically generated code to be marked executable (i.e. JIT compilation), so you’re stuck using a pure interpreter, at which point there’s no real benefit to emulating the same architecture you’re running on.
- saagarjha 6y ago
  There may be with regards to maintaining memory ordering guarantees, we're looking into a couple of strange hangs that only reproduce on ARM. But yes, in general the choice of architecture does not matter much when interpreting.
  - FullyFunctional 6y ago
    Not quite true; some ISA are simpler to decode than other and/or have simpler semantics to implement (eg. not x87). I can pretty much guarantee that you could have gotten [slightly] better performance with an iSH-like approach targeting RISC-V or ARM64. EDIT: added slightly. For all the OS calls which are 100% native, it wouldn’t matter.

samatman 6y ago

oh lovely, I played around with the TestFlight, will definitely add this. Now it's time to complain: The search string "ish" (just like that) on the App Store doesn't even turn iSH up, at all. It might have been somewhere after the first ten results, I guess. App Store search is the absolute worst, and regularly turns up garbage ripoff apps that Apple should never have allowed on the store in the first place. It's the worst part of the ecosystem, and I despair of them ever doing something about it. You'd think a company with a few hundred billion dollars of cash just sitting around could handle something like this...

saagarjha 6y ago
App Store search sucks, but I should note that the app has only been live for about 12 hours and it takes a while for this to propagate through the system. Perhaps we'll see this change as iSH becomes popular and the backend updates its rankings. (FWIW, "iSH shell" returns relevant results.)
- samatman 6y ago
  That's fair. If this wasn't a case of something which routinely happens to me, I wouldn't have said anything. I wouldn't be surprised if iSH becomes the top result for that search string. But I wouldn't be surprised if it's number 2, after some obvious ripoff, either.

makkaky 6y ago

iSH is brilliant and with addition of custom environments it's even better!

varbhat 6y ago

Those who are on Android , can use https://termux.com/ https://termux.com/ .

nultxt 6y ago
Termux is great, i second this recommendation
- dheera 6y ago
  Looks fantastic but it seems pretty limited. Checked it out but "pkg install openssh" results in an error ... is it being maintained, or is just today an unlikely day?
  - varbhat 6y ago
    I think that the problem is from your end . I tried installing it and ended up installing without any problem.

albertop 6y ago

Why the shell app needs to use the location services? The App Store description indicates that “This app may use your location even when the app is not open”

kingnight 6y ago
It is likely the only way to stay active as much as possible in the background so the process doesn't get killed.
- nolok 6y ago
  Apple doesn't allow the user to set an app as "don't kill even if not focused for a while" ? Android user here On Android it's not automatic or automated and the user has to do it by hand himself (for obvious reasons); but for a few specific apps it allows them to work the way they should without needing weird permissions to emulate
  - 20after4 6y ago
    Unfortunately, there is no way to do that on ios as far as I know.
    - scarface74 6y ago
      Well technically there is. It may run afoul of Apple’s guidelines. An app can play a silent sound in the background.
  - wlesieutre 6y ago
    On Android it varies a lot by manufacturer, you can find some comparisons, detailed information, and instructions to circumvent when possible here: https://dontkillmyapp.com/ https://dontkillmyapp.com/ > UPDATE: We record significantly increased number of app killing on Samsung's Android Pie flavor. The hints show adaptive battery being much more eager than in stock Android. > After 3 days any unused app will not be able to start from background (e.g. alarms will not work anymore). Imagine, you won't use your alarm clock for a the weekend +1 day and bang! no alarms any more and you miss work! We strongly suggest to turn off Adaptive battery and Put apps to sleep options per instructions below.

evantahler 6y ago

I’ve been a beta user for a while, and it’s been awesome - I’ve been hosting node.js sites on my phone! But... the version that made it into the App Store had ‘apk’ removed.... it’s going to be harder now to install stuff

pletnes 6y ago
As long as you can curl | bash ..! I guess you might be able to bootstrap homebrew, nix or something like that?
banana_giraffe 6y ago
Just in case you haven't seen it, you can follow my comment to bootstrap apk. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24862764 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24862764
wildrhythms 6y ago
Do you know if it’s possible to install node? I’m eager to try this out on my ipad :)
- evantahler 6y ago
  Yeah! Follow the steps above to install `apk` and then `apk add node`

frou_dh 6y ago

Can any iSH aficionado provide a step-by-step on how to augment this release version of the app with an additional binary executable? For example the nano text editor. EDIT: Managed it like this: 1. Download this file and put it on iCloud Drive: http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/v3.12/releases/x86/alpine-minirootfs-3.12.1-x86.tar.gz http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/v3.12/releases/x86/alpi... 2. Back in the app, tap the Cog icon above the keyboard > Filesystems > Import > select that file. 3. (The app crashed?) Start the app again and go back to the Cog > Filesystems > alpine-minirootfs-.... > Boot from This Filesystem 4. $ apk add nano 5. $ nano EDIT2: And now git installs fine too. Gonna have some fun with this!

glhaynes 6y ago
iSH also acts as a File Provider so you can go to the Files app, tap “...” > “Edit Sidebar” and turn on “iSH” to “mount” your iSH filesystem and drag stuff in and out of it.
- fprog 6y ago
  Thank you for sharing this. I just dragged a download from Safari into the file system via the Files app. What a clever feature.
paultopia 6y ago
!!!! I need to go see if I can have Vim on my iPad now...
- banana_giraffe 6y ago
  You can, I've got git, vim, and python on my iPad now. It's by no means perfect .. python is really slow .. but it works for my basic workflow for smaller projects.
  - paultopia 6y ago
    This is actually really great for me. I have functioning vim and emacs on my desktop, but I don't know anything about .vimrc and use spacemacs... but now I have a platform I can safely experiment on without blowing anything up! Sweet!

tech234a 6y ago

The original title for this post was “iSH Shell Launches on the App Store” which is significant since the project had previously spent several years on TestFlight.

dang 6y ago
Since the domain is apps.apple.com, that part is implied. (From the HN guidelines: "If the title includes the name of the site, please take it out, because the site name will be displayed after the link.") The bit about TestFlight is certainly interesting but the best way to communicate it is not via the title but via a comment in the thread...like you just did!

banana_giraffe 6y ago

For those that just want to play: cd wget http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/latest-stable/main/x86/apk-tools-static-2.10.5-r1.apk cd / tar xvzf ~/apk-tools-static-2.10.5-r1.apk ln -s /sbin/apk.static /sbin/apk cd apk

datfrojo 6y ago
What are you trying to achieve here? What’s wrong with apk 2.10.4 that ships with iSH?
- banana_giraffe 6y ago
  The version in the app store linked here does not ship with a binary of apk.
  - datfrojo 6y ago
    Ahhhh I installed the version from the App Store and it just kept the app data from the version installed via Xcode. Didn’t realise that the App Store version was missing apk
userbinator 6y ago
It took me longer than it should to realise that you weren't referring to an Android version.
teruakohatu 6y ago
Thank you very much. Copy n pasting that, followed by # apk add R And I finally have R on my iPad!
mdolahBI 6y ago
Just tried this but it seems to have failed on the `wget` command iPhone:~# wget http://dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org/alpine/latest-stable/main/x86/apk-tools-static-2.10.5-r1.apk wget: bad address 'dl-cdn.alpinelinux.org'

walterbell 6y ago

Would this enable CLI rsync against iOS Files?

banana_giraffe 6y ago
Yes. Kinda. I mean, if it shows up in the Files app, you can mount it and run normal things against that folder. The thing I want to see, though, is a folder for the photos app. That doesn't exist, since the Photos app doesn't expose it's data as a folder.
swiley 6y ago
Your crontab won't run though so you'll always have to trigger it manually. Because it's the iphone and periodic background tasks are always malware.

thecybernerd 6y ago

Can I use a console cable with this and my iPad Pro?!

mattkevan 6y ago

Amazing that iSH has been allowed on the App Store. Never thought that day would come. Maybe this, or similar methods, is how Apple begins to enable development on iOS, through full app-based systems that are completely isolated from the underlying OS. Now they just need to allow UTM in the App Store.

striking 6y ago
UTM no longer works on iOS 14 without a jailbreak. It used shenanigans[0] to cause the process to be entitled to JIT, and the shenanigans no longer work. 0: https://github.com/utmapp/UTM/blob/1feb721a9474255bd112f9e42bcfd8f623b59822/Platform/UTMJailbreak.m#L182-L189 https://github.com/utmapp/UTM/blob/1feb721a9474255bd112f9e42...
- saagarjha 6y ago
  There are reports that this has started working again in some developer betas. Still, it's not something that could go on the App Store.
  - davv 6y ago
    Interesting. I’m going to have to try this. This GitHub issue has more info: https://github.com/utmapp/UTM/issues/397 https://github.com/utmapp/UTM/issues/397
    - saagarjha 6y ago
      You may find the reporter of that issue amusing.

anuila 6y ago

An iOS app under 4MB, what is this witchcraft?

trashburger 6y ago

Wait... the repository states that the source code is under the GPLv3. Doesn't the App Store disallow apps that are under the GPL, or is that a myth?

spicybright 6y ago
I'm curious about that as well...
saagarjha 6y ago
iSH is distributed under a custom EULA rather than Apple's standard Licensed Application End User License Agreement: > The iSH app ("iSH") is made available to you by the developers of the application (collectively, the "iSH developers") under the terms available at https://github.com/ish-app/ish/blob/master/LICENSE.md https://github.com/ish-app/ish/blob/master/LICENSE.md (the "License"). These license terms are an agreement (the "Agreement") between you and the iSH developers, not Apple, which disclaims responsibility of the licensed application and its contents thereof, and replaces the terms of the standard Licensed Application End User License Agreement available at https://www.apple.com/legal/internet-services/itunes/dev/stdeula/ https://www.apple.com/legal/internet-services/itunes/dev/std.... The iSH developers own the intellectual property of iSH and provide it to you under the License without warranty to the fullest extent permitted by law. Apple and Apple's subsidiaries are not legally liable for product claims, including claims for maintenance and support, but may at their discretion choose to enforce this agreement against you as third party beneficiaries of iSH. In cases where certain provisions laid out in this Agreement are in conflict with local laws and cannot go into effect, the remaining provisions will continue to apply in full force. Questions or any other requests about this Agreement may be directed at Theodore Dubois, available at tbodt@ish.app.
- swiley 6y ago
  So is it actually possible to put GPL code on the app store then?
  - saagarjha 6y ago

johnghanks 6y ago

???

dfabulich 6y ago

From the Github page: > Unfortunately, I made the decision to write nearly all of the gadgets in assembly language. This was probably a good decision with regards to performance (though I'll never know for sure), but a horrible decision with regards to readability, maintainability, and my sanity. The amount of bullshit I've had to put up with from the compiler/assembler/linker is insane. It's like there's a demon in there that makes sure my code is sufficiently deformed, and if not, makes up stupid reasons why it shouldn't compile. In order to stay sane while writing this code, I've had to ignore best practices in code structure and naming. You'll find macros and variables with such descriptive names as ss and s and a. Assembler macros nested beyond belief. And to top it off, there are almost no comments. > So a warning: Long-term exposure to this code may cause loss of sanity, nightmares about GAS macros and linker errors, or any number of other debilitating side effects. This code is known to the State of California to cause cancer, birth defects, and reproductive harm. M…maybe I'll hold off on that PR.

Waterluvian 6y ago
Does this mean some person at Apple had to review the app... In assembly?
- snazz 6y ago
  I don't think that Apple usually reads an app's code as part of their review process. They might check out certain parts to see how pieces are implemented, but that's about it, as far as I understand.
- rhinoceraptor 6y ago
  For any app, you give apple effectively a binary (really it's a sort of IR), not the source code.
- djxfade 6y ago
  No, Apple don't have access to your sources, only the compiled binaries / ir, and symbols
userbinator 6y ago

ogre_codes 6y ago

Whoa, I was wondering if this would ever come out beta. So cool.

RRRA 6y ago

Good old 17+ shells? :P What's wrong with Apple and self imposed censorship?

banana_giraffe 6y ago
Pretty much anything that can pull down random URLs gets that, and this comes with curl and wget. There's logic in the madness. Barely.
csande17 6y ago
Might as well have called it xxxterm.

rcarmo 6y ago

I’ve been using this to play with Janet and other LISPs for a while. Great to see it finally on the App Store, although I do wish it was running native ARM binaries for a little more speed :)

terminalcommand 6y ago
I’ve been trying to learn Janet for a couple of days. Janet is a Lisp-like language but in no way a lisp. Janet’s site now delibarely states that Janet is a Lisp-like language not a Lisp. Janet can be parsed using a PEG parser, so I think that causes it to lose some expressivity of Lisp. Janet is a cool language though, I like it. I wish there was a decent tutorial instead of just language reference docs. And the Core API documentation is a bit poor in my opinion. I’m trying to submit examples to Core API documentation, I’m hopeful it will get better in time.

siraben 6y ago

I've been using iSH for more than 2 years now, and I'm glad to see that it's made it to the app store. Here are some good use cases I've used iSH for: - youtube-dl videos to Files app - SSH into remote servers - performing network pings or scans discretely There's even a device at /dev/location which when catted can keep the app active in the background, due to background app refresh. The only real issue I've had (especially with Python programs) is that it runs orders of magnitude slower than native.

anuila 6y ago
How did you get YouTube-dl? That was the second thing I tried but I get SSL issues with both wget and curl. I also tried installing some npm packages but ran into permission issues.
- Siira 6y ago
  You can disable SSL checks, though I don't think I had them. Youtube-dl is very slow though, you're better off using a Telegram bot to give you the videos. The app also can't run for long in the background, which is essential for downloading.
- siraben 6y ago
  Curiously at some point I also had SSL errors with youtube-dl, I installed mine via pip3, and I think updating it fixed the problem. Re: permission errors, might be due to the fact that you are root by default and should add a new non-root user (via useradd).
jeromenerf 6y ago
I want to use it, but it’s too slow and non root users face all kind of weird permission errors I can’t find a workaround for, with go get for instance. I use git or ssh clients as an alternative. Some commands seem to hang forever, until the app is killed ‘ reset. My experience with termux on an old nexus 7 was much better than iSH on a 2017 iPad Pro.
- siraben 6y ago

qzio 6y ago

This is awesome, but nmap doesn't seem to work, or am I doing it wrong? downloaded apk-tools-static and installed apk using that, and then nmap.

tomduncalf 6y ago

Could this be used to e.g. run a local http server which you can then access from Safari? (Thinking web development workflows). I tried running http-server from npm but it failed with an "Unknown error 22" so I guess maybe the sandbox prevents this

saagarjha 6y ago
Yes, local web servers should work (Python certainly does, I just checked on my iPhone). Can you file a bug at https://github.com/ish-app/ish/issues https://github.com/ish-app/ish/issues with more details?
- tomduncalf 6y ago
  Oh wow, it does! Super cool. This is potentially massive for doing work on the go on an iPad! I'll look more into my issue and will file on Github :) Thanks

aeivy 6y ago

Can anyone help me? I have a problem with -ash: permission denied whenever I attempt to type in something that requires this clearance. I even asked the dev on GitHub but to no avail

miga 6y ago

Why does it need unrestricted location access?